Ret Gurthalak nerf

[Vonballz]

Simca Edit: I'm hijacking this OP because it was a complaint about mods locking the old thread for Gurth.

Rets are going to want to discuss the nerf, and locking threads will not stop the discussion.

[sizzlinsauce]

our rets are top on meters wtb fix

[Dlucks]

It wasn't a nerf. It was fixing a bug between the sword and a seal that was causing it to have double the proc chances then other classes.

[Abandon]

I think since there is a blue post explaining the change to it and the reasoning behind it on the front page of the website, they might have thought there wasn't much need for a "breaking news" type thread, and if players were flaming or "qq"ing as you said, it makes sense to lock it I suppose.

[Deleted]

A bug that has been for ages since Tiny abomination in a jar and shadowmourne that kept ret on pair with other dps concerning proc on melee swing. Not a nerf you say? ok then where is compensation for the bug now that ret is falling at the bottom of melee dps chart?

[Citykid]

wich in turn turned us down to having half the procc chance of other classes...

[datrupimp]

in b4 close




Please don't spam -Myrrar

[kovtheinsane]

sure, it was "bugged, giving us two chances to proc" on every swing, but then again where are we on dps, rly far from warriors still. Only last night, on ultraxion, our warrior's tentacles did 2.2 million dmg. My tentacle dmg was 1 million at most, with some lowish 400k on some attempts (heroic ultraxion attempts/kill). I used to have 1.6 million on average in a 6min pull of ultraxion. /wave goodbye to good parses. Havent tested it before the nerf in pvp but sometimes i could proc up to 4 tentacles at the same time on pve content, i suppose thats why pvpers were QQing. Now i get to go back down the meters slightly

[Albert the fish]

ITT: Rets try to convince the world that game flaws and bugs are ok if they are the ones that benefit.

[Vonballz]

ITT: Rets try to convince the world that game flaws and bugs are ok if they are the ones that benefit.

What you call a bug has been the norm for years, since Ret doesn't exactly have many actual physical melee attacks, CS and TV being the only ones, giving us a much lower chance to proc, this "bug" is what kept us on par with other melee classes to proc such abilities.

Anyway, I don't even want to argue that point, I'd rather know if anyone has done any testing to see if Sulfuras Norm > LFR Gurth.
I think LFR Gurth still comes out ahead.

[tyggyr]

I'd like to note that the proper thing here is not only to fix the bug where rets (and prots) get double proc chance, but also to buf ret so that it's where it should be.

If you keep the bug so that ret's in the right spot, then it's only in the right spot if you've got that weapon; if you happen to have a different weapon, you're still in the dumps - keeping the bug would be the wrong answer.

[Kisko]

You can call it whatever you like - bug, feature or divine intervention, but if my damage drops 9% overnight and I have absolutely no means to compensate for it, I call it what it is - a freaking nerfbat. Dixi.

[Vonballz]

5+ mins straight on the target dummy, full rotation, 1 proc. Just sayin.

[Loaf Lord]

At least it soothes the anger of gurthalak never dropping for me.

[Malthanis]

So, apparently the paladin community isn't supposed to discuss this?

The other thread was shut down by a Mod.

Sure, there was some qq, as expected. Isn't this the place to discuss how massive or minor this nerf is and how it's going to effect Ret Paladins.
I saw no reason for the other thread to be closed when this is basically "breaking news" in the Ret Pally world.

So you open another thread on the exact topic, and complain about moderator actions? When a thread starts getting reports that blow up my phone constantly, it needs closed.

If this can remain a calm, rational discussion on how this will affect Retribution DPS, it will remain open. If it attracts too many trolls, or if the majority of posts are "waaaaah mah deeps", I will close it again.

[Naididae]

Omg, can people srsly understand that it wasn't a bug!? Seals ALWAYS behaved as melee strikes, ALWAYS. That only made up for the fact that ret has very few melee attacks.
Our chance to proc was far from being double that of an arms warrior for example, more like 20% more at best, but on top of that we don't have a mastery that can increase it's damage like DKs and we are more gcd constrained, which basically meant we were on par with how other classes worked with the sword (dks being slightly weak in reality).
You CAN NOT take the statistical aberrations of the top parses where some ret had the tentacle doing 15% of his damage, because those aren't the norm.

[Vonballz]

Yeah, that's pretty much what I did.

I'd like to see some discussion on this and haven't noticed anyone going "waaaaaaaaaaah" yet.

Realistically though, I've seen roughly a 4k dps drop. What about you guys?

[Equalizer]

From my understanding the only way to proc the tentacle now is from Auto-attacks, Crusader strike and Templar's verdict? So our chance to proc it was basically halved, on single target? Whereas lets say an Arms warrior can proc it off...

auto-attack, overpower, MS, CS, heroic strike, slam, execute and does their mastery proc it?

[Reith]

From my understanding the only way to proc the tentacle now is from Auto-attacks, Crusader strike and Templar's verdict? So our chance to proc it was basically halved, on single target? Whereas lets say an Arms warrior can proc it off...

auto-attack, overpower, MS, CS, heroic strike, slam, execute and does their mastery proc it?

Auto-attacks, CS, TV, Judge and Hammer of Wrath. That's it. All the other melee will have a higher percentage than us at this point. Exorcism used to proc it via Seal of Truth, but yeah... that's gone since Seal of Truth won't proc it anymore, so it's more than half the proc opportunities gone.

Also, I hope it was only a change to the way the weapons themselves worked with Seal of Truth, since if it was a change with the way Seal of Truth hits were treated instead, we could see lowered Landslide uptime.

[hiddeh]

From my understanding the only way to proc the tentacle now is from Auto-attacks, Crusader strike and Templar's verdict? So our chance to proc it was basically halved, on single target? Whereas lets say an Arms warrior can proc it off...

auto-attack, overpower, MS, CS, heroic strike, slam, execute and does their mastery proc it?

procs on judgement too