[Megathread] Final Fantasy XIV

[Kaelwryn]

Yep, we just haven't heard much of Elidibus before now, but its the same voice actor.



Couldn't be bothered to try and find a video of just the moon scene but I linked at the time appropriate time stamp.

[Hyral]

Ah, luckily I was at the inn so looked it up real quick. I remember the scene but for some reason remembered it being unvoiced. Yes it sounds like the same VA.

[Katchii]

with how simple they made BLM AoE and ST this expac enochian isn't all that bad, unless you litterally go afk for 15 seconds we got all the instant casts to keep it up no problem.

Never said it was difficult. It's just annoying, as you're tied to it constantly. You have to be thinking about it, paying attention to it, adjusting your rotation, movement and or ability usage around it. It dictates your entire play experience as a Black Mage once you have it.

It's like being the driver of a car on a long road trip with other people in the car. It's super simple, but because you're the one driving you can't really do much else except pay attention to what's happening on the road, especially when there are other cars around.

[Granyala]

Never said it was difficult. It's just annoying, as you're tied to it constantly. You have to be thinking about it, paying attention to it, adjusting your rotation, movement and or ability usage around it. It dictates your entire play experience as a Black Mage once you have it.

Eeh not in the slightest. In fact, you can completely forget about Enochian, as long as you keep Astral/Umbral active.
It's not like it was in HW, where casting ice would reduce your duration etc.

Of course, keeping the two buffs up as best you can is the point of the class.

[Dugna]

Never said it was difficult. It's just annoying, as you're tied to it constantly. You have to be thinking about it, paying attention to it, adjusting your rotation, movement and or ability usage around it. It dictates your entire play experience as a Black Mage once you have it.

It's like being the driver of a car on a long road trip with other people in the car. It's super simple, but because you're the one driving you can't really do much else except pay attention to what's happening on the road, especially when there are other cars around.

with umbral ice and the quick casts of fire and ice spells when under the influences of each other you can do enochian once at the start at the dungeon or fight and only have it drop off at the end or if the group just stops pulling for whatever reason but by then the CD on enochian is back up and you can easily get three stacks again.


on the topic of the other posters btw, THE MOON PEOPLE ON THE MOOONNNNNN!!!!! that scene in HW made me giggle.

[Katchii]

Eeh not in the slightest. In fact, you can completely forget about Enochian, as long as you keep Astral/Umbral active.
It's not like it was in HW, where casting ice would reduce your duration etc.

Of course, keeping the two buffs up as best you can is the point of the class.

with umbral ice and the quick casts of fire and ice spells when under the influences of each other you can do enochian once at the start at the dungeon or fight and only have it drop off at the end or if the group just stops pulling for whatever reason but by then the CD on enochian is back up and you can easily get three stacks again.


on the topic of the other posters btw, THE MOON PEOPLE ON THE MOOONNNNNN!!!!! that scene in HW made me giggle.

My point is that once Enochian is active you have to be thinking about keeping it up, which means thinking about constantly having Astal/Umbral active, using Transpose and Umbral Soul as needed, using swiftcast/triplecast while moving so you can instant cast a spell so it doesn't fall off, knowing how much time is left on the timer so you can choose to cast the appropriate spell so it doesn't fall off, etc...

I think we're saying the same thing, just thinking about it differently. IMO, keeping Enochian up and how it plays with the umbral/astral buffs are a nuisance to keep track of because it dictates your entire play experience, but as you said that's the point of the class mechanic. I just don't like that class mechanic, some people do. /shrug.

[Dugna]

My point is that once Enochian is active you have to be thinking about keeping it up, which means thinking about constantly having Astal/Umbral active, using Transpose and Umbral Soul as needed, using swiftcast/triplecast while moving so you can instant cast a spell so it doesn't fall off, knowing how much time is left on the timer so you can choose to cast the appropriate spell so it doesn't fall off, etc...

I think we're saying the same thing, just thinking about it differently. IMO, keeping Enochian up and how it plays with the umbral/astral buffs are a nuisance to keep track of because it dictates your entire play experience, but as you said that's the point of the class mechanic. I just don't like that class mechanic, some people do. /shrug.

yep just part of the job, like how you have to pay attention to the meters of every other job as to make sure you don't waste any

[Granyala]

which means thinking about constantly having Astal/Umbral active, using Transpose and Umbral Soul as needed, using swiftcast/triplecast while moving so you can instant cast a spell so it doesn't fall off, knowing how much time is left on the timer so you can choose to cast the appropriate spell so it doesn't fall off, etc...

I would do all that even if I didn't had Enochian, so I don't see the issue.

BLM doesn't appeal to you, no problem. I don't like being that stationary either.

- - - Updated - - -

In general, yes, some people have always kinda been annoyed by "Keep this short term buff up, keep it up, ooooops don't let it drop!" sorts of mechanics. But XIV loves em.

Yop, I don't like that kind of busywork either.

One of the main reasons I only play tank and healers.

[Katchii]

I would do all that even if I didn't had Enochian, so I don't see the issue.

BLM doesn't appeal to you, no problem. I don't like being that stationary either.

I don't have this problem with Black Mage prior to Enochian though, because prior to Enochian and the added Fire 4 and Blizzard 4 spells, all the spells you'd use automatically refresh the countdown so there honestly is nothing to think about there. Once you start using Fire and Blizz 4 the countdown actually affects your decision making because it actually starts counting down since Fire/Blizz 4 don't affect the counter.

It's not the stationary portion that bothers me, I like casters, it's the feeling that because of the Enochian timer and how the cast times line up with it, that I feel punished any time I have to move because of how heavily any adjustment within that timer can affect your overall flow. Because of that, it feels clunky to me compared to other casters I've ever played.

You're right though, Black Mage doesn't appeal to me, because of the above. But I'm done with it now, so never have to tough it again...until next expansion if I feel like it.

[Granyala]

I don't have this problem with Black Mage prior to Enochian though, because prior to Enochian and the added Fire 4 and Blizzard 4 spells, all the spells you'd use automatically refresh the countdown so there honestly is nothing to think about there.

Aah so you want a braindead 1-2-3 class. Understood.
I never got how Lv50 BLM managed to not fall asleep during the fights.

While I agree (and so did SE) that they went overboard in Heavensward (it felt as if you fight your class more than the boss) I think they arrived at a happy medium in Stormblood/ShB.

Use your instant casts properly (you have 4! of them) and move skillfully. You will notice that it isn't as punishing as you think it is.
Yes, sometimes you are forced to drop Eno. That's why it only has a 30s cooldown now. It should basically always be ready if you need it again unless you screw up. In which case, being punished is working as intended.

I agree on the clunky feeling but imho that applies to all DPS except RDM and SAM & MNK. Most DPS classes in FF-XIV just don't flow properly. BRD / MCH are the worst offenders with their "mash teh button NAO!" burst windows.

[Katchii]

Aah so you want a braindead 1-2-3 class. Understood.
I never got how Lv50 BLM managed to not fall asleep during the fights.

While I agree (and so did SE) that they went overboard in Heavensward (it felt as if you fight your class more than the boss) I think they arrived at a happy medium in Stormblood/ShB.

Use your instant casts properly (you have 4! of them) and move skillfully. You will notice that it isn't as punishing as you think it is.
Yes, sometimes you are forced to drop Eno. That's why it only has a 30s cooldown now. It should basically always be ready if you need it again unless you screw up. In which case, being punished is working as intended.

I agree on the clunky feeling but imho that applies to all DPS except RDM and SAM & MNK. Most DPS classes in FF-XIV just don't flow properly. BRD / MCH are the worst offenders with their "mash teh button NAO!" burst windows.

Different strokes for different folks then I guess, because MCH doesn't feel nearly as clunky to me as BLM does.

I don't want braindead, just don't want to feel chained to the timer mechanic so unapologetically as BLM is, but I guess if I just learn to get over that feeling because it has a 30 second cooldown I'll be fine.

That said, I much prefer MCH, RDM, SMN and DNC over BLM...so I'll stick with those.

I actually really liked MCH, even the mash button window is fun. The issue I had with that is that it's optimal to double weave during that window, and I just can't do it consistently. Single weaving during that window feels good, double weaving feels frenetic and carpal tunnel inducing.

[Granyala]

The issue I had with that is that it's optimal to double weave during that window, and I just can't do it consistently. Single weaving during that window feels good, double weaving feels frenetic and carpal tunnel inducing.

Hence the "clunky" feeling.
I hate classes that don't flow and I most certainly hate such "frenzy button mash" windows.

[Ladey Gags]

Hence the "clunky" feeling.
I hate classes that don't flow and I most certainly hate such "frenzy button mash" windows.

In your opinion what classes flow the most?

[Granyala]

In your opinion what classes flow the most?

From my limited exposure (I basically level them to 80 and that's it, so I can't say how they feel in a raid setting) I'd say SAM, MNK, RDM and DNC stood out.

[Katchii]

Hence the "clunky" feeling.
I hate classes that don't flow and I most certainly hate such "frenzy button mash" windows.

Then just don't try and double weave. The only setting where that's even really "necessary" is savage raiding where DPS checks are really tight. Dungeons, 24-man raids, normal trials, and normal raids don't require that level of performance. I'd argue that extreme trials don't either, provided your group is coordinated and otherwise knows what they're doing, because the DPS checks aren't THAT tight where if your group is coordinated and alive and geared appropriately that they shouldn't pass it, difficulty there is mainly in the mechanics and party coordination, IMO. Though having a little extra DPS will obviously never hurt, the overall DPS difference between someone who is able to pull off double weaving and someone who is only single weaving isn't enough to make or break a pull, at least according to the info I've found online of people who have parsed it. It's noticeable, of course, but the difference will likely never be enough to make up for failing a mechanic or a dead DPS.

I don't mind the frenzy button bash windows, as long as it flows well, and single weaving in that window on MCH does flow well, IMO. The 2.5 second GCD makes it not seem so button mashy, just faster than normal. Can't really comment on BRD as I don't even remember how it played, I just remember seriously disliking the play style compared to MCH and DNC so once I got it to 80, I dropped it.

[Granyala]

Bard can get pretty spammy when you multiDoT

[RohanV]

I think that FFXIV should formalize the second GCD. Have current "off-GCD" abilities trigger a common cooldown of 2.5s for all those abilities.That would make single weaving standard and common. And it makes it easier to explain: Main abilities use GCD-1, specials use GCD-2, you want to alternate between them.

[Katchii]

Bard can get pretty spammy when you multiDoT

I do remember that part...it sucked. Especially when you got used to multi-DoTing on SMN which is just one button, and then having to press two buttons for every mob you wanted to put a DoT on.

This is why I'm such a huge proponent for playing what you like, numbers be damned, because at the end of the day the game is about fun and enjoyment. If you don't enjoy the class you're playing it's not worth it because eventually you'll end up hating the game and/or not wanting to play BECAUSE of the class you play which would be pretty terrible.

[Nasuuna]

From my limited exposure (I basically level them to 80 and that's it, so I can't say how they feel in a raid setting) I'd say SAM, MNK, RDM and DNC stood out.

rdm is literally built with double weaving I mind


side note, the game has been near unplayable with constant dx11 crashes, apparently due to me having a 144hz monitor

What the shit

[Gutler]

I do remember that part...it sucked. Especially when you got used to multi-DoTing on SMN which is just one button, and then having to press two buttons for every mob you wanted to put a DoT on.

This is why I'm such a huge proponent for playing what you like, numbers be damned, because at the end of the day the game is about fun and enjoyment. If you don't enjoy the class you're playing it's not worth it because eventually you'll end up hating the game and/or not wanting to play BECAUSE of the class you play which would be pretty terrible.

How about adding a DoT spread to shadowbite that would fix multi DoTing.