[Megathread] DotA 2

[Keldarin]

I can't envision wasting so much real money on crap. Like... there's literally nothing better you could do with that money? Norwegians really are rich, aren't they?

Eh, I just have a passion for playing the game in low priority. I like to spend money on what I love, and it's just around TI I spend any money anyways.

Also, I just got a 2nd set of the Golden Luna Immortal.

[Hermanni]

I can't envision wasting so much real money on crap. Like... there's literally nothing better you could do with that money? Norwegians really are rich, aren't they?

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Played one pub today. First pub in like 2-3 weeks. Immediately remembered why I don't play pubs anymore and why I don't really play dota anymore.

I can't believe how complete shit the balance in this game is. Troll with 452 ms with literally just SnY and his OP passive ms boost. Storm Spirit in general.

They seriously need to fire Icefrog and hire someone competent or make Icefrog start doing his fucking job. This is fucking inexcusable for a multibillion dollar company.

Best part of not being a mod is not having to fight the impulse to ban you every single day.

Holy fuck can you stop littering this sub with your 3k opinions please. If dota makes you rage punch a wall or something don't give other people headache.

[Lysah]

Storm Spirit in general.

You would love this game I just played. Godlike streak on Weaver, team fight mid, kill 4 enemies. Retreating to base with 300 health left. No problem, easy game. Storm zip zaps 3 screens from river and instakills me. Easy 1k gold + track bounty. Goes from nothing but pers to bloodstone in 90 seconds. Starts instagibbing CM with combo any time she shows up on the map, buys Orchid, suddenly double my networth despite me starting the game 11-1 and free farming safe lane, now instagibs me with his combo as well, game over.

Granted he had track helping him out, but it's like the first 10 minutes of this game don't even matter anymore. It amazes me how quickly people in public games will give up just because lane phase went terribly. You not only catch up with the comeback gold, you can pull ahead in minutes. The 15 minutes the enemy spent tediously controlling every lane and denying you farm can be completely wasted over one team fight.

[LiiLoSNK]

^ Yea ok.

Anywho, the new slardar immortal is probably the greatest immortal of all time. Of all time!

[minteK917]

^ Yea ok.

Anywho, the new slardar immortal is probably the greatest immortal of all time. Of all time!

Alchemist midas is kinda neat too..... too bad alchemist is such a garbage still. Volvo plz buff the ult back bibblethump.

[LiiLoSNK]

I went into the slardar immortal thinking "wow.. nice.. we got a....weird.....chum...stick...thing", but after using it and seeing the octopus mini tidehunter ravage, it was instantly my favorite. Alch's is like the opposite in the sense that it looks insanely cool, but the spell effect is not as great.

I'm surprised they havent given naga an immortal yet. You'd think they'd have tons to work with since she has 4 active spells and she has also been a common pick in tournament play for years. Her immortal should be a radiance that looks like a guitar and she just cruises around strumming it during her ult, which would be changed to the tune of that CeeLo Green "Fuck You" song, lest we forget to fuck ourselves during her gamebreaking ult.

[PizzaSHARK]

Best part of not being a mod is not having to fight the impulse to ban you every single day.

Holy fuck can you stop littering this sub with your 3k opinions please. If dota makes you rage punch a wall or something don't give other people headache.

You have to be literally retarded if you think Storm Spirit is okay. If you think he's okay, provide some useful, intelligent rebuttal or go back to hiding under your fucking bridge.

You would love this game I just played. Godlike streak on Weaver, team fight mid, kill 4 enemies. Retreating to base with 300 health left. No problem, easy game. Storm zip zaps 3 screens from river and instakills me. Easy 1k gold + track bounty. Goes from nothing but pers to bloodstone in 90 seconds. Starts instagibbing CM with combo any time she shows up on the map, buys Orchid, suddenly double my networth despite me starting the game 11-1 and free farming safe lane, now instagibs me with his combo as well, game over.

Granted he had track helping him out, but it's like the first 10 minutes of this game don't even matter anymore. It amazes me how quickly people in public games will give up just because lane phase went terribly. You not only catch up with the comeback gold, you can pull ahead in minutes. The 15 minutes the enemy spent tediously controlling every lane and denying you farm can be completely wasted over one team fight.

Sort of how my game went. Storm was shit tier (claimed he was 4.7k and smurfing but who can tell with first-pick storm pickers? It's not like it requires skill to win) and didn't farm for shit. We didn't lock him down, he just sucked ass at farming. But it doesn't matter, eventually even a garbage tier player will have bottle soul ring treads and storm spirit no longer has mana costs at that point. He went bloodstone first because it's a pub, he got a few kills because it's literally impossible to not get kills as storm spirit if you have a pulse, and pretty soon he was able to zip probably a quarter of the way across the map, deal 600+ damage to everyone he zips past, and still arrive with like 30% of his MP left (in other words infinite.)

Late game it's even worse, I ate 1000 damage from a zip from the fountain after we killed him and he bought back. We were halfway between their t2 and t1 after killing him and the t2 and backing off and it doesn't matter because that hero isn't in any way, shape, or form balanced.

What's fucking hilarious is people think he's balanced because you can stun or silence him. Guess what? BKB removes those and makes you immune to them, Linkens makes you effectively immune to the ones that get through BKB (rexxar, bane, doom, etc), and before you have your BKB, Eul's also dispels silences.

Zip is already fundamentally broken, but it's when SS gets items - and he WILL get items because he farms so fast - that he's completely uncontrollable. The only way to beat an SS pick is to simply outplay the enemy team, and that's pretty much what happens when an SS pick loses.

Which is another point - people need to stop acting like winrate means anything. There are hundreds of variables in every game of DotA and most of them can determine whether you win or lose. A hero can lose a game and still be overpowered, just like a hero can be underpowered and still win a game. I've seen people at high MMR win games with Terrorblade, does that suddenly mean the hero is balanced and not hideously underpowered? Fuck no, it just means those hundreds of other variables came into play.

Hurr, only 48% winrate! Sure, because garbage players like you pick him and play him like shit and feed aggressively because you have no fucking concept of "enemy heroes are missing, I shouldn't dive past t2 to kill that rubick!" or because they forget that BKB exists or some similar shit. Winrates don't matter in pro because that's just a matter of outplaying the other guys. Even the 100% p/b heroes that are commonly accepted as being overpowered don't have 100% winrate when they get picked... most of the time they don't even make it to 60%. Guess that means they're not OP, right? Cuz if it's OP it'll have 100% winrate right?

[Jester Joe]

Anywho, the new slardar immortal is probably the greatest immortal of all time. Of all time!

I dunno if it's just me, but all these new immortals are really solid I feel like. I kinda wish it was one of the compendium rewards.

Like, that Slardar one is great, but I also enjoy the Rubick one and the Clockwerk one.

[PizzaSHARK]

I dunno if it's just me, but all these new immortals are really solid I feel like. I kinda wish it was one of the compendium rewards.

Like, that Slardar one is great, but I also enjoy the Rubick one and the Clockwerk one.

I think AA's is the best. Looks really awesome when fired at long range.

[Jester Joe]

I think AA's is the best. Looks really awesome when fired at long range.

AA's pretty amazing too honestly. I don't think there's a single one that I think is "meh" from them, although I guess if I had to pick a "worst", it would be Tide's helmet.

[Drunkenvalley]

Oh yeah, speaking of shit like smurfs and stuff. This ain't the legit guy is it?

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You have to be literally retarded if you think Storm Spirit is okay. If you think he's okay, provide some useful, intelligent rebuttal or go back to hiding under your fucking bridge.

[PizzaSHARK]

AA's pretty amazing too honestly. I don't think there's a single one that I think is "meh" from them, although I guess if I had to pick a "worst", it would be Tide's helmet.

Tide's hat isn't flashy but the gush animation and the random fish and crap lying on the floor after he uses it is hilarious

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Oh look, more obvious trolling that never gets dealt with.

[Lysah]

Storm's winrate probably isn't high because people below 3k can't use him at all. They miss all of their ults, waste all of their mana on nothing, and feed. And that is where 90% of the games of the world happen. Ursa is 3rd highest winrate period, overpowered hero right? Or maybe just one of the easiest heroes in the game to play for 1k MMR players. Let's look at other low winrate heroes: Chen, Invoker, LD, Bat, Io, Tinker, Profit, Brood, Enchant, Visage, Meepo, Earth, Naga, TB...are we noticing a common denominator here? Oh yeah, heroes that require you to do more than right click your enemy never have good winrates. The statistics are far too watered down by the worst of the worst players in the world that make up the majority of the data.

Storm has a respectable 50% winrate even in competitive after being picked about once every 3-4 games. I actually consider Storm terrible in professional play, he's only really capable of getting one kill early game, and you can stop that burst with a glimmer cape on an ally. Pros are a lot better at supporting each other and not getting picked off and feeding. And yet in spite of all of that, he still gets picked fucking constantly.



As a side note, all of the new immortals are terrible. I got one of each chest for kicks, even though I only really like OD's and maybe Rubick's, and ended up with Necro and BS. Could be worse, BS weapons are okay, but I refuse to be a filthy BS picker this patch. Alch midas is pretty good, wouldn't mind that.

[Jester Joe]

Storm's winrate probably isn't high because people below 3k can't use him at all. They miss all of their ults, waste all of their mana on nothing, and feed. And that is where 90% of the games of the world happen. Ursa is 3rd highest winrate period, overpowered hero right? Or maybe just one of the easiest heroes in the game to play for 1k MMR players. Let's look at other low winrate heroes: Chen, Invoker, LD, Bat, Io, Tinker, Profit, Brood, Enchant, Visage, Meepo, Earth, Naga, TB...are we noticing a common denominator here? Oh yeah, heroes that require you to do more than right click your enemy never have good winrates. The statistics are far too watered down by the worst of the worst players in the world that make up the majority of the data.

Can confirm, Ursa and Jugg are among my highest winrates
http://www.dotabuff.com/players/67476514



Seriously, Ursa is just a stomp for the most part nowadays, that ult damage reduction is crazy, I shrugged off a Laguna Blade with ease.

[Lysah]

Seriously, Ursa is just a stomp for the most part nowadays, that ult damage reduction is crazy, I shrugged off a Laguna Blade with ease.

Yeah, and he can totally ignore blademail
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1669004324
This poor BS didn't know what to do

Right click heroes are also some of my best, it's no surprise, they're easier to win with
http://www.dotabuff.com/players/93874877
I was 29-0 with Leoric but I made the mistake of playing him in games where he sucked and tanked my winrate




If you want my honest opinion, certain heroes being broken is fine. They will never perfectly balance the game to a point where it is always fun and certain heroes aren't a disease on public dota, and that's fine, I don't expect perfection from Icefraud. The problem is that in AP, which is the only mode anybody plays, you can't ban heroes. That right there would fix public dota in a heartbeat. Add 30 seconds to the start of the game to give every player one "pick" which is really a ban. You just lock in your hero whenever and it randoms if you don't pick anything, and then normal pick phase resumes. You hate Invoker for some reason even though he never wins a game anymore? You can make sure you never play against him ever again. Say goodbye to Techies, Bloodseeker, Leshrac, Storm, and Void in my games. Every time one of these FOTM trends develops, it would just get banned out of pubs and that would be the end of it.

This would also help ranked, because it would stop 3500 players from abusing top tier picks to get to 5k and then ruining dozens of games after the patch hits and they can't win a game because they are way out of their league without a broken hero. It would also stop those players from ruining teams when their hero gets picked by the enemy team and they can't play anything else. The fact that the main mode of ranked dota doesn't include a ban phase is just a ridiculous joke, there is no way a game like this should ever actually allow people to pick from the entire pool of heroes. If we accept the fact that it will never be truly balanced, there has to be a way for the players to cut out the broken heroes from their competitive games. The pros do this in CM, it's time to add it to AP.

[Drunkenvalley]

Oh look, more obvious trolling that never gets dealt with.

"People have opinions that don't line up with mine! They must be trolling!" Yeah, sure, whatever Pizza. Whatever you say.

[PizzaSHARK]

"People have opinions that don't line up with mine! They must be trolling!" Yeah, sure, whatever Pizza. Whatever you say.

No, I'm referring to you not providing any sort of rebuttal or intelligent comment. You and the others do this shit constantly. You don't provide any rebuttal, you just make snide bullshit trolling comments and it never gets punished because there's no moderating on MMOC.

Whatever, that's what the ignore function is for. It's clear you never say anything of value to begin with.

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If you want my honest opinion, certain heroes being broken is fine. They will never perfectly balance the game to a point where it is always fun and certain heroes aren't a disease on public dota, and that's fine, I don't expect perfection from Icefraud. The problem is that in AP, which is the only mode anybody plays, you can't ban heroes. That right there would fix public dota in a heartbeat. Add 30 seconds to the start of the game to give every player one "pick" which is really a ban. You just lock in your hero whenever and it randoms if you don't pick anything, and then normal pick phase resumes. You hate Invoker for some reason even though he never wins a game anymore? You can make sure you never play against him ever again. Say goodbye to Techies, Bloodseeker, Leshrac, Storm, and Void in my games. Every time one of these FOTM trends develops, it would just get banned out of pubs and that would be the end of it.

This would also help ranked, because it would stop 3500 players from abusing top tier picks to get to 5k and then ruining dozens of games after the patch hits and they can't win a game because they are way out of their league without a broken hero. It would also stop those players from ruining teams when their hero gets picked by the enemy team and they can't play anything else. The fact that the main mode of ranked dota doesn't include a ban phase is just a ridiculous joke, there is no way a game like this should ever actually allow people to pick from the entire pool of heroes. If we accept the fact that it will never be truly balanced, there has to be a way for the players to cut out the broken heroes from their competitive games. The pros do this in CM, it's time to add it to AP.

No, they can balance heroes properly, it'd just require a fuckton of small nerfs and a handful of big ones that would make people ultra salty because suddenly they can't faceroll anymore. And yeah, limited gameplay modes and AP just being shit in general is the biggest issue in pub DotA especially since the game is balanced around having bans available.

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Storm has a respectable 50% winrate even in competitive after being picked about once every 3-4 games. I actually consider Storm terrible in professional play, he's only really capable of getting one kill early game, and you can stop that burst with a glimmer cape on an ally. Pros are a lot better at supporting each other and not getting picked off and feeding. And yet in spite of all of that, he still gets picked fucking constantly.

Because he's disgustingly consistent and cannot be controlled at all. You can glimmer cape etc to prevent him from zipping through your team and facerolling everyone, but at the same time if he gets BKB and/or Linkens, there's no stopping him either. You can prevent him from killing someone but you can't kill him, and in most cases even if you manage to kill him he has Bloodstone and he's back in 20 sec anyway.

I still feel like most pro players aren't even using zip to the maximum of its potential. It's unlimited invulnerability, tons of free damage (damage from zip plus the 90 dmg from overload proc), you can attack in it, you can use items in it... it's just ridiculous. A Storm Spirit should pretty much never get hit by a projectile if it's not fired at point blank.

Pros are also really big fans of heroes that can recover from bad starts (for obvious reasons), and SS is one of those (SF is another.) We saw way back in... was it DAC?... that even if SS has a shit lane, he can just switch to a remnant build and go wander into the jungle and nuke stacks for 5 minutes and be right back on track. Just like SF, all he needs is a few cheap core items and then he can get kills with his skills and get right back on track like nothing happened. Datdota actually lists SS's winrate in TI5 as 61% over 31 games so far.

[Drunkenvalley]

No, I'm referring to you not providing any sort of rebuttal or intelligent comment. You and the others do this shit constantly. You don't provide any rebuttal, you just make snide bullshit trolling comments and it never gets punished because there's no moderating on MMOC.

Whatever, that's what the ignore function is for. It's clear you never say anything of value to begin with.

Oh, should I give you rebuttal or intelligent comment? Well, here it is: You spend hours upon hours here tirading about hero A, then hero B, then hero C. Usually you're just whinging, with most of your complaints coming across as "I played all-pick where I got pubstomped by a hero that requires a counter," and half the time a real counter isn't even required.

There's not much more to add to these conversations, because you're not here to listen to people's responses. If someone disagrees with you you just tirade the same point in slightly different wording, and if someone happens to agree, especially someone like Lysah, you're eager to circlejerk with them about how the hero is totally OP.

So you know what? You get an eyeroll at this point.

[Lysah]

Datdota actually lists SS's winrate in TI5 as 61% over 31 games so far.

Yeah I was looking at all of 6.84, which was 120-120, nice and even. He has been winning more lately. I was making fun of ppd a while back because he kept picking Storm for sumail even though they kept losing over and over when he did, but it's actually been working out for them lately.

@Drunk
Responding to someone's argument with "you don't even warrant a proper response topkek" isn't really winning you any points. If you don't have anything to actually add to the discussion about Storm, then don't post. We'll be done bitching about him soon enough. Until tomorrow, that is, when he inevitably gets picked in our games because he's in almost every game in pubs and starts out 0-5 and ends up 24-6. I know I, for one, will never cease the bitching until a serious nerf happens to storm. Removing his flying vision on ult was a joke change that didn't nerf him at all.

[LiiLoSNK]

No, I'm referring to you not providing any sort of rebuttal or intelligent comment. You and the others do this shit constantly. You don't provide any rebuttal, you just make snide bullshit trolling comments and it never gets punished because there's no moderating on MMOC.

Sometimes the quick sarcastic eye roll is a lot nicer than blasting someone on the forums with every reason on why they are lying/wrong about something.