MoP Warrior changes? (mainly prot)

[Artran]

Revenge on a 10second cooldown is a little disappointing, i liked spamming it for massive damage.

[Deleted]

....
"Make Shield Block work like Execute, in that its %chance to block is determined by how much rage is consumed in activating it, with minimum and maximum amounts to consume. Allow the warrior to choose between high uptime and low block chance (because they haven't yet generated enough rage to use more than the minimum SB), or lower uptime with higher block chance. This would carry the added benefit of perfect play changing according to the warrior's gear.
....

Change is bound to happen but this would be a change for the better and not for the worse as how shield block changes looks so far. But well either keep it at 30 sec cd like now or change it like you said, then shield block would remain nice

As some of you pointed out that intervene will now be a "new" tool ment to be used for getting hits of the other tank (already is but the 10% threat reduction make it in some cases difficult to use). and well threat is a non issue really and if nobody use the threat dumb I guess it's better for the prot warriors that we get unlocked the new tool and lose the threat dumb.

As for Shield Reflect
Because of PVP we (prot warriors) had it nerfed from 10 sec cd up to 25 sec cd (I do understand it's op in PVP however don't understand why blizzard just don't do something like (if you shield reflect a spell from another player the ability would gain 15 sec additional cd or something like it so it would only effect pvp but not pve but well let's leave it at that). Anyhow when Shield reflect will be useable without popping shield on it would mean 3 things. 1. less macros used to play warrior (great), 2. That the bad and half decent pvp warrior would start use this way more since well no macros needed ect., the 3. thing which I guess would effect way more people, is that you can pop shieldreflect without decreasing your dmg output (atm you have to change stance, and get a shield on which would mean less dmg dealt). This will most likely lead to more qq about warriors. So that blizzard once again have to nerf us (prot warriors) because the other (pvp warriors) is getting to strong.
So what I'm trying to say is that I'm happy that remove the shield needed(macro) however I do see a nerf inc, so actually I'm a bit sad because it, but well if the nerf never come I will remain happy

[Thraenduil]

I actually don't know why people complain about shield block and spell reflect being able to use without shield in arms and fury specs.
There are many scenes in fantasy movies and games where hero blocks enemy's spell or strike with with weapon/weapons.
Though i don't know if blocking with weapon is called parrying which leads to dilemma of shield block not being actually block rather than parry.
For example, there is sword block in halo:reach.
another one; think about cloud in FFVII, does he need shield for protection?
It would actually be a cool weapon in wow, a 2-hander sword which could change to dual-winding swords with different procs at will for certain amount of time.

[Shamgar]

I may be wrong here, but if it truly is as some say, that you will have 75% CTC passive when starting raids in MoP, that means that your probably will end up unhittable sometime second content patch, just like now. I remember you had around 75% passive CTC when doing tier 11 normal modes. That means that with a model like this, half the expansion you would just drop the whole ability since its so punishing to use. When the only benefit is crit block, it loses so much value you might as well just spam heroic strike again. Especially since its crit block on ONE attack.

[Mammoth]

I may be wrong here, but if it truly is as some say, that you will have 75% CTC passive when starting raids in MoP, that means that your probably will end up unhittable sometime second content patch, just like now. I remember you had around 75% passive CTC when doing tier 11 normal modes. That means that with a model like this, half the expansion you would just drop the whole ability since its so punishing to use.

With tanking, you play the odds whenever you look at avoidance/block. Each time I put a mastery gem in my gear I gain 1% block (artificial numbers), but I don't say to myself that it's completely pointless, because I'm playing the odds. In the long run, that 1% block will become a measurable reduction in damage.

In the same way you could always have said that Shield Block was useless, even when it was 100%. If I have 80% block already, then SB only gives me 20% more; and there's a 80% chance (per swing) that using SB was completely pointless, nothing changed.

When you play the odds, you want to have SB up as often as possible.

As I said in a previous post: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post14365723 you can directly relate the effectiveness of new SB to the current SB mechanics even though one is time based.


The thing you have to remember is that Dev/Rev/SS have absolutely no rage requirements, so burning your rage isn't an issue. If you went for a SB-less rotation, you would just get more Heroic Strikes in. As someone else put it, it appears that the Warrior rage bar is becoming very similar to the DK's runic power bar.


The worse thing that has changed about SB is its applicability to multiple-mob situations. Out SB is now weaker than the druid's buff that is on a 5 second timer, and also weaker than the DK/Paladin heals because ours scales with damage taken in a single strike, rather than a fixed amount. In multiple mob situations the damage per strike tends to be significantly less than a single target situation.

[Shamgar]

Well i sort of disagree there. At the start of tier 11, we used shield block to become CTC capped with it up. That means smoother damage taken, and the healers rejoice and sing praises. Then a bit later, at start of tier 12, we used it to become CTC capped with 4-set up. The healers sang more praises. Then, at heroic modes, we became CTC capped passive. The healers said "this is how it should be", and all the DK tanks were benched.

The difference is huge. With 75% CTC, without shield block, you would surely die horribly pulling whelps + 2 drakes on 25hc halfus. With shield block, it worked just fine (im speaking with tier 11 gear levels now ofc).With CTC cap, you can do the same without shield block, and i bet healers would not even notice. The idea is not that shield block itself is magic, but that CTC cap is magic.

Now what blizzard proposes, is a new shield block that does not give you CTC coverage (or well it sort of does, but on one hit, and it looks painful to use, with very limited uptime). That means more spikes, *until you get unhittable*. Ergo gearing for unhittable becomes even more important then in cataclysm. After that point, it becomes almost useless.

In reality what the ability does, is give you 1 incoming hit with CTC cap. The next hit you wont have it up, and you get a spike. Practically useless. What you say about current shield block does not really apply to the same logic, as it guaranteed you 10 seconds of safeness, before we got unhittable. Very important on pull, on taunt rotations, and on boss special abilities like inferno blade. Now, atm, shield block has lost almost all its value. It gives some critical block, and some magic reduction, but its main function is gone. I could tank a whole raid without it, and it would be successful. I could not do that before.

Just imagine a boss with for example baleroc's inferno blade, and you are not unhittable. Currently, you can use shield block to cover your ass for the whole duration. With the new model, you would block the first hit, and, if the gods dont smile on you, eat the next 5 in the face and die.

[wariofan1]

Not a tank, but I really hate how it looks like us Fury Warriors will end up being even more of a 'spam ability when it's off cooldown' class with the removal of Colossus Smash. Also, no really awesome fury warr talents.

[Deleted]

The worse thing that has changed about SB is its applicability to multiple-mob situations. Out SB is now weaker than the druid's buff that is on a 5 second timer, and also weaker than the DK/Paladin heals because ours scales with damage taken in a single strike, rather than a fixed amount. In multiple mob situations the damage per strike tends to be significantly less than a single target situation.

Yes but on the other hand we have Thunder Clap and Demoralizing Shout.

edit: Or oh wait. No. Demoralizing Shout doesn't exist in MoP. But assuming other tanks don't get a TC equivalent we'll still be the stronger tank in most AoE scenarios.