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  1. #61
    Warchief Szemere's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Probably gonna be replaced by something else, or is an error in the calculator... Didn't they say during the QA that they liked the current design? I don't see why they would suddenly remove it...
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  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by keik12 View Post
    Am I blind or when I looked at the talent specs, I didnt see PoH in the "spec" or all side of the priest tree....
    obviously alot of ppl missed this part from talent tree site...

  3. #63
    from what i see this thread isnt only about poh but about many other mop changes, so hopefully my question wont be that much out of place, dont really want to make new topic for it :s
    please correct me if i missed or misunderstood some changes (i havent been very on the ball with the notes last months).

    so, intellect wont be affecting the size of our mana pool, hence so called 'base mana' will be our 'everyday mana'?
    and if so, with state of things as they are given now, greater heal costs 27% of base mana which somehow seems amazingly high when i think of it as 27% of everyday mana and scares me, is it just me hoping they would change those percentages?

  4. #64
    The mana costs for everything will be completely reworked. MoP will take healing back to its vanilla roots.
    Instead of SP and Spirit or mana/5 we now will have Int and Spirit.

    Gauging by vanilla costs, Great Heal will likely cost ~5-10% of our mana pool, and Fheal will be in the 10-15% range.

    Not sure how many people remember, but mana pools shrank as Vanilla proceeded for priests. My biggest mana pool was when I was in Prophecy gear. A lot of that had to do with Mental Strength being pushed deeper into Disc and the 1.10 patch fixing the Holy tree, but the end result was our pool tanked below 10k after MC.
    Last edited by Themos; 2011-11-23 at 01:59 PM.

  5. #65
    I really like the mana pool changes. My reasoning:

    We will no longer get more expensive heals as we level up.
    How many of you haven't been annoyed by this?
    Our WoTLK GHeal healed for 18k, and hit like a truck at the time. We could cast it forever, and the only reason we didn't was because Flash Heal and AoE heals were even better.
    Then we levelled 5 levels. Yay, powerup!

    After hitting 85, GHeal healed for 20k. But it cost 5x as much mana. It was a horrible tradeoff. It was the reason why we were downranking in TBC. The max level heal was horribly inefficient, and casting them virtually ever was something of a newbie trap. In WoTLK we lost the ability to downrank, and in Cata, we even lost all ways to cheese ourselves out of the cost. Which is why priests in general were kicked from instances with the reason "your class is oom" in early patch 4.0.1a.

    With the new deal, A GHeal will cost say 10% of a manabar both at level 80, level 85 and level 90. It's easy to understand, and it's not a power loss to level up as far as spellcosts are concerned.

    Spirit will be a true rating
    Spirit has always acted as a rating. Instead of having 2000 spirit giving 600 mana per second at the end of WoTLK, we ended up with 2500 spirit giving almost 400 mana per second when we just hit 85. That's the rating in action - as you level, spirit is worth less. It's always been like this, and it's mimicing haste rating, crit rating and mastery rating. Frankly, spirit IS a rating.

    In MoP, spirit will still be a rating. But it will be upfront about it. And we won't be hit double by this due to spell costs going up while regen is going down. That alone should make entry-level content easier to deal with since healing needs only need to be scaled against available spirit levels.

    Spirit is the only regen stat
    A 20k STR fury warrior with no secondary stats is a silly idea. He would miss a lot, and even though his strength is epic, he would do lowish DPS due to no crit, no mastery and no haste.
    A 20k INT healer with no secondary stats would be plainly overpowered. INT gives us everything we ever need, from mana to crit to throughput.

    If you want power in MoP, you get INT, crit, haste or mastery.
    If you want longevity in MoP, you get spirit. It's the only stat that offers longevity. All healing specs will want it, and will want MORE of it as new patches come along.
    Unlike today where druids right now are pondering how they can avoid all spirit on their gear, since a medium of INT gives them all the regen they ever need.
    INT regen will no longer scale in MoP. Rapture, Revitalize and such will give you a fixed minimum of regen, but you need spirit for anything beyond that.
    And thus all healers will need spirit. And in time, I believe Rapture, Revitalize etc will be based on Spirit as they should be.

    Meaning there will be spirit gear. On bosses. In raids. Because all healers want it. Some more than others, granted, but still - it will be there. You won't hit the point where the healers wishes he had 20k INT and no secondary stats.
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  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Themos View Post
    It's a non issue. Who uses Heal or attonement smite for it's healing anymore?
    I didn't even have Heal bound as Holy midway through t11 content. :/
    I still use Heal... for example to conserve mana on Rag hc p1. Same for Baleroc. How is Greater heal always more efficient when you also take overhealing into account?

  7. #67
    Epic! myhv's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Netherlight Temple
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelesti View Post
    I think you mean Strength of Soul, myhv, not Train of Thought. But yes, it also triggers trinkets and Power Torrent so you can keep your regen flowing instead of having things wait off the ICD for you.
    Yeah, I did mean SoS, got 'em mixed up for some reason. Also I did some testing and yeah, heal is barely beating GH in terms of HPM. But it is a good tool to use if you got time on your hands and some healing is needed.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Acidz View Post
    How is Greater heal always more efficient when you also take overhealing into account?
    Last tier, I'd agree with you b/c mana was much tighter.
    But with spell power scaling, Heal's HPM isn't as good as it was and the overheal isn't a huge issue in Firelands at all.

    With the amount of binds Holy has, it just wasn't worth it for me. I haven't missed it at all.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Themos View Post
    Last tier, I'd agree with you b/c mana was much tighter.
    But with spell power scaling, Heal's HPM isn't as good as it was and the overheal isn't a huge issue in Firelands at all.

    With the amount of binds Holy has, it just wasn't worth it for me. I haven't missed it at all.

    Ah, i see. I play as disc and am tank healing most of the time. That might be the difference.

  10. #70
    Not really, I mostly tank heal in my 10 man this tier. It's just I have so much other "light" heals going on that are either completely free or even more dirt cheap.
    EoL = free
    Renew = free with a direct heal
    Serenity = 30% cheaper, and heals for double what Heal does

    Heal is about as useful as Holy Nova. At least with the latter I can kill critters

  11. #71
    Just to put this here:
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    We wanted to take a moment to give some context to why the calculators were posted, and the permanence of the data shown. A lot of times we say things like "not final" and "may change" as verbal wiggle room should we decide we need to go a different direction, or are unable to complete something in time. In this case of the Mists of Pandaria calculator data is essentially pre-alpha, and will absolutely change in many ways.

    It was important for us to get this stuff in front of you as soon as possible though (and as a work in progress as it is) to get your feedback, which will in no small part influence that change. We also wanted to present everything on a single page to give you a fuller context for the initial talent changes we announced at BlizzCon, and to see how the overall structure of core abilities, spec abilities, and talents will function, with concrete examples.

    The calculator contains elements that are experimental, still in the process of implementation, or in some cases outright failed experiments that we already intend to revise or replace. Odds are good that if it looks like we’ve forgotten some critical piece of a particular class toolkit, it’s either accounted for elsewhere, or simply a data glitch (e.g., Prayer of Healing is currently absent from the calculator – we are not taking Prayer of Healing away from priests, and Devastate for warriors probably won't sunder armor 453%). Our hope is that revealing the calculator in this state will shed light on the philosophy behind our talent overhaul, and let you get a sense of how pieces of your core rotational gameplay, such as Hot Streak, Riptide, or Sudden Doom, fit into the new system.

    The different classes are also at very different stages of design and implementation, and the fact that some mechanics changes we discussed at BlizzCon and in recent Q&As are not yet present does not mean that we have abandoned those ideas.

    Any and all feedback is very welcome, but please keep all of the above in mind when considering the information in the talent calculator, and please keep feedback consolidated in the Mists of Pandaria forum:
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
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  12. #72
    Why aren't threads like these locked?

    MoP isn't even in early Alpha. It's silly for Blizzard to even *feel* the need to explain this to anyone. Threads like these just create opportunities for people to call one another "troll" or "stupid" or any other sort of derivative term. Instead of being excited for something new and different, people just compare the (current and ever changing) proposed changes to what they already know, and have lost half the battle (so to speak).

    I look at these changes and go, "Uh, yeah *that* might work." "OK, that will change how *that* works." "Hrm, *that's* interesting." But Jesus Christ, after playing WoW for 7 years (and you hardly have had to play this long to realize the same thing), I've realized: this game changes...a lot.

    Maybe it would be too "Big Brother" to delete these posts in some people's eyes, but to me it's no different than moving a Rogue post in the Priest forum to the Rogue forum. Neither are relevant to anything they were currently posted in.

    Of course, I'm one of "those" that believe the current WoW community is in shambles, and needs some "cleaning up."

    So, I guess to stay on topic: Prayer of Healing missing was an oversight (hey, they got a LOT to work on; some stuff is gonna get missed).

  13. #73
    Thank you Kelesti! That is exactly what we all wanted to know. Prayer of Healing will still be in the game.

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