Teen Killed In Neighborhood Watch Shooting

[stabetha]

ABC just released video footage where Zimmerman steps out of the squad car at the police station. He has no blood on his shirt, no bandage on his nose, no bandage on his head, no grass stains, and he's not moving in a way that would suggest that he's injured. All but the latter were claims made by the police and his so-called witnesses.

as has already be mentioned in the last two pages
1 any bloody clothes would have been taken into evidence immediately and you don't shoot a guy who is on top of you and not get some blood on your clothes
2 you don't bandage a broken nose
3 when I watch that video there is a point as he is walking away that you can see the top of the back of his head and there is a line or mark about 3 in long that very well could be a cut that has been treated (paramedics did treat him at the scene) and then a couple sec latter he walks through the door way I paused it and saw what looked like two black eyes (indicative of a broken nose)

---------- Post added 2012-03-29 at 01:04 AM ----------

Yeah, I just read them and it was filled with more of the same. Idiotic apologists desperately making excuses as to why they believe that "water isnt' wet". The same brand of idiotic apologists who are stupidly making comments about "White Hispanic" not being an appropriate classification, because in their simplistic mind they equate the word "Hispanic" with the word "Black". These same idiots who just demonstrated their expertise on race with the aforementioned example, then have the gall to claim this entire murder wasn't about race. Because they would clearly know best.

don't forget the idiotic people that think you can shoot some on who is on top of you and not get any blood on your clothes.

[Booshman]

Oh I see. So everyone looking at facts is racist. Everyone who thinks that Zimmerman might have killed Trayvon in cold blood but that there is no evidence to support this is racist? What an awesome argument. Welcome to the thread.

When you respond to someone using a strawman that's stuffed to the gills with hyperbole, it tends to make you look stupid. Which is quite fitting, when you look at what you and your cheerleader below your post said. "Looking at facts" isn't racist. That was just a desperate exaggeration you used in order to try and give your beliefs some sort of weight in the eyes of those reading your post. I can tell debating with you is going to be fun.

[jbombard]

When you respond to someone using a strawman that's stuffed to the gills with hyperbole, it tends to make you look stupid. Which is quite fitting, when you look at what you and your cheerleader below your post said. "Looking at facts" isn't racist. That was just a desperate exaggeration you used in order to try and give your beliefs some sort of weight in the eyes of those reading your post. I can tell debating with you is going to be fun.

The word debate implies that at some point you will be providing an argument based on facts..... Let us know when that happens.

[obdigore]

When you respond to someone using a strawman that's stuffed to the gills with hyperbole, it tends to make you look stupid. Which is quite fitting, when you look at what you and your cheerleader below your post said. "Looking at facts" isn't racist. That was just a desperate exaggeration you used in order to try and give your beliefs some sort of weight in the eyes of those reading your post. I can tell debating with you is going to be fun.

You claimed that anyone with a different view than you is racist in your first post. Oh, I'm sorry. Anyone who isn't SURE that Zimmerman is an evil racist murderer of an innocent child must be racists themselves. What proof do you have that Zimmerman was a racist? Past Altercations or Accusations please, instead of the terribly hyperbole filled newspaper articles of the first couple days this story was picked up. Thanks.

[Booshman]

You claimed that anyone with a different view than you is racist in your first post. Oh, I'm sorry. Anyone who isn't SURE that Zimmerman is an evil racist murderer of an innocent child must be racists themselves. What proof do you have that Zimmerman was a racist? Past Altercations or Accusations please, instead of the terribly hyperbole filled newspaper articles of the first couple days this story was picked up. Thanks.

It's apparent that you have trouble reading (which is no surprise), so let's take this from the top "my noticeably slow but quick to knee-jerk friend". Quote my post and then pinpoint where I did what your accusing me of. TBH though, if you have this much trouble with simple comprehension and making sure you don't project past arguments on to people who disagree with you, then I'm sort of skeptical when it comes to conversing with you. You seem a tiny bit irrational and incredibly emotional.

[obdigore]

It's apparent that you have trouble reading (which is no surprise), so let's take this from the top "my noticeably slow but quick to knee-jerk friend". Quote my post and then pinpoint where I did what your accusing me of. TBH though, if you have this much trouble with simple comprehension and making sure you don't project past arguments on to people who disagree with you, then I'm sort of skeptical when it comes to conversing with you. You seem a tiny bit irrational and incredibly emotional.

Strawman after Strawman, while you do ad homenim attacks against me and seemingly cannot even remember what you have posted in the last half an hour, or last 2 pages of this thread. I will not be responding to you again, hopefully you can find someone else to argue with about arguments instead of the situation the thread is about.

[Pendulous]

Lay off the personal stuff

[Booshman]

as has already be mentioned in the last two pages
1 any bloody clothes would have been taken into evidence immediately and you don't shoot a guy who is on top of you and not get some blood on your clothes
2 you don't bandage a broken nose
3 when I watch that video there is a point as he is walking away that you can see the top of the back of his head and there is a line or mark about 3 in long that very well could be a cut that has been treated (paramedics did treat him at the scene) and then a couple sec latter he walks through the door way I paused it and saw what looked like two black eyes (indicative of a broken nose)[COLOR="red"]

---------- Post added 2012-03-29 at 01:04 AM ----------

1. Yes, because police are prone to keeping an emergency pair of non-Police issue civilian clothes in their squad cars, that they will dress a potentially dangerous suspect in. No? Then perhaps police are known to take their apprehended suspects back into their home from the hospital or ambulance so they can get a fresh pair duds? No again? Then perhaps they...(I'll stop there, because I'm sure you can see where I'm going with this.) Those were the exact same clothes he was wearing when apprehended. Especially since the cop wiped his hand after touching him, because he was wet. Wouldn't be that wet if they were fresh clothes.

2. Pending the severity you sometimes have to. The fact that his nose "was broken" from having his face repeatedly smashed into the concrete (supposedly), that would be the time where the nose would be put into a bandage. He would also have lots of bruising on his face as well, because concrete tends to be unforgiving on flesh and bone.

3. I'll have to re-watch the video for his supposed black eyes. But lines on the head indicating medical treatment? That's one heck of a reach. Have you ever seen a bald head before? It's quite common for the skin on the scalp to have creases in it.

don't forget the idiotic people that think you can shoot some on who is on top of you and not get any blood on your clothes.

That's assuming he shot him point blank. I seem to remember it being stated that there was no exit wound. Which would have been created at point blank on a body a thin as Martin's if he was on top of Zimmerman. The chances for an exit wound diminishes greatly when someone is far back.

---------- Post added 2012-03-29 at 04:46 AM ----------

Strawman after Strawman, while you do ad homenim attacks against me and seemingly cannot even remember what you have posted in the last half an hour, or last 2 pages of this thread. I will not be responding to you again, hopefully you can find someone else to argue with about arguments instead of the situation the thread is about.

Yes...yes...yes. Engaging in "Emergency Face Saving Measures" when it was pointed out that you jumped the gun is incredibly dishonest. Sorry to see you go though.

[Eroginous]

Basically, what's going on right now in the media and in the general public, is a witch hunt. There hasn't been enough time yet for the FBI to do a thorough investigation to find out what really happened and piece it all together. Was the shooting racially motivated? Of course not, it was dark, raining, and the kid was wearing a hoodie while walking away from Zimmerman.

He didn't see the kid then go 'OMG he's black! I better get my gun out and shoot him!' What he DID do was see someone out at night and basically profiled him as a suspicious person based on the fact that he was wearing a hoodie.

However, the exact circumstances of this case have not been revealed yet, and until they do, you guys should put the pitchforks and torches away.

[jbombard]

...
Yes...yes...yes. Engaging in "Emergency Face Saving Measures" when it was pointed out that you jumped the gun is incredibly dishonest. Sorry to see you go though.

Lol, as opposed to you making a bunch of assumptions from a blurry video instead of waiting for the facts to come in.
"Jump the gun"... lmao

Not to mention of course that the majority of your posts are simply attacking other posters instead of actually containing any factual information. But in your defense, there isn't much factual information floating around out there... more the reason for the angry mob to put up their pitchforks and torches and wait to see how it plays out before taking their quart of blood.

User infracted

[Booshman]

Lol, as opposed to you making a bunch of assumptions from a blurry video instead of waiting for the facts to come in.
"Jump the gun"... lmao

Not to mention of course that the majority of your posts are simply attacking other posters instead of actually containing any factual information. But in your defense, there isn't much factual information floating around out there... more the reason for the angry mob to put up their pitchforks and torches and wait to see how it plays out before taking their quart of blood.

Nothing I said was incorrect. If you can't cope with that, then that's a personal problem. Don't use my (admitted) fiery words as a distraction to hide from the fact that even though you want to debate my facts, you chose not to address the greater portion of my last post. Which just shows that you're pretty dishonest. And blurry video? It's not too blurry for people to make out blackened eyes and medical treatment, if it helps their argument right?

User infracted

[jbombard]

Nothing I said was incorrect. If you can't cope with that, then that's a personal problem. Don't use my (admitted) fiery words as a distraction to hide from the fact that even though you want to debate my facts, you chose not to address the greater portion of my last post. Which just shows that you're pretty dishonest. And blurry video? It's not too blurry for people to make out blackened eyes and medical treatment, if it helps their argument right?

Uhmm... which part of your last post? The part where you are making all kinds of assumptions about what happened or didn't happen before that video? Or your posts before that one where basically you were just insulting people. Either way it matters not, I didn't say you were "incorrect", as there is no factual information in any of your posts to determine the correctness of. And yes the video is blurry and people on both sides are seeing what they want to in it. Until we see a police report, or a medical report, we don't know the extent of injury sustained.

[Booshman]

Uhmm... which part of your last post? The part where you are making all kinds of assumptions about what happened or didn't happen before that video? Or your posts before that one where basically you were just insulting people. Either way it matters not, I didn't say you were "incorrect", as there is no factual information in any of your posts to determine the correctness of. And yes the video is blurry and people on both sides are seeing what they want to in it. Until we see a police report, or a medical report, we don't know the extent of injury sustained.

This one of those times where I wish I had one of those facepalm pictures. Using sound logical approaches when it comes down to weeding out the stupid excuses that conflict with actual police protocol isn't an assumption. My god. This weak tactic of "playing the Devil's Advocate because you refuse to see the writing on the wall" by posters here is quite telling. I weep for my generation. I really do.


:edit: Speaking of medical reports. Why hasn't there been one released yet? Something like that (which was compiled the night of, over a month ago) would have been brought out a long time ago if it was going to help Zimmerman's case. Seems reeeeally fishy.

[Droids]

:edit: Speaking of medical reports. Why hasn't there been one released yet? Something like that (which was compiled the night of, over a month ago) would have been brought out a long time ago if it was going to help Zimmerman's case. Seems reeeeally fishy.

Gee, I don't know, maybe the Medical Privacy Act?

lol

Any more lol worthy suspicions you have based on your excruciatingly excessive ignorance?

Secondly, Zimmerman doesn't need to release anything to the public to "help his case". The media and the public are not the jury.

You just all are leeches sucking on whatever you can to satiate some sicko desire for blood and drama.

Infracted: Play nice

[Booshman]

Gee, I don't know, maybe the Medical Privacy Act?

lol

Any more lol worthy suspicions you have based on your excruciatingly excessive ignorance?

Secondly, Zimmerman doesn't need to release anything to the public to "help his case". The media and the public are not the jury.

You just all are leeches sucking on whatever you can to satiate some sicko desire for blood and drama.

How foolish of you to (clearly) think that I was implying that it should be released without his consent. Oh, and Zimmerman (or anyone else in his situation) wouldn't want to use medical information that could have cleared his (or your) name of murder in an instant? That's such ridiculously poor logic.

[KingHorse]

So after 16 years of boxing, 5 years in the army, two that were spent in Afghanistan you are claiming that you have more experience with injuries then I do? I asume you are a doctor?
If you cant accept that, you're too emotinally involved to be rational.

I claimed nothing of the sort. But I think your reaction to this proves my point none the less. Exactly how much of your army training was spent watching grainy video from a distance looking for an injury that had already been tended to with at least basic first aid? And how much time did your boxing trainer spend making you watch grainy video from a distance looking for an injury that had already been tended to with at least basic first aid?

They would be visible on that tape, no person knowing what he would talking aobut would actually dispute a broken nose and cut to the back of the head to not be visible even on a tape like that, its on par with claiming that his nose isnt visible on the tape.

So you equate an injury that could be as small as two inches long and 1/8 inches wide, which is level with the skin and not raised in any way, and has no blood around it because it's already been cleaned/repaired by first response medical staff, is as viable on a grainy video from a poor angle, from a poor distance, as a nose? And I'm the one not being rational? Neet.

The cop in the video doesn't spend 5 seconds looking at the back of Zimmerman's head saying "Wow, I really like the back of your head, wonder how it would look in my lap." He's looking at something specific. Look past your preconceived notions of what you want to see on this video and ask yourself: what the fuck is the fat cop looking at the on back of Zimmerman's head?

I can't imagine he received a blow to the nose hard enough to break it without some blood.

Can you imagine a first response medical staff tending to a wound and not washing the blood away before allowing the police to cuff the guy?

Yeah if anything this shows how terrible a law this is.

Once in a while, we agree. This law needs to either undergo a thorough fixing by people who know what the hell they're talking about, or just be stricken from the books.

[Nish77]

I don't know if this has been mentioned. But a broken nose (not sure if paramedics recorded it as that) or blows to the head...

Wouldn't these produce visible swelling? A broken nose should be fairly swollen even with no blood. A good bump to the head should produce a goose egg.

I didn't see anything like that. Am I wrong in thinking that would be normal in the event of someone smacking a head against the ground or a broken nose?

[KingHorse]

I don't know if this has been mentioned. But a broken nose (not sure if paramedics recorded it as that) or blows to the head...

Wouldn't these produce visible swelling? A broken nose should be fairly swollen even with no blood. A good bump to the head should produce a goose egg.

I didn't see anything like that. Am I wrong in thinking that would be normal in the event of someone smacking a head against the ground or a broken nose?

Good points. What's more telling to me than all of the armchair medical examiners here is actually his apparent emotional condition. He doesn't look like a man that is upset that he just took a life in self defense.

Armchair psychology > armchair medics!

[propriest]

why would he be upset when he defended himself? people these days are so fucking stupid and play the blame game too fast.

[KingHorse]

why would he be upset when he defended himself? people these days are so fucking stupid and play the blame game too fast.

Because reports from the scene said he was distraught. And killing someone for any reason shouldn't look like any other average day.

Also as far as the blame game thing, have you read any of my other posts on the subject?

By the way, what's different about "these days" from any other?