No "Miracle Solution" for 5%

[Jaerin]

I don't see myself saying there isn't any issue. I was simply saying too f'ing bad this isn't a PVP game. Suck it up and move on.

[Glorious Leader]

Hero folk seem to be distancing themselves from TOR. They are all too eager now to point out that they had no interaction in the past 3 years. Seems like they would want to bask in as much glory as possible if their engine was even the basis for a game that performs correctly.

Right that's what that means. If you actually went through that thread the president and coo had good things to say about swtor and BWs use of the engine. Oh well... I tried.

[Roose]

I did read it. I am still confused as to why my rig works when many others like it don't. I was more asking you, since you seem to have an understanding of the issue beyond my own, if you have any insight on why.

No idea. That is the whole mystery. There does not seem to be any consistencies. PCs that should barely run it are having no isses and PCs that should blow it away are struggling, and some every place in between.

Remember, this is the new version of a thread initially started during EGA on Dec 15th.

---------- Post added 2012-01-25 at 05:51 PM ----------

Right that's what that means. If you actually went through that thread the president and coo had good things to say about swtor and BWs use of the engine. Oh well... I tried.

Sorry, but you are obviously biased.

[Jaerin]

Hero folk seem to be distancing themselves from TOR. They are all too eager now to point out that they had no interaction in the past 3 years. Seems like they would want to bask in as much glory as possible if their engine was even the basis for a game that performs correctly.

More conspiracy theories...just keep them coming. Might want to try some facts rather than speculation and ancedotes.

[Glorious Leader]

No idea. That is the whole mystery. There does not seem to be any consistencies. PCs that should barely run it are having no isses and PCs that should blow it away are struggling, and some every place in between.

Remember, this is the new version of a thread initially started during EGA on Dec 15th.

---------- Post added 2012-01-25 at 05:51 PM ----------



Sorry, but you are obviously biased.

LoL. Your the one with the rig that can't play the game and I'm biased. Gotcha. Sorry but calling me biased is a tad hypocritical don't ya think?

[RoninaThorstone]

LoL. Your the one with the rig that can't play the game and I'm biased. Gotcha.

That feeling when a thread begins to lurch off the rails...

[schippie]

That feeling when a thread begins to lurch off the rails...

Agree.. another SWTOR thread derailed thank you all..

Im going to leave it at this:

A thread that started december 15th 2011 with over 100 000 replies. Has still to this day not had an official but simple confirmation. "Yes the game is not optimized well" They still have not said this.

One thing i do know is this:

This is not an incident anymore, and sayin: Ah well only 5% without any proof its not more or less is just as untrue as me saying its 50%. If it was only 5% it would have never become a 14 chapter thread with over 100 000 replies but okay.

It is not an Incident:

"An event which is not part of the standard operation of a service and which causes or may cause disruption to or a reduction in the quality of services and Customer productivity."

This is a Problem (one that needs to be fixed by bioware because its no longer the fault of the customers. Since pretty much ever single thing has been tried from old graphic drivers to using XP as OS nothing helped).

"A cause of one or more Incidents. The cause is not usually known at the time a Problem Record is created, and the Problem Management Process is responsible for further investigation."

[philefluxx]

Snip.....

Schippie
Yes the SWTOR process can utilize more than 2gig as I see it utilize close to 3 when Im running it. Now there is a second process, but this seems to be using very little system resources and I too am not sure what it is. But I can tell you this, it can very well be a client side anti-cheat and this is something BW would not disclose. Because EA backs it, I wouldnt be the least bit surprised if it was. If you play any BF games look at your running processes, you will see the BF process in addition to PunkbusterA and PunkbusterB. Punkbuster running multiple processes has nothing to do with resource limits or threading, at least as far as what is disclosed.

I dont discredit some of what is being said in those posts, but I do have to disagree with the statement that the 32bit process is locked into 2gig as I know for a fact it is not when running in a 64bit environment.

[Glorious Leader]

This is not an incident anymore, and just sayin ah well only 5% without any proof its not more or less is just as untrue as me saying its 50%. If it was only 5% it would have never become a 14 chapter thread with over 100 000 replies but okay.

It could have, one does not logically imply the other. I mean it could be 10% as well, people could just be repeating themselves and arguments could be going around. People could be offering advise, mods could jump in and ask for DXDIAG. People like me could post "hey look SR has a blog post coming out". Assuming that the 100,000 posts are all unique posters with unique sets of problems would still only lead to about 100,000 out of 1.68million. That's assuming that every single post is entirely a unique user with a problem, none of the posts are mods or trolls or people offering help. Fairly unlikely.

The truth is we will likely never know how widespread the issues are with the game. Having said that I agree this should be a top priority for them to work on and even if their is no miracle fix I expect to see improvements coming down the pipeline shortly. We'll get a better idea of what exactly is up when that dev blog is released. Then again I biased apparently... go figure.

[RoninaThorstone]

Ah well only 5% without any proof its not more or less is just as untrue as me saying its 50%. If it was only 5% it would have never become a 14 chapter thread with over 100 000 replies but okay.

Assuming 2mill copies sold...

2,000,000 x .05 = 100,000.

I'm just saying.

[Hellfury]

Iam the 5% "acording to bioware"

My rig is decent I can trow anything at it and plays just fine except SWTOR, and my probleam isnt just in WZ, its everywhere.

If I log on a planet its fine if I go travel arround between illum, fleet and flashpoints the disk led starts activate like crazy even after 5mins loading screens it means assets arent being properly cached, garbage collecting its barely happening or the game is memory leaking.

[schippie]

Schippie
Yes the SWTOR process can utilize more than 2gig as I see it utilize close to 3 when Im running it. Now there is a second process, but this seems to be using very little system resources and I too am not sure what it is. But I can tell you this, it can very well be a client side anti-cheat and this is something BW would not disclose. Because EA backs it, I wouldnt be the least bit surprised if it was. If you play any BF games look at your running processes, you will see the BF process in addition to PunkbusterA and PunkbusterB. Punkbuster running multiple processes has nothing to do with resource limits or threading, at least as far as what is disclosed.

I dont discredit some of what is being said in those posts, but I do have to disagree with the statement that the 32bit process is locked into 2gig as I know for a fact it is not when running in a 64bit environment.

True in a 64 bit it isnt limited to the 2 gigs. On the other hand what do you define as small for the second process. Since the main is something like 900 and the second one is 200 or something (This was when i checked after the game crashed on a loading screen so otherwise i probably never would have noticed there where two processes running. Should check when its running normally on hoth.) Then again 200mb isnt that much i guess

If it was 200 - 250 it only uses slightly more then chrome.exe with extensions they are both equal. That does make me wonder, if you are correct and its EA sniffing. Why is this process this large.. i mean wow has a similar tool build into it but i find it hard to believe that would also be 200+.

[Eldar45]

Am I the only one who hates this "5%" tag that has been tossed around with this issue. It is sensationalism, and that is all.

And yes, I am also having FPS problems in Warzones, have tried everything to fix it, and still nothing works. It MIGHT be that my system can't handle it, but I've seen people with far lesser systems running the game at higher settings with less FPS stuttering.

I'm about to queue for some more Warzones, enjoying them because they are fun no matter what technical problems there are between my computer and the game.

And I really hope they come up with a fix soon, but I never tried to get my hopes up for a "Miracle fix", because even as someone who has never done any programming ever, I know that miracle fixes are very few and far between.

[Fiddlesnarf]

Most technical issues are over blown due to the vocality of those afflicted by them. Ofc, there are folks with "horrible FPS" in warzones or that experience ability delay, but in most circumstances that is a minority compared to the folks who never have such issues.

Guess I been extremely lucky, I rarely encounter massive technical issues in MMOs. Nothing really breaking for me yet since TOR went live.

Oh hey! The problem doesn't affect you so naturally you don't think its a problem.

[Hellfury]

I've not got SWToR installed so i can't check personally, but i get the idea from a quick search that it is LAA enabled. This would lead me to believe that Bioware have really gone out of their way to offload onto a secondary process, possibly not realising that in fact, they have 3GB to go at on all systems. If i'm honest though, it seems more like they didn't put the required amount of work into the true technical side and instead just ripped off a "public" engine failing to realise the shortcomings.

It is, it was one of the first things I went to check with CFF explorer, I remenbered this particular header in Oblivion and Fallout3 made a huge deal in smother gameplay.

In Swtor on and off makes for me no diference at all, it consumes the same memory.

[baldbull]

I like man others had the FPS issues as well. I actually had an additional problem where my screen would freeze every minute or so for like 15 seconds. Randomly, that freezing was fixed in their new 1.1 patch. This told me it was not my machine, rather their game and engine. Will these problems be fixed? IDK. I do know they have said they are looking into these types of issues. I have unsubscribed for the time being, yesterday was my last day. I may come back in a few months when the game is straightened out, however, I have a feeling a lot of people will be gone by then but who knows. They just shouldnt have rushed this game out.

[Beavis]

Am I the only one who hates this "5%" tag that has been tossed around with this issue. It is sensationalism, and that is all.

It's funny, I thought my performance was fine until I started reading these threads. I turned on the FPS doodad and sure enough my frame rate went from 40-50 fps to 15-20 in war zones and Ilum. I also started noticing the stuttering in fleet more. If I think about it, I suppose I noticed. But, I guess I just didn't really care. I remember playing Arathi Basin back in '06 with the clip plane so low that I could barely see black smith from farm. I guess I'm just willing to tolerate a certain level of crappy performance if the game is fun. Being old FTW, I guess. /shrug

[Standing]

Stephen Reid acknowledged the "Horrid FPS" that many are getting in warzones and other areas of the game: "...don't expect a miracle solution I'm afraid." The thread is on the Nth go round now. I, like many others, can no longer post because of lack of sub, but there are still many with subs hoping to play all of the game with decent frame rates.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=233714

That is really too bad.

I call it the Vangaurd problem, and I think BioWare/EA understate the problem as only 5% (if that's their number) for PR purposes. A simple survey of general chat in Ilum will tell you that. It's been so long and I can't find it, but there was all types of discussion on this type of Video performance issue back 5 or 6 years ago. Essentially, you have the people who will and can afford top end machines, can spend a few hundred for video card updates, etc. Then you have a significant number much greater than 5% who will have computers that are more than 2 or 3 years old, and are probably still good mid range machines. (edit: though this issues is not quite so black and white with TOR and the randomness of machines that can run it).

When Vanguard came out they tried to make the graphics, at least they said they did, advanced enough the engine would be sufficient for years into the future--because gaming nerds like myself wanted better graphics because we had better computers. The problem of course is people with low end machines, mid range or whatever, can't enjoy the game. They effectively reduced their potential market base because of it, and this was well known.

Another example of bad management choices when it comes to TOR. I like the game a lot too, and still have my sub.

[Razeo]

It's funny, I thought my performance was fine until I started reading these threads. I turned on the FPS doodad and sure enough my frame rate went from 40-50 fps to 15-20 in war zones and Ilum. I also started noticing the stuttering in fleet more. If I think about it, I suppose I noticed. But, I guess I just didn't really care. I remember playing Arathi Basin back in '06 with the clip plane so low that I could barely see black smith from farm. I guess I'm just willing to tolerate a certain level of crappy performance if the game is fun. Being old FTW, I guess. /shrug

Your lucky, I wish I ran Ilum at 15-20 fps.... myself? Try 5-7 fps, sometimes it goes all the way down to 2 or 3 and my rig is decent. Not top of the line now, but it was back in 2009, I can run games like BF3 and black ops at pretty smooth framerate at the highest settings, not to mention i just upgraded my vid card to a 560 GTXti 2 months ago for ToR. This really sucks for me, because Ilum was one of the main reasons why I was looking forward to ToR but these performance issues are stopping me from even playing there, its just THAT unplayable for me.

[schippie]

Hi folks, I apologize for the delay in updates on this issue, but as I mentioned before, we needed time to gather data and put all of our information together in one digestible format.

We just finished editing a document that we hope to be able to publish as a forum post here in the CS forums as early as tomorrow.

I can tell you that it's going to be a guide on optimization performance (which includes FPS) for your PCs.

Thank you all for sharing your experiences here and for your patience as we work to continually improve your gaming experience.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showt...233714&page=26

Im slightly worried by this statement. We ofcourse wil just have to see and wait. But if the responses in the past are anything to go by .. this guide wont add anything to the stuff that already has been tried out. Which is an insane amount of stuff from using Windows Media player together with swtor (apparently could improve preformance for 1 person) To checking if the d3d9 seemed to not be there for most people (According to another person).

I think this post also proves one thing.. there is no fix for the issues. And it simply comes down to that the current engine is not up for the task especially not with multiple people together in a small area.

Aion did this properly unfortunately i think its safe to say. The FPS problems wont be fixed, and a small guide is the only thing all those people are going to get with preformance issues. One thing that does bug me i guess in the end they promised 100+ ILUM battles and this is simple not doable well it is with 5 fps.. (and before you ask for proof it was one of those videos with a Q&A a long time ago. Saw it on the official forums but have no clue where to find it now. If anybody has the link and would want to post it)

Edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTgbKxnHIdw&#t=1m28s < That is the link