1. #3121
    I'm getting the 522 VP trinket this week. I was wondering which trinket i should replace it with. I currently have the Relic of Xuen (476) and the Terror in the Mist (483) version trinkets.

  2. #3122
    The Lightbringer SurrealNight's Avatar
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    They are pretty close but I would keep Xuen IMO.
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  3. #3123
    Quote Originally Posted by Arxi View Post
    Hey fellow tanks!

    I haven't seen or read anything about yet... I'm getting this week the legendary meta gem, and i was wondering which one should i pick, DPS or Tank one? Considering i'm raiding 10HC.

    Any suggestions?
    I'd estimate that the tanking meta is worth ~2k mastery rating and the dps meta is worth ~6k crit rating. The logical process (if you're concerned about your survivability) would be to use the capacitive meta & reforge into another 2k mastery - you end up having better survival than with the tanking meta, and a fair bit more dps on top.

  4. #3124
    If you take the sphere glyph, your 4 piece bonus will last 3 min
    13/13

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  5. #3125
    Quote Originally Posted by Arxi View Post
    Hey fellow tanks!

    I haven't seen or read anything about yet... I'm getting this week the legendary meta gem, and i was wondering which one should i pick, DPS or Tank one? Considering i'm raiding 10HC.

    Any suggestions?
    The DPS meta is just pure damage -- it doesn't give you any defensive benefit besides faster guards on your raid. Converting it into DPS stats like crit rating is misleading imo, as crit rating gives you EB stacks and the meta doesn't.

    The tanking meta is 20% DR while the proc is up.

    As nice as it is to top meters as a tank (which I suspect won't last into 5.4), my job's to survive first and DPS second. I'm taking the tanking one, personally.

  6. #3126
    The problem with both crit and the tanking meta is that neither does anything to improve your worst case scenario. You don't die when everything goes right, but when everything goes wrong. That is why I gave them the value that I did. If you were just talking about overall damage avoided, then the tanking meta would be worth almost 3k mastery, but since it was random I knocked it down. Same with the dps meta, it's actually worth about 8-9k crit rating if it was a pure dps conversion, but I knocked it down to 6k since it didn't give elusive brew.

    If your only focus is to survive first then neither meta is actually desirable beyond the base stats that they provide and you'd remain with the Austere metagem.

  7. #3127
    Except they changed what can proc the tanking meta now. It used to be auto-attacks only, now it is any damage taken. This ups it's value quite a bit IMHO.

    Indomitable Primal Diamond should now properly have a chance to activate the Fortitude effect received from all damage sources, not just from auto-attacks.
    The tank meta was on average a 40% uptime on most fights, now I can see it possibly being close to 60% uptime with the change.

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  8. #3128
    The Lightbringer SurrealNight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kaiadam View Post
    If your only focus is to survive first then neither meta is actually desirable beyond the base stats that they provide and you'd remain with the Austere metagem.
    Care to do the math on the average EB stack generation the Austere provides? Seems like a better choice than the DPS meta due to providing DPS + defensive stats.

    Still deciding but leaning towards tanking meta just cause it is technically my job first, have to see if 2nd half of ToT is kind on drops this week.
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  9. #3129
    Austere is the 324 stamina + 2% armor metagem.

    Crit for EB for dodge isn't really that great of a conversion; I did the math a few weeks ago and it turned out 1 crit rating was approximately equal to 0.62 dodge rating for overall avoidance (and 0.26 mastery rating if you have 2pT15). If you want pure avoidance stack dodge (or parry, actually.)

    The tank meta was on average a 40% uptime on most fights, now I can see it possibly being close to 60% uptime with the change.
    Tank meta is on RPPM, meaning that number of hits is (theoretically) irrelevant to proc uptime; only real haste matters.
    Last edited by kaiadam; 2013-04-17 at 07:56 PM.

  10. #3130
    Quote Originally Posted by kaiadam View Post
    The problem with both crit and the tanking meta is that neither does anything to improve your worst case scenario. You don't die when everything goes right, but when everything goes wrong.
    Sure, but that can be approached statistically. Over the course of raiding, let's say everything goes wrong 100 times without the tanking meta. With it, you'll have 20% DR for ~40 of those 100, or maybe more like 50 or 60 now that they've buffed it.

    It doesn't save you when everything goes wrong, but it adds one more layer of defenses that have to fail for that to happen. You can't rely on it, but sometimes when you need it, it'll be there.

    Elusive Brew's a 30% chance to prevent 100% of a dodgeable attack, and that's super useful even though it's not guaranteed. The meta has a 50% chance to prevent 20% of any damage. I'd still rather have that than pure damage.

  11. #3131
    Quote Originally Posted by SurrealNight View Post
    They are pretty close but I would keep Xuen IMO.

    Alright i appreciate the response SurrealNight!

  12. #3132
    The Lightbringer Radio's Avatar
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    On the choice of metas:

    Why not have both? Choose based on the fight you're doing!

    I have two of the 522 helms from Jin'rokh to play around with (thank you bonus rolls...) so it was an easy decision for me.

  13. #3133
    Deleted
    Are there people here using elixirs instead of flasks? Basically either 1k agility or 1.5k stamina, vs 750 crit and 2250 armor.
    Just checked on my own character and 2250 extra armor would be 3.32% less physical damage taken, feels like quite a lot already and then we still got 750 crit. Never tried them so was hoping some people had experience with them? I know they don't persist through death but that's not really an issue imo.

  14. #3134
    Quote Originally Posted by Derpette View Post
    Are there people here using elixirs instead of flasks? Basically either 1k agility or 1.5k stamina, vs 750 crit and 2250 armor.
    Just checked on my own character and 2250 extra armor would be 3.32% less physical damage taken, feels like quite a lot already and then we still got 750 crit. Never tried them so was hoping some people had experience with them? I know they don't persist through death but that's not really an issue imo.
    I used them during T14. Worked quite nicely.

    Then I got lazy and just use flasks now.

  15. #3135
    Deleted
    Whats is better at this moment? 8k or 5k of Haste ? I think 5k but too many people say me 8k

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/es/characte...Gheisaa/simple

  16. #3136
    Quote Originally Posted by Clubwar View Post
    Whats is better at this moment? 8k or 5k of Haste ? I think 5k but too many people say me 8k

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/es/characte...Gheisaa/simple
    However much you need to keep up shuffle. It's been done with 2k haste, it's been done with 10k haste, just depends on your experience really.

  17. #3137
    Some ppl say, you push more dps with a total haste ++ build. some ppl say, you have a haste cap at 4,8 to 5,8 k and after that you crit-out.
    look at world of logs and brewmaster dps with armory link, there are these two setups
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  18. #3138
    Quote Originally Posted by Derpette View Post
    Are there people here using elixirs instead of flasks? Basically either 1k agility or 1.5k stamina, vs 750 crit and 2250 armor.
    Just checked on my own character and 2250 extra armor would be 3.32% less physical damage taken, feels like quite a lot already and then we still got 750 crit. Never tried them so was hoping some people had experience with them? I know they don't persist through death but that's not really an issue imo.
    For damage reduction, elixirs are definitely the best choice. Since we wear leather the flat amount of extra armor helps a lot. My rule of thumb is:

    Agility flask for farm content or for extra DPS.
    Stam flask if I need more health (which is not often -- but then I raid 10 man).
    Elixirs for most progression fights.

    Only downside is you do burn through a lot of elixirs this way.


    Quote Originally Posted by siccora View Post
    Some ppl say, you push more dps with a total haste ++ build. some ppl say, you have a haste cap at 4,8 to 5,8 k and after that you crit-out.
    look at world of logs and brewmaster dps with armory link, there are these two setups
    Do people really say that you push more DPS with 8k+ haste as opposed to putting those points in crit? Because that's not true. Haste is a smaller DPS increase than crit, since it doesn't increase the amount of times we can keg smash, it only gives a small number of extra jabs and auto attacks. As well, even though you jab and BOK more often with higher haste, those extra jabs/BOKs are replacing tiger palms, so you're probably gaining less damage than you think. Whereas crit affects all of our damage sources, even though it requires more points per %.
    Last edited by Herschel; 2013-04-18 at 08:10 PM.

  19. #3139
    Deleted
    What about RoR on bm? My guild needs me to tank sometimes and got atm Hc Renataki and Runes but should i use Valor trinket instead of Ror?

    Oh and i got Talisman of Bloodlust too. So should i get these Agi trinkets or go for Tank Trinkets?

    And what is our stat prio? Haste as much as needed (5-7k)? Then just stack crit? And should i Dw or try to get 2h? (Currently i have Thunder forged Tia-Tia and normal mace from Dark Animus).
    Last edited by mmoc50890790d6; 2013-04-18 at 08:45 PM.

  20. #3140
    Read the Last Pages. On every Single Page in this is at least One asking this question.

    ---------- Post added 2013-04-18 at 08:51 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Herschel View Post
    For damage reduction, elixirs are definitely the best choice. Since we wear leather the flat amount of extra armor helps a lot. My rule of thumb is:

    Agility flask for farm content or for extra DPS.
    Stam flask if I need more health (which is not often -- but then I raid 10 man).
    Elixirs for most progression fights.

    Only downside is you do burn through a lot of elixirs this way.



    Do people really say that you push more DPS with 8k+ haste as opposed to putting those points in crit? Because that's not true. Haste is a smaller DPS increase than crit, since it doesn't increase the amount of times we can keg smash, it only gives a small number of extra jabs and auto attacks. As well, even though you jab and BOK more often with higher haste, those extra jabs/BOKs are replacing tiger palms, so you're probably gaining less damage than you think. Whereas crit affects all of our damage sources, even though it requires more points per %.
    I just look at the logs and the armory. Crit build and haste build are represented.
    13/13

    Monk

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