NCSoft files lawsuit to thwart TERA launch

[papajohn4]

So lets say that you are a very talented artist that get a job to NCSoft..and you are starting working for years on a project and YOU create some very beautiful artwork..of course the company that hired you put the name on this artwork because this is how companies work...

one day the company, some monkeys with lots of money and zero talent, fire you and cancel the project but they claim all your work...

you take your work of years and you leave...

illegal with human laws(I mean company laws, since politicians are their pets)? yes

illegal in simple human eyes? NO

thats my opinion..these people worked hard and created something..they could simple recreated and not stole it..if I paint a tree and sell it to you, does that mean that it's illegal to paint same tree again?

[Lothaeryn]

So lets say that you are a very talented artist that get a job to NCSoft..and you are starting working for years on a project and YOU create some very beautiful artwork..of course the company that hired you put the name on this artwork because this is how companies work...

one day the company, some monkeys with lots of money and zero talent, fire you and cancel the project but they claim all your work...

you take your work of years and you leave...

illegal with human laws(I mean company laws, since politicians are their pets)? yes

illegal in simple human eyes? NO

thats my opinion..these people worked hard and created something..they could simple recreated and not stole it..if I paint a tree and sell it to you, does that mean that it's illegal to paint same tree again?

The problem with this is the fact that when you join a company, everything you make is company property, no questions asked.

Most contracts will have a disclosure that will state that any and all properties that are created under their employ is their property, if you get your ass fired for whatever reason it ends up as your own fault for agreeing to the terms of your employment, whether you like it or not.

Personally I find it harsh, but that is the law. However, I think they should get 100% credit for any and all works that they made under the employ of the company if they decide to publish their work later.

[Deleted]

The problem with this is the fact that when you join a company, everything you make is company property, no questions asked.

Most contracts will have a disclosure that will state that any and all properties that are created under their employ is their property, if you get your ass fired for whatever reason it ends up as your own fault for agreeing to the terms of your employment, whether you like it or not.

Personally I find it harsh, but that is the law. However, I think they should get 100% credit for any and all works that they made under the employ of the company if they decide to publish their work later.

Unfortunately this is correct. It doesn't matter if it was their work, the L3 code belongs to NCsoft and that's that.

But I wouldn't worry about TERA because the lawsuit doesn't mention much about the Lineage 3 code being used by TERA, it tries to make them look guilty for using similar concepts to those of Lineage 3.

It's also worthy to note that the former leaders of project Lineage 3 where found guilty because they stole the code and apparently intended to sell it but it was never proven in Korean court that the code was used to make TERA. IMO it's really unlikely that they will prove anything.

[CynicalOtaku]

So lets say that you are a very talented artist that get a job to NCSoft..and you are starting working for years on a project and YOU create some very beautiful artwork..of course the company that hired you put the name on this artwork because this is how companies work...

one day the company, some monkeys with lots of money and zero talent, fire you and cancel the project but they claim all your work...

you take your work of years and you leave...

illegal with human laws(I mean company laws, since politicians are their pets)? yes

illegal in simple human eyes? NO

thats my opinion..these people worked hard and created something..they could simple recreated and not stole it..if I paint a tree and sell it to you, does that mean that it's illegal to paint same tree again?

Except according to the information from RockPaperShotgun, the instigator was fired for cause (he was disgruntled with his salary and actively trying to recruit other developers), not because of the project being cancelled. The rest left the project to follow him.

If you aren't happy with the money you're making, you either man up and leave or man up and deal with it. You don't actively conspire to steal developers and code. That is wrong even in "simple human eyes", as you put it.

[Mothhive]

Except according to the information from RockPaperShotgun, the instigator was fired for cause (he was disgruntled with his salary and actively trying to recruit other developers), not because of the project being cancelled. The rest left the project to follow him.

If you aren't happy with the money you're making, you either man up and leave or man up and deal with it. You don't actively conspire to steal developers and code. That is wrong even in "simple human eyes", as you put it.

Bingo! Being underpaid does not give you the right to steal from the company you work for and sabotage the project they have been paying you and your co-workers to create for them. This disgruntled employee is in the wrong legally and morally.

[Deleted]

Bingo! Being underpaid does not give you the right to steal from the company you work for and sabotage the project they have been paying you and your co-workers to create for them. This disgruntled employee is in the wrong legally and morally.

Which is why he was convicted in Korean court, however this doesn't have much to do with the lawsuit that NCsoft made which is the topic of this thread.

[Mothhive]

Which is why he was convicted in Korean court, however this doesn't have much to do with the lawsuit that NCsoft made which is the topic of this thread.

Doesn't have much to do with it? The whole lawsuit is about preventing them from releasing (and profiting from) a game which contains source code, artwork and copyrighted work stolen from NCSoft. Just because someone did time for their crime, doesn't mean they can profit from what they stole afterwards.

[Thyrial]

Which is why he was convicted in Korean court, however this doesn't have much to do with the lawsuit that NCsoft made which is the topic of this thread.

Actually it has everything to do with it since the company is profiting from a project based in some part on that stolen work which is why they are filing suit.

Also as far as them filing in the US because it failed in Korea, something failing in Korean courts does not mean anything when it comes to the US courts. They would have filed this suit upon announcement of the release whether they were successful in Korea or not because the laws are different here. Just because the company was found to not be responsible in a Korean court does not mean that they were not responsible in the eyes of the US legal system.

[Deleted]

Actually it has everything to do with it since the company is profiting from a project based in some part on that stolen work which is why they are filing suit.

Also as far as them filing in the US because it failed in Korea, something failing in Korean courts does not mean anything when it comes to the US courts. They would have filed this suit upon announcement of the release whether they were successful in Korea or not because the laws are different here. Just because the company was found to not be responsible in a Korean court does not mean that they were not responsible in the eyes of the US legal system.

As I posted a little earlier the former leaders of project Lineage 3 where found guilty because they stole the code and intended to sell it to a Japanese company but it was never proven in Korean court that the code was used to make TERA. It doesn't matter if laws are a little different because it seems that NCsoft doesn't have substantial evidence pointing to the fact that TERA was made from the L3 code.

EDIT: That's the only thing that matters, NCsoft can't prove that TERA uses the L3 code just by saying that some of their emplyees ran off with the code and tried to sell it.

[papajohn4]

The problem with this is the fact that when you join a company, everything you make is company property, no questions asked.

Most contracts will have a disclosure that will state that any and all properties that are created under their employ is their property, if you get your ass fired for whatever reason it ends up as your own fault for agreeing to the terms of your employment, whether you like it or not.

Personally I find it harsh, but that is the law. However, I think they should get 100% credit for any and all works that they made under the employ of the company if they decide to publish their work later.

I Know that what they have done was illegal and I know that they had a disclosure about that. But as far as I know they didn't stole the work of others but they took their job with them..it wasn't like john leaves and bob stays, john takes the work of bob while he is leaving...I think it was like, john and bob leaving and they take with them their work..also do we know if they left by their will or they got fired?or even ncsoft cancel the project?

As I said I know this is illegal but I can understand why they did that...

Unfortunately this is correct. It doesn't matter if it was their work, the L3 code belongs to NCsoft and that's that.

But I wouldn't worry about TERA because the lawsuit doesn't mention much about the Lineage 3 code being used by TERA, it tries to make them look guilty for using similar concepts to those of Lineage 3.

It's also worthy to note that the former leaders of project Lineage 3 where found guilty because they stole the code and apparently intended to sell it but it was never proven in Korean court that the code was used to make TERA. IMO it's really unlikely that they will prove anything.

I understand that they cannot prove anything or maybe there is nothing wrong at all, but while the case is open and until the final judgment, can Tera online go Live? Is the case going to be closed until May 1?

[Halicia]

I understand that they cannot prove anything or maybe there is nothing wrong at all, but while the case is open and until the final judgment, can Tera online go Live? Is the case going to be closed until May 1?

Unless there's actually an injunction preventing release, there should be no reason Tera shouldn't proceed as normal. (it just becomes a risk on the company's part if they are found guilty and forced to forfeit some of the proceeds or stop the service altogether).

[DragonX7]

TERA still seems to be charging ahead for it's planned release date regardless of the lawsuit, so I'm not too worried. Even if it was pushed back a bit, I've waited for over 2 years and a few more days or whatever it is won't kill me.

[papajohn4]

Nice :P can't wait for this game...Combat is like Guild wars, graphics seems the best I have seen in an MMO and there will be a pve server too :P I like pvp but when I want to pvp...it seems very promising and I would expect the same hype as GW2, but it seems most people don't even know for this game.. /sad

Now all that it remains is for ArcheAge to make his way to Europe/USA too :P

[Korgoth]

So lets say that you are a very talented artist that get a job to NCSoft..and you are starting working for years on a project and YOU create some very beautiful artwork..of course the company that hired you put the name on this artwork because this is how companies work...

one day the company, some monkeys with lots of money and zero talent, fire you and cancel the project but they claim all your work...

you take your work of years and you leave...

illegal with human laws(I mean company laws, since politicians are their pets)? yes

illegal in simple human eyes? NO

thats my opinion..these people worked hard and created something..they could simple recreated and not stole it..if I paint a tree and sell it to you, does that mean that it's illegal to paint same tree again?

The artist is not getting paid with a credit on a released game, they are getting paid with money. Money they take in exchange for creating art assets for a company. Knowing full well those assets they create are for that company and no other.

They worked hard, and were paid for that work. Then stole that work back to give to another company to get paid again. You can't take your work, because its not your work, YOU SOLD IT TO THEM!

[Ighox]

I Know that what they have done was illegal and I know that they had a disclosure about that. But as far as I know they didn't stole the work of others but they took their job with them..it wasn't like john leaves and bob stays, john takes the work of bob while he is leaving...I think it was like, john and bob leaving and they take with them their work..also do we know if they left by their will or they got fired?or even ncsoft cancel the project?

According to NCsoft the guy who started Bluehole got fired after they discovered that he was planning his own company and used NCsoft's conference room to have meetings with the L3 team and trying to recruit them.
48 of the developers then quit to join his company and didn't get fired.