1. #19761
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by M1r4g3 View Post
    How can you even compare a vlads PA to a radiance WK >_>
    Because the Radiance that game was a good pickup. How is Radiance WK bad? That guy who spammed WK used that build and that was before the Evasion buff and he had a 70-80% win rate I think. Both the TA and PA didn't have MKB to deal with the Radiance. Radiance also removes Refractions. Actually yeah, it can't be compared. WK Radiance was good. Vlads PA was bad.
    Last edited by mmoc9f3c8526e6; 2015-09-05 at 09:56 PM.

  2. #19762
    I have a 100% winrate with vlads PA so your point is invalid, right?
    Like a halberd is 1400g cheaper,gives more survivability and has a great active against both PA and TA, as soon as you activate bkb on TA radiance loses both the evasion and the dps,

  3. #19763
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by M1r4g3 View Post
    I have a 100% winrate with vlads PA so your point is invalid, right?
    Like a halberd is 1400g cheaper,gives more survivability and has a great active against both PA and TA, as soon as you activate bkb on TA radiance loses both the evasion and the dps,
    You do? At top 200 leaderboards MMR level? That's what Hailrake had. If you have that win rate with PA I'm more than happy to admit that I was wrong. Obviously if you're winning with Vlads first PA over a statistically significant amount of games then of course the build works for that level of play.

    Halberd doesn't do shit to BKB either and is much less DPS. Problem with WK is that you get kited. I believe Mjollnir/Radiance/Blade Mail WK style is the most effective. I also think the WK had like a 17 min Radiance. That is way before any normal BKB timing on a Blink and Desolator TA.
    Last edited by mmoc9f3c8526e6; 2015-09-05 at 11:30 PM.

  4. #19764

  5. #19765
    Whats next, radiance ls? radiance sven?
    Why would you ever get radiance over mjolnir/blade mail? cause some random pubstar has a high winrate with radiance?

  6. #19766
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by M1r4g3 View Post
    Whats next, radiance ls? radiance sven?
    Why would you ever get radiance over mjolnir/blade mail? cause some random pubstar has a high winrate with radiance?
    Because it makes you farm faster, makes you more tanky and does more damage even if they don't hit you? Both Sven and LS have spells that increase their strength for a limited period of time (Rage/God's Strength). Radiance doesn't work that well with that. The only problem with WK Radiance is that you don't get it early enough, which the WK in the game I linked had no problem doing.
    Last edited by mmoc9f3c8526e6; 2015-09-06 at 12:55 AM.

  7. #19767
    Radiance WK is terrible because WK is terrible. He's okay on the right lineup as a tank, but he needs actual tank items to do that. 1400 health and radiance at 35 minutes isn't going to be very effective. Radiance WK is fantastic, as like, a 3rd or 4th or 6th item. Not first. Hero sucks at farming.

    Without watching the replay I'm guessing you killed WK in...2 auto attacks late game? Holy shit I almost forgot about the free aegis, 4 auto attacks my bad.

    Anyway I'm not really going to continue this argument much, I was just giving you shit for trying to use a game where you stomped bads as evidence for your argument when you give me shit for doing the exact same thing all the time. Sad truth is both of us play against awfuls 99% of the time which means pretty much all of our games are terrible evidence, which means all of our arguments are terrible because we aren't super elite streamer pro player gods.
    Last edited by Lysah; 2015-09-06 at 08:03 AM.

  8. #19768
    Not sure what's even the point talking about Storm vs. TA. Both are Decent mids, TA might have an edge on the lane but Storm can probably catch up easily in terms of pubs where everyone tries to be sumail now and goes max overload remnant. In team fights Storm doesn't normally go for TA first and TA doesn't normall go for Storm first. In terms of pub play these two heroes have pretty small impact on each other, in my opinion.

  9. #19769
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    Radiance WK is terrible because WK is terrible. He's okay on the right lineup as a tank, but he needs actual tank items to do that. 1400 health and radiance at 35 minutes isn't going to be very effective. Radiance WK is fantastic, as like, a 3rd or 4th or 6th item. Not first. Hero sucks at farming.

    Without watching the replay I'm guessing you killed WK in...2 auto attacks late game? Holy shit I almost forgot about the free aegis, 4 auto attacks my bad.

    Anyway I'm not really going to continue this argument much, I was just giving you shit for trying to use a game where you stomped bads as evidence for your argument when you give me shit for doing the exact same thing all the time. Sad truth is both of us play against awfuls 99% of the time which means pretty much all of our games are terrible evidence, which means all of our arguments are terrible because we aren't super elite streamer pro player gods.
    No, I gave you shit for extrapolating your games to pro games. I explicitly stated that TA is a counter to Storm in pubs.

    WK was the guy who gave the TA the most problems. He was the only reason TA died because he just kept running at TA, removing her Refractions and protecting his team from getting 2 shot and forced the TA to go BKB. Had the WK gone anything else TA could have just run circles around that team. The WK also had like 17 min Midas Radiance. So the timing is way earlier than most WK gets it at .

    @Hermanni

    If you watch the games maybe you understand why. In the laning TA keeps Storm low with Psi Blades and stop him from effectively farming. This happens in all games. But the most game winnning thing with this is what Storm can't farm jungle because he is too low from Psi Blades (again watch the replays if you don't believe me). He can't make a comeback by killing TA at level 6. He can't get runes because lane is shoved all game.

    Storm doesn't go for TA later in the game because he can't go for TA. That is a natural counter. Consider Leshrac and Lina. Storm can go for both of them and that's the difference. People pick Lina or Lesh but don't realize that a Storm can easily snowball off of them because they can die easily. Furthermore, TA does go on Storm in fights. The moment Storm jumps in, TA will just blink on Storm and Meld attack forcing Storm to zip away and have literally no impact in fights. It's the presence of the TA that makes the game extremely difficult for a pub Storm.

  10. #19770
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    WK was the guy who gave the TA the most problems. He was the only reason TA died because he just kept running at TA, removing her Refractions and protecting his team from getting 2 shot and forced the TA to go BKB. Had the WK gone anything else TA could have just run circles around that team. The WK also had like 17 min Midas Radiance. So the timing is way earlier than most WK gets it at .
    And, yet, at the end of the game, he is still a WK and still a walking pile of gold.

  11. #19771
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    And, yet, at the end of the game, he is still a WK and still a walking pile of gold.
    At the end of the game, he had a Storm that lost 80% of his HP after his first jump in fights.

  12. #19772
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    Quote Originally Posted by M1r4g3 View Post
    Whats next, radiance ls? radiance sven?
    Why would you ever get radiance over mjolnir/blade mail? cause some random pubstar has a high winrate with radiance?
    Radiance is good on literally any hero
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  13. #19773
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    At the end of the game, he had a Storm that lost 80% of his HP after his first jump in fights.
    Yeah that'll happen when your entire team goes midas and you can't do anything all game because it's 1v5.

  14. #19774
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    Yeah that'll happen when your entire team goes midas and you can't do anything all game because it's 1v5.
    Is this the shit people tell themselves when they lose pubs and can't get out of MMR hell?

    What did the Storm do for his team? That is what you should ask. The answer? Absolutely nothing because he couldn't because he countered himself by picking Storm into a TA. You could just reverse the question, what could WK do when he had a useless Storm in the game? WK at least shut down the main core of opposing team. That's more than what the Storm did.

    Either way, you can refuse to believe Storm gets countered by TA all you want in pubs but it's no coincidence I don't struggle against the hero

  15. #19775
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    Is this the shit people tell themselves when they lose pubs and can't get out of MMR hell?

    What did the Storm do for his team? That is what you should ask. The answer? Absolutely nothing because he couldn't because he countered himself by picking Storm into a TA. You could just reverse the question, what could WK do when he had a useless Storm in the game? WK at least shut down the main core of opposing team. That's more than what the Storm did.

    Either way, you can refuse to believe Storm gets countered by TA all you want in pubs but it's no coincidence I don't struggle against the hero
    Can't storm just roll around the map ganking supports 24/7 tho ?

  16. #19776
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Puffler View Post
    Can't storm just roll around the map ganking supports 24/7 tho ?
    That playstyle gets harder as you go up in MMR as supports will be more aware of the map. There is a reason no top MMR Storm runs around and gank constantly. It's a high risk playstyle that doesn't always pay off.

    But the beauty of TA as a counter is that even if you wanted to do this, you will get punished. As I said previously, Storm is constantly low on HP due to Psi Blades, he struggles to farm even his Bottle and Boots. That makes you very ineffective if you want to go gank. You also lack rune control. Don't forget that TA constantly pushes the wave so you moving to gank will lead to a very destroyed tower very quickly.

    The Storm in my replay did go gank and he got punished heavily for it (he died).

  17. #19777
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    That playstyle gets harder as you go up in MMR as supports will be more aware of the map. There is a reason no top MMR Storm runs around and gank constantly. It's a high risk playstyle that doesn't always pay off.
    What MMR is this where 3 people go naked midas on the same team? Get over yourself. You're just another shitcan pub like the rest of us in this thread.

  18. #19778
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    What MMR is this where 3 people go naked midas on the same team? Get over yourself. You're just another shitcan pub like the rest of us in this thread.
    It's 3k MMR.

  19. #19779
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    That playstyle gets harder as you go up in MMR as supports will be more aware of the map. There is a reason no top MMR Storm runs around and gank constantly. It's a high risk playstyle that doesn't always pay off.

    But the beauty of TA as a counter is that even if you wanted to do this, you will get punished. As I said previously, Storm is constantly low on HP due to Psi Blades, he struggles to farm even his Bottle and Boots. That makes you very ineffective if you want to go gank. You also lack rune control. Don't forget that TA constantly pushes the wave so you moving to gank will lead to a very destroyed tower very quickly.

    The Storm in my replay did go gank and he got punished heavily for it (he died).
    Hmm makes sense, at my rating if a storm has a bad mid it doesn't really matter.

  20. #19780
    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    Radiance is good on literally any hero
    On non illusion heroes its mostly good if you get it really early because it loses it value overtime.

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