1. #19721
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    @Hermanni

    I'm not denying the fact that people lose to Storm in pubs. I'm saying they lose because they don't know how to deal with Storm and play against the hero in the wrong way then cry about not being able to do anything. The thing is, bad Storms don't go into the jungle early. That's like what top MMR players do when they get shut down in lane. That's also what differentiates good mid players from bad ones. Good mid players rotate into jungle between waves and shit.

    Bad Storms tend to gank more at low MMR because it works. Everyone is just bad and the opposing mid doesn't know how to capitalize on that (carry a TP to counter gank or push the mid tower and power farm). Again, this is a player issue.
    It's hard for me to make any judgements based on MMR because last month+ pretty much all my games have been 5-stacks in Reborn, where until recently matchmaking has been a bit wonky. I've like 75% winrate for that time, enemies often seem to be way below us in MMR and half the time aren't even a 5-stack. We clown around and don't tryhard and still win. We played 3 times against some stack that was farming ~100% winrate accounts in Reborn and only lost one game to our awful picks after which those guys just started dodging us. But generally I've seen both of those Storms, the ones that gank after losing mid and the ones that farm. Usually the ones who last pick Storm are the ones who have some idea of what they're doing and know when to just farm, which makes them doubly annoying.

    But again, the issue is that Storm can just capitalize on one or more weaker players/heroes in your team. You can know exactly how to deal with Storm but it won't always help when your teammates aren't on the same page. And even when you know how to deal with Storm he can still put a lot of pressure you, knowing you can't farm a lane alone anywhere on some heroes when an Orchid Storm is in the opposing team is more than mildly annoying.
    Last edited by Hermanni; 2015-09-08 at 03:24 AM.

  2. #19722
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1777905521
    hey look, I shrekt a Storm picker too

    Still a bullshit hero
    What's your point? You are the one telling me to reproduce how easy it is for me to beat Storm and prove to you I'm a TA god. What do you want me to do except for what I already linked? Do you want me to purposefully make the games close and do you want me to change my playstyle to chasing Storm all game?


    Quote Originally Posted by Hermanni View Post
    But again, the issue is that Storm can just capitalize on one or more weaker players/heroes in your team. You can know exactly how to deal with Storm but it won't always help when your teammates aren't on the same page. And even when you know how to deal with Storm he can still put a lot of pressure you, knowing you can't farm a lane alone anywhere on some heroes when an Orchid Storm is in the opposing team is more than mildly annoying.
    5-stacks vs 5-stacks are way different. I actually can't play those games. I shit on their entire team then they start to 5-man Dota and I refuse to play that way so I just yolo into 5 heroes and feed.

    My style against Storm works. I don't need my teammates to be on the same page. I just need to render the Storm useless in the fights I'm in and create space for my team.

  3. #19723
    Deleted
    All this talking about TA vs Storm and im just sitting here thinking TA is actually super fucking OP in pubs too.

  4. #19724
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Puffler View Post
    All this talking about TA vs Storm and im just sitting here thinking TA is actually super fucking OP in pubs too.
    TA isn't so much OP as she can play almost any matchup even (yes, that includes "counterpicks" like Viper and Ember who most often just end up feeding instead against a TA that understands those matchups and maxes Meld first instead of Refraction) at worst, and farms very fast. Against uncoordinated teams this allows an even marginally superior laner to exploit the almost guaranteed good start and get far ahead very quickly, but unlike a Storm with a bad start that can catch up quickly and efficiently in the jungle, a TA that's already far behind (i.e ganked 3-4 times) becomes very worthless very quickly.

    Also people who go Phase --> Blink on TA in every fucking game need to stop picking TA. There's a time and a place for that in maybe one out of 100 TA games, but some people insist on doing it and feeding like fucking idiots in almost every game.

  5. #19725
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    What's your point? You are the one telling me to reproduce how easy it is for me to beat Storm and prove to you I'm a TA god. What do you want me to do except for what I already linked? Do you want me to purposefully make the games close and do you want me to change my playstyle to chasing Storm all game?
    Simply listing games that you won and storm happened to be on the enemy team isn't very convincing. We all win games against Storm. Still a bullshit hero.

  6. #19726
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    Simply listing games that you won and storm happened to be on the enemy team isn't very convincing. We all win games against Storm. Still a bullshit hero.
    So what kind of games did you want me to link?

  7. #19727
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    So what kind of games did you want me to link?
    Games where Storm lost and the rest of his team was not feeding would be a start. I see a couple of games where the lineup was simply stacked, one that was over in 12 minutes, and the rest Storm's team is feeding.

  8. #19728
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    Games where Storm lost and the rest of his team was not feeding would be a start. I see a couple of games where the lineup was simply stacked, one that was over in 12 minutes, and the rest Storm's team is feeding.
    Sorry, I can't reproduce that because when I win on TA I just kill everyone. Supports can't do much when they get two shot. As I said, I don't go around chasing Storm when I beat Storms. That's not how I counter Storm. And it works.

  9. #19729
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    Sorry, I can't reproduce that because when I win on TA I just kill everyone. Supports can't do much when they get two shot. As I said, I don't go around chasing Storm when I beat Storms. That's not how I counter Storm. And it works.
    Then you have failed to convince me that Storm is anything other than a bullshit hero. I don't care about your strategy for beating him. I beat him all the time.

  10. #19730
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    Then you have failed to convince me that Storm is anything other than a bullshit hero. I don't care about your strategy for beating him. I beat him all the time.
    Believe what you want. I have shown you how easy it is for me to beat Storm. Now, just because it isn't the same way you want me to beat Storms doesn't matter. It's still easy for me and I have the stats to back it up.

    If you beat him all the time and I beat him all the time, then why is he even strong? Because he is annoying to play against?

  11. #19731
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    If you beat him all the time and I beat him all the time, then why is he even strong? Because he is annoying to play against?
    Because even when you beat him he gets gold, he gets items, and he can kill anyone on your team at any second. It's like playing against Techies. And every time I have a hero like Weaver and start the game 14-0 only to get one shotted by a max range Storm ult and lose the game, I am reminded of how this hero should not exist at all. Just because most people are awful with him doesn't mean he isn't broken.




    You know, imagine if Techies could teleport half way across the map and stun you instantly and then teleport back to safety.


    Hell, even in that LC game I linked, we had a team fight bot when the game was already ridiculously in our favor, and storm gets a triple kill just by showing up and pressing r 3 times. Does it win him the game? No. Does that make it any less bullshit? No.
    Last edited by Lysah; 2015-09-08 at 07:15 PM.

  12. #19732
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
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    Oh my god i can't wait for Warden to come out, at least everyone will forget about how bullshit SS is. Double necro 3 gg wp easy, doesn't matter how far your team got - arc warden will just rat through it. But yeah, as someone who plays supports exclusively SS with orchid and eventually BKB (and you literally have no means to delay his farm outside of sentry-warding both woods) is a bullshit
    Last edited by Charge me Doctor; 2015-09-09 at 03:59 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  13. #19733
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    Oh my god i can't wait for Warden to come out, at least everyone will forget about how bullshit SS is
    Arc Warden will be glorious.

  14. #19734
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crackleslap View Post
    Arc Warden will be glorious.
    Double dagon 5 for giggles
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  15. #19735
    Cant wait to rush divines and just afk fountain while i bot with my illusion to random places

  16. #19736
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    Because even when you beat him he gets gold, he gets items, and he can kill anyone on your team at any second. It's like playing against Techies. And every time I have a hero like Weaver and start the game 14-0 only to get one shotted by a max range Storm ult and lose the game, I am reminded of how this hero should not exist at all. Just because most people are awful with him doesn't mean he isn't broken.
    I don't consider below 400 GPM as getting gold. 30 minute Bloodstone and nothing more isn't "getting items" to me. I don't die to Storms either. So I don't know what you're on.

  17. #19737
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M1r4g3 View Post
    Cant wait to rush divines and just afk fountain while i bot with my illusion to random places
    Eh, its cooldown too high to do that and illusion exists only for 20 seconds. It's really good to double efficiency of Midas and other usable items, but not that good for using a rapier.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    I don't consider below 400 GPM as getting gold. 30 minute Bloodstone and nothing more isn't "getting items" to me. I don't die to Storms either. So I don't know what you're on.
    TA doesn't die to SS, what a surprise. Next time you play WD please do tell me how well your dewarding goes
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  18. #19738
    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    Eh, its cooldown too high to do that and illusion exists only for 20 seconds. It's really good to double efficiency of Midas and other usable items, but not that good for using a rapier.
    Huh why not the cd is only 65/60/55, 20sec is plenty of time to destroy a tower or win a teamfight.

  19. #19739
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    Quote Originally Posted by M1r4g3 View Post
    Huh why not the cd is only 65/60/55, 20sec is plenty of time to destroy a tower or win a teamfight.
    If you have a BoT with upgrade - yeah, your illusion will always be there for a teamfight, but it's a quite an investment, better get necro 3 and /lol at enemy towers with 100% evade.
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  20. #19740
    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    If you have a BoT with upgrade - yeah, your illusion will always be there for a teamfight, but it's a quite an investment, better get necro 3 and /lol at enemy towers with 100% evade.
    Ya the default build will probably be with necro/refresher/manta. That only spawns about 14 units with 100% evasion and 80% attack speed no big deal

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