10.3 million subscribers

[mvaliz]

Tbh considering they said there were mostly Chinese people cancelling subs I would imagine its a response to the announcement of Pandas. Pandas are the national icon of China, and yet in wow they often wear Japanese armor, which would be considered as highly offensive as a video of a man in a turban shitting on the american flag.

ugh...

Should I even? Are you even going to listen? Really...

Fine...I'll try.

ONLY the first Pandaren (Chen in WCIII) had Japanese armor. China refused it - then Blizzard changed him to have Chinese outfit and China was fine with it. Since then, there hasn't been a SINGLE instance of Pandaren in game until now. and in this game - it's ALL chinese, NOT japanese.

Secondly, and more importantly, Q3 covers June-August... MoP wasn't unveiled until late September.

[starlord]

Seriously? First people were blaming players being suddenly afflicted with "boredom" since Cata's launch... then others are claming that it's a down economy that's been afflicting subscriptions (dispite WoW's original numbers in Vanilla/BC SOARING due to resession and players wanting escapism!)

...and now since those two were debunked... you're trying to play the Natural Disaster card?

Seriously!?

its no one factor obviously, but that certainly could have had an impact.

[hambaby]

This game sucks, doesn't surprise me.
Make normal raids easier please. Leave the hardmodes hard for the pros

[Xeraxis]

ugh...

Should I even? Are you even going to listen? Really...

Fine...I'll try.

ONLY the first Pandaren (Chen in WCIII) had Japanese armor. China refused it - then Blizzard changed him to have Chinese outfit and China was fine with it. Since then, there hasn't been a SINGLE instance of Pandaren in game until now. and in this game - it's ALL chinese, NOT japanese.

Secondly, and more importantly, Q3 covers June-August... MoP wasn't unveiled until late September.

Before correcting anyone I'd suggest you get your facts straight.

Q3 (calendar): July 1st through September 30th
Q3 (fiscal): April 1st through June 30th
Q4 (fiscal): July 1st through September 30th
MoP was announced/unveiled late October

[mvaliz]

Before correcting anyone I'd suggest you get your facts straight.

Q3 (calendar): July 1st through September 30th
Q3 (fiscal): April 1st through June 30th
Q4 (fiscal): July 1st through September 30th
MoP was announced/unveiled late October

Meh... so I'm a month off. I'm tired... sue me. Thanks for the correction. :P

[Durzlla]

yes they are, for the people whose most valuable resource is not money, but time

How? Gw2 isn't designed to consume your time, it's designed to be fun, it's also being designed so that you can put it down for a while, days, weeks, months, and be able to come back and be able to experience a bunch of new things and not be left in the dust, so no, it's not really fighting for your time.

[Halicia]

ONLY the first Pandaren (Chen in WCIII) had Japanese armor. China refused it - then Blizzard changed him to have Chinese outfit and China was fine with it. Since then, there hasn't been a SINGLE instance of Pandaren in game until now. and in this game - it's ALL chinese, NOT japanese.

that kinda lends credit to the 'kungfu panda' theory then, eh ?

but in all seriousness, am i the only one that sees the possibility for MoP to be the first expansion NOT to see a 'subscription bump' ?

i'm kinda ok with letting my sub trickle by so i can see the 'final' patch and see how poorly LFR delivers... but i'm not about to drop $40 AND sub fees to get another expansion i clear thru in 2 days then wonder what i'm doing in a week and abandon my favorite character for the remainder of the expansion.

[Decan]

For me the game has lost that epic feel, i have played from the start and i did sign up for another year because I do like the game for the way it works, however it doesn't feel epic and its boring now.

I find i am doing my arena games for the week on 2 toons and maybe a FL run and that's about it. running za/zg on a number of toons is just boring as hell (I have 8 lvl 85s) and i cant stand it anymore. I think making ZA/ZG the only instances to do for the points was a mistake, you are locked in doing 2 instances over and over again

[leafs43]

I didn't oversimplify really anything.

Class balance changes are going to be long and a wash. As are quests leading up to opening of raids and such.

P.S. Did Trion ever add the open-world RvR zone (related to Scion I believe) that they hyped into oblivion before launch? It was the one feature that lured me in to try RIFT... boy was I a fool for believing them.

Not related to scion, but they have revamped world pvp quite a bit. They introduced an important pvp rep for those that participate in world pvp with actually good rewards. And they introduced pvp rifts.


It's the only MMO this side of Warhammer that you'll actually find world pvp.



Rift has really been adding stuff non stop to get people out into the world rather than sitting in cap cities spamming trade.

[McFrotton]

Loss in 800k subs, I called it last week!

no you didnt just scrolled your mere 122 post AH!

[mvaliz]

that kinda lends credit to the 'kungfu panda' theory then, eh ?

but in all seriousness, am i the only one that sees the possibility for MoP to be the first expansion NOT to see a 'subscription bump' ?

i'm kinda ok with letting my sub trickle by so i can see the 'final' patch and see how poorly LFR delivers... but i'm not about to drop $40 AND sub fees to get another expansion i clear thru in 2 days then wonder what i'm doing in a week and abandon my favorite character for the remainder of the expansion.

Hey man... I actually agree that they got their visual queue/style from Kung-Fu Panda! :P From the company who ripped of Rambo, CSI and Raiders of the lost arc for entire zone-wide storylines, are COMPLETELY ripping off Pokemon (not just taking the pet combat system... but literally stealing the game's core engine design), why wouln't I suspect they took visual queues from Kung Fu Panda?

And it's arguable that it's actually CATA that was the first expansion to not see a subscription bump. Wrath hit 12 million a couple months BEFORE Cata hit... that was the cap. Cata has been nothing but downhill sales since launch after that initial spike of playing.

---------- Post added 2011-11-10 at 03:45 AM ----------

How would player housing be that exciting? x.x

The same way fishing is exciting to me! ^_^

I'll admit I'm a bit of a strange guy. I loved player housing in UO! I opened up a blacksmith/cooking shop and just had a blast interacting with and helping CREATE a community! ^_^

I wanted to do the same thing in WoW... but alas - Blizzard proved to me they didn't share the same concept of "community" that I do. =/

[Traknel]

that kinda lends credit to the 'kungfu panda' theory then, eh ?

but in all seriousness, am i the only one that sees the possibility for MoP to be the first expansion NOT to see a 'subscription bump' ?

i'm kinda ok with letting my sub trickle by so i can see the 'final' patch and see how poorly LFR delivers... but i'm not about to drop $40 AND sub fees to get another expansion i clear thru in 2 days then wonder what i'm doing in a week and abandon my favorite character for the remainder of the expansion.

I very much agree with this. I don't care how cool the expansion looks, if it's only going to give a week or two of actual compelling gameplay I'm not interested. I've leveled enough alts because there just wasn't anything else I wanted to accomplish to last me a lifetime. And I sure as Hell am not interested in anymore "railroad" quest zones.

[Kickbuttmario]

Actually Blizzard reported net losses. Just saying. They are pouring a great many resources into Titan, Diablo 3 and Heart of the Swarm which aren't making any money in development. Also do not forget the gargantuan cost of bandwidth to support 10 million players. That bandwidth isn't free or even close to it.

Summation: It is all irrelevant for the most part. Blizzard, financially, is in great shape, I'd wager.

Actually the cost of bandwidth is much smaller than you think such that they will never have to worry about it.

---------- Post added 2011-11-10 at 04:54 AM ----------

I tried to read most the posts, made it through about the first 3 pages and got a raging headache. I was just curious if any of the people predicting the fall of WoW or Blizzard have actually taken the time to read the news over the past 6 months. It's not a wonder (to the informed) that the subscription rate in the middle east has fallen so drastically recently, given the horrific earthquake that rocked Japan, followed by the terrible flooding still being cleaned up in Thailand.

Before you all jump to conclusions about the end of WoW as we know it, or Blizzard, Inc. going belly up, maybe you could log out of the game, and check up on the Current Events of the World.

Peace,
Kir

There are a lot of reasons why WoW is losing subscribers. A lot are arguing it's the state of the world that is causing the loss of subscribers. Some say its the game.

To myself and others that hate this game with passion, we just want it to die.

[Anakso]

Now (kinda) people can say wows subs are in Decline (with 3 declines in a row, previously people saying it with 2 were just wrong)

However I'm still not worried about WoW dying anytime soon.

[anyaka21]

The problem is that as said, most of the loss of subs came from China. But let's also realize, Cata was released in China at the start of the new quarter. Thus, as many people had said that China would rebound the subs with people playing Cata, but the reverse is true. They have had fresh content and are now where the rest of the world is in terms of expansions, they have Firelands, and in those 3 months they've had a constant stream of "new" content and still they lost subs.

So can we skip with point where people don't blame Cata as the problem when it seems pretty clear that with China losing subs at the same rate the rest of the world is that Cata is the problem.

---------- Post added 2011-11-10 at 06:44 AM ----------

Actually the cost of bandwidth is much smaller than you think such that they will never have to worry about it.

---------- Post added 2011-11-10 at 04:54 AM ----------



There are a lot of reasons why WoW is losing subscribers. A lot are arguing it's the state of the world that is causing the loss of subscribers. Some say its the game.

To myself and others that hate this game with passion, we just want it to die.

The cost of bandwidth, the cost of the servers, etc... is the single highest expense WoW has. The cost is way beyond what most people think it is.

[ShimmerSwirl]

The problem is that as said, most of the loss of subs came from China. But let's also realize, Cata was released in China at the start of the new quarter. Thus, as many people had said that China would rebound the subs with people playing Cata, but the reverse is true. They have had fresh content and are now where the rest of the world is in terms of expansions, they have Firelands, and in those 3 months they've had a constant stream of "new" content and still they lost subs.

So can we skip with point where people don't blame Cata as the problem when it seems pretty clear that with China losing subs at the same rate the rest of the world is that Cata is the problem.

---------- Post added 2011-11-10 at 06:44 AM ----------



The cost of bandwidth, the cost of the servers, etc... is the single highest expense WoW has. The cost is way beyond what most people think it is.

There was some data posted a while back from Activision's last earnings reports where they listed all their expenses, and server costs were so small they weren't even on the list, they were in a little asterisk below the real list.

[Osmeric]

So can we skip with point where people don't blame Cata as the problem when it seems pretty clear that with China losing subs at the same rate the rest of the world is that Cata is the problem

The interesting question for WoW's future now is: has the dev team correctly identified the problem(s) with Cataclysm that caused the widespread negative customer reaction? If not, the decline will be hard to reverse.

I'm not convinced they've done so, or at least been able to address all of them.

---------- Post added 2011-11-10 at 12:37 PM ----------

There was some data posted a while back from Activision's last earnings reports where they listed all their expenses, and server costs were so small they weren't even on the list, they were in a little asterisk below the real list.

I'd be surprised if customer service costs didn't dominate the operating costs of the game. There's a reason the game can be so cheap in China, and it's not because servers are cheaper there.

Also, if server/networks costs were high now, they'd have been ridiculous five years ago.

[Adeodatus]

Hey "Dude", I know a lot of people that are re-subin in 4.3 for the new content.

Everybody knows somebody who is doing something. Most of my guild is un-subbing after 4.3 to avoid MoP. Annecdotal evidence is pointless.

[ewhenn]

How? Gw2 isn't designed to consume your time, it's designed to be fun, it's also being designed so that you can put it down for a while, days, weeks, months, and be able to come back and be able to experience a bunch of new things and not be left in the dust, so no, it's not really fighting for your time.

When you only have 2-3 hours a week to play games, and lots of different games you might be interested in playing, they are fighting for your time.

[anyaka21]

There was some data posted a while back from Activision's last earnings reports where they listed all their expenses, and server costs were so small they weren't even on the list, they were in a little asterisk below the real list.

post it then. Until you can actually produce that as fact it's pointless to state it. I mean I heard a long time ago that it cost Blizzard $100,000 per month per server to keep things going, and that was during BC, and costs have probably gone up and add that they have added new territories now and as thus new servers. Because really, at this point, my post is as valid as yours.

I've also been told that the majority of the products cost catagory in expenses is about maintaining WoW and it's servers.

example: http://www.associatedcontent.com/art...a_monthly.html

So, you've probably heard about or played World of Warcraft. If you don't play, did you know it costs 15 dollars each month? 15 dollars to pay for something you already bought. Sure, it's an MMORPG, so they're updating it, they're paying to run servers, they've got pay their employees, etc. There are 10 million subscribers. That means, even if 1/10 are paying every month, they are making 15 million dollars each month. That's 1.8 billion dollars a year. Do they really need that? Let's find out.

They have to pay for their server maintenance, support, and ongoing content creation. Every year, they're spending around 120 million dollars a year. Server maintenance costs around 100 million, and support and content creation cost about 20 million. You've also got to take in to account the amount of money it took them to make the game in the first place. Most PC games today cost around 10 million dollars to make. That really isn't all that much. So, after their anual fees, they're still making a good 1.68 billion dollars a year. There is no reason they still need to charge you 15 dollars a month.

Now, it is the top MMORPG ever created. Why? Because it is one awesome game. The people that play have no problem with paying 15 dollars a month. They obviously wouldn't if they didn't feel it was necessary. There's all sorts of quests to do, different races to be, different classes to bem and a huge map to explore. The game has a very addicting quality about it that helps with its sales. Give it a try, you'll see what I mean.

example #2: http://www.datacenterknowledge.com/a...s-75000-cores/

It takes a lot of resources to host the world’s largest online games. One of the largest players in this niche is Blizzard, which operates World of Warcraft and the Battle.net gaming service for its Starcraft and Diablo titles. World of Warcraft (WoW) is played by more than 11.5 million users across three continents, requiring both scale and geographic scope.

Blizzard hosts its gaming infrastructure with AT&T, which provides data center space, network monitoring and management. AT&T, which has been supporting Blizzard for nine years, doesn’t provide a lot of details on Blizzard’s infrastructure. But Blizzard’s Allen Brack and Frank Pearce provided some details at the recent Game Developer’s Conference in Austin. Here are some data points:

Blizzard Online Network Services run in 10 data centers around the world, including facilities in Washington, California, Texas, Massachusetts, France, Germany, Sweden, South Korea, China, and Taiwan.
Blizzard uses 20,000 systems and 1.3 petabytes of storage to power its gaming operations.
WoW’s infrastructure includes 13,250 server blades, 75,000 CPU cores, and 112.5 terabytes of blade RAM.
The Blizzard network is managed by a staff of 68 people.
The company’s gaming infrastructure is monitored from a global network operating center (GNOC), which like many NOCs, features televisions tuned to the weather stations to track potential uptime threats across its data center footprint.


So somehow with all that tech, I find it hard to believe that the cost of bandwidth, server maintenence, upgrades, etc... is cheap