[Megathread] Final Fantasy XIV

[Rogalicus]

Wouldn't this just show that ACT was running? Not necessarily that it was used on FFXIV? It is used for more than just FFXIV, according to the website, anyway.

If this is the case wouldn't this also detect pretty much any other program running alongside/ at the same time like your web browser, MS Word or whatever?

Even if what you're saying is true, it's not exactly incriminating. Or were you saying that FFXIV can specifically tell that ACT is being used to parse FFXIV information?

Yes, this could detect any program running, which is the purpose of any anti-cheat system. This wouldn't mean that just running it is bannable, but stuff like kicking people left and right would be much clearer if they detect you running ACT.

[Katchii]

Yes, this could detect any program running, which is the purpose of any anti-cheat system. This wouldn't mean that just running it is bannable, but stuff like kicking people left and right would be much clearer if they detect you running ACT.

Fair point, though that's still pretty circumstantial, but I wouldn't be surprised if that's enough to at least suspend someone.

[Greevir]

And I thought the WoW community was toxic.

[RohanV]

And I thought the WoW community was toxic.

In some respects this entire discussion stems from WoW. There is a significant contingent of ex-WoW players who blame the rise of "parser/meter culture" for contaminating that game, and they do not want to see the same thing happen to FFXIV. There is a another contingent of players who think meters had little to do with toxicity, and are a valuable tool in learning how to play better.

In some ways it's a case of picking your poison. Without meters, you'll occasionally get a failed run because people aren't playing well, and don't have any feedback that they aren't playing well. With meters, you'll sometimes get drama in a *successful* run, because one player decides that she's carrying the group, or that other people aren't good enough.

FFXIV's solution is the "don't ask, don't tell" policy around parsers. SWTOR parsing, you could only see your personal results, but everyone in an established group would connect to the same "channel" in the parser software, and upload their results, so you could see the entire group.

Even WoW's current community has mitigated the impact of parsing when warcraft logs introduced the color-parsing system, comparing your parse on a fight to all parses by someone of the same class and item level. I actually really like this solution, and I think it would be a great one for a game company to natively include as feedback.

[The Oblivion]

Fair point, though that's still pretty circumstantial, but I wouldn't be surprised if that's enough to at least suspend someone.

if it was enough 99% of the raid community would be banned. its not. SE cannot detect ACT

[Onikaroshi]

if it was enough 99% of the raid community would be banned. its not. SE cannot detect ACT

Apparently the program doesn't check for much, if anything, or all the big dick/boob nude mod people would be banned.

[Wrecktangle]

Speaking of dps, is there any way to sim my character or tell how much dps I should be doing?

For context, I'm a 370 BRD and I did 5k on Omega: Deltascape training dummy.

No way to really sim in this game. I can offer a small bit of insight though:

At 370 ilvl you'd be in Sigmascape. Looking at my logs on O7S (tank and spank) I did 4.6k as a tank (95th percentile). Now that's with party buffs and raid buffs/food/pots. Our Machinist did 5.6k and was at 58th percentile. He was likely around i370 as well.

Yes often cure2 spam + 2x holy stun (first w instant cast) + heal+ CDs is all you can do to keep your tank alive if he pulls big and doesn't have the gear for it. While it can give you an adrenaline rush, I agree that it isn't a cerebral challenge.

My FC mate (a high parsing WHM) hardly has to cast direct heals. With 2 average DPS, and Holy spam, the enemies in expert roulette are dead or near dead by time the near 10s of stun time wears off. An oGCD heal is all that's needed most of the pulls (and I am not max geared, I'm like i370?).

You can be the best gamer in the world and will get mediocre parses if your raid group drags the encounter out till the maximum enrage cheese.

This is true, in almost all cases. However, I do remember looking at some top PLD parses one time and remember seeing like a rank 30 parse (so 99th percentile) that was at enrage. Not only that, every other member was like sub 30th percentile. It really struck me as odd. I've always watched my brother get 99th-100 percentile parses in our casual as fuck heroic guild too (on the few mythic bosses we kill), because our encounters were longer he could get more execute stacks and outperform top mythic raiders (keep in mind he's an ex top raider as well).

Getting the perfect buff set-up is nice, but much more important than that is making sure you are lining up the cooldown windows you have for coordinated burst. We've brought a few people in to our raid nights recently to teach encounters and that is often the area overlooked even if they know their rotation and have awareness of mechanics. They will use offensive CDs/go into burst windows right as they come up, regardless if everyone else is ready or not.

Bingo.

And this is the point I am trying to make, it is against ToS, you can get banned for it, these are the facts.

This is the ONLY thing you've said that is "factually correct". You are a prime example of the type of FF14 player that I often cite as toxic. You spout nonsense in a mouth frothing manner that is objectively false. You've offered absolutely nothing positive to this discussion and done nothing but antagonize numerous posters and insult them.

Yes, this could detect any program running, which is the purpose of any anti-cheat system. This wouldn't mean that just running it is bannable, but stuff like kicking people left and right would be much clearer if they detect you running ACT.

I'm fairly confident that SE doesn't have anything capable in the existing package to do this, we'd know about it. They could add it in the future though. That said, they'd expose themselves to a lawsuit for banning people without clear definitive proof of that the players were kicking because of ACT. No dev would expose themselves to that risk. Simply having the program running would be circumstantial at best, and that's not enough to win a court case.

In some respects this entire discussion stems from WoW. There is a significant contingent of ex-WoW players who blame the rise of "parser/meter culture" for contaminating that game, and they do not want to see the same thing happen to FFXIV. There is a another contingent of players who think meters had little to do with toxicity, and are a valuable tool in learning how to play better.

The problem is there is a huge subset of players who are afraid of parsing culture unnecessarily. They don't understand it or have flat out inaccurate misconceptions of its use/value.

[Katchii]

if it was enough 99% of the raid community would be banned. its not. SE cannot detect ACT

This is why I am not really sold on the idea that they CAN, as many people try and say. If it were true, a large portion of the community that has it would be banned. Was just saying that if it were the case I wouldn't be surprised if circumstantial evidence were enough to take action against someone given SE's pretty heavy handed, and open ended/ vaguely worded rules.

- - - Updated - - -

The problem is there is a huge subset of players who are afraid of parsing culture unnecessarily. They don't understand it or have flat out inaccurate misconceptions of its use/value.

While this is likely true, I'd imagine many of them were exposed once or twice to the toxic kind of player who uses them who are rude and antagonistic towards people who don't measure up in one way or the other.

In a not so illogical leap, they correlate the tool used to antagonize them to the antagonism itself.

Let's not pretend there aren't assholes using meters/parsers in a not so wholesome and constructive manner. It's those kinds of people that soured the community, and these are the kinds of people SE/ Yoshi are trying to prevent from gaining traction.

[Delever]

ACT is not traceable. Just keep kicking shit people.
I ve been doing it for 4 years and do not intend to stop.
I dont flame, I dont curse. I simply offer insight if I see someone is being incredibly bad (not just the regular bad or else I d have to do it for every dungeon run). If they refuse to do anything about it and keep pulling sub 2k dps with a 405 eureka weapon (not lying) then I just simply boot them.
You wont get banned and you re doing the community a favor.

[TriHard]

1. I'm right, you're wrong.
2. Shadowbringers' launch trailer is out now.
3. Zodiark and Hydaelyn are primals, not gods, confirmed at the end of the trailer.

U r welcome, u don't need to watch it now.

[Yoshingo]

Man that reveal about Zodiark and Hydaelyn.

Chills.

We keep thinking that we've been immune to the other Primals because of the Echo, but it's really because we've been Hydaelyn's thrall since the beginning. It actually makes perfect sense when you think about it.

[Rogalicus]

I'm fairly confident that SE doesn't have anything capable in the existing package to do this, we'd know about it. They could add it in the future though. That said, they'd expose themselves to a lawsuit for banning people without clear definitive proof of that the players were kicking because of ACT. No dev would expose themselves to that risk. Simply having the program running would be circumstantial at best, and that's not enough to win a court case.

I was mostly commenting on "ACT is undetectable", if they want, they can detect it. I think they can also detect what it was used for if it reads the log file. And they can make an assumption based on consistency of kicks.
Yet again, I don't think SE will bother doing this, it's just a heads up for people who think that using ACT for kicking is untraceable.

[Onikaroshi]

I was mostly commenting on "ACT is undetectable", if they want, they can detect it. I think they can also detect what it was used for if it reads the log file. And they can make an assumption based on consistency of kicks.
Yet again, I don't think SE will bother doing this, it's just a heads up for people who think that using ACT for kicking is untraceable.

You're assuming the program is actually reading what you have running and checking its files. It doesn't seem to do either of these or things like botting, big titty nude mods, and yes ACT, would be banning people left and right.

Whatever Yoshi-P says about ACT it's still against TOS and if they were able to see it being used, they would be doing more banning.

[A Chozo]

3. Zodiark and Hydaelyn are primals, not gods, confirmed at the end of the trailer.

While it's probably true, keep in mind that the statement of a NPC could be proven as bullshit. Speculation on his part. It has happened before. So it's not a confirmation, just a possibility.

[Granyala]

And I thought the WoW community was toxic.

Just because we use ACT doesn't mean we kick left and right.
It is extremely rare that I kick people because I hate doing that, esp with the wonky reinforcements in Ff-XIV.

I only kick if you really hinder our ability to progress or if you are rude/offline.

[Remilia]

I see new fairy. Give me new fairy. Too bad they'll functionally be the same. NEW FAIRY.

[Rogalicus]

You're assuming the program is actually reading what you have running and checking its files. It doesn't seem to do either of these or things like botting, big titty nude mods, and yes ACT, would be banning people left and right.

Whatever Yoshi-P says about ACT it's still against TOS and if they were able to see it being used, they would be doing more banning.

I'm not assuming anything, I just say it's technically possible.

[Graeham II]

So, Eden was in FF8.

The new main raid is called Eden.

FF8 is finally getting a remaster...

It might just be a coincidence, but we'll see soon enough.

[Yoshingo]

While it's probably true, keep in mind that the statement of a NPC could be proven as bullshit. Speculation on his part. It has happened before. So it's not a confirmation, just a possibility.

The Ascians lie to the beast tribes but they've never been unreliable narrators (at least on purpose) toward the Warrior of Light. In fact they're often the ones trotted out to do the big story drops toward the end of quest lines.

I mean the more you look at Zodiark and Hydaelyn as Primals the more sense that it makes. The Echo was used as an excuse as to why the Warrior of Light was invulnerable to becoming tempered by other Primals, but it completely followers with the lore that you can't be tempered by multiple primals. And this follows with us encountering Hydaelyn right out of the gate and then being immune to everything else.

The same is true of the Ascians, who also possess the Echo from Zodiark (And use it in a way that's far beyond what the Warrior of Light can accomplish at the moment). We pretend to have free will (Which would be used as an argument that we're NOT tempered by a Primal) but do we really? For the literal entirety of the storyline we're enacting Hydaelyn's desire. We've shaped the politics of Eorzea because the rest of the world leaders believe that we're doing the right thing just because we're following Hydaelyn.

And when we seem to even SLIGHTLY wander off of the path of what she wants to do, she beams her directive immediately into our minds and we end up following her commands. She bestows us with her power, She's in contention with other Primals, She follows the patterns of other Primals identically. As does Zodiark. The only thing that sets the two of them apart is the apparent lack of potential to "summon" them in a traditional sense. But I think being the oldest (and perhaps the first) Primals sets them apart. While the likes of Ifrit or Garuda are single-mindedly working toward getting more followers, Zodiark and Hydaelyn are contending over the literal universe and different dimensions.

We're hitting apex of the Zodiark storyline and I can't wait to see what craziness they pull out. I'm almost tempted to say we're going to just go full godslayer and eventually end up killing or sealing away both Zodiark and Hydaelyn.

[Granyala]

Whatever Yoshi-P says about ACT it's still against TOS and if they were able to see it being used, they would be doing more banning.

I don't think it is a matter of "can" but a matter of "want". DEVs are well aware of sites like FF-Logs and how much their savage raiding community depends on them for diagnostic purposes. I think they don't mind us looking at the numbers, as long as we don't use the data to diss people.