Raw Feeding

[Grizzly Willy]

I know a breeder that does feed all her dogs raw. They have the softest coats I have ever felt on a dog! I'll ask her what a weekly diet looks like for her animals.

I think I'll go join a dog forum as well. I obviously can't rely on these forums (you're the exception) for any dog related information from people who are actually knowledgeable on dogs and wolves.

You know, just saying "I know somebody who does it, therefore it's good" isn't as good as a study that you can let us read. If you want to prove a point provide evidence that we can see for ourselves.

[kiwamaru]

I personally wouldn't. A good comparison I find is kids who've grown up on farms, and kids who've grown up in cities. I have some cousins who live some distance away, and my great uncle is a milk farmer. They can drink the fresh, unpasteurised milk just fine because that's what they're used to and their bodies have developed an immunity against all the little bugs/germs found in it since a younger age, but one of my brothers stayed with them up there one time and got rather sick due to the fact that his body was so used to pasteurized/heat-treated milk that all the little germs and so on that were in the unpasteurised stuff completely took his body by surprise.

It's probably the same with dogs; meat that may very well give us or the dog food poisoning is probably perfectly fine for a wild dog.

I don't know about that exactly...I heard the same thing..but I've been in japan for a year eating all sorts of raw foods and haven't gotten sick once.
I never had anything raw till i came here.
I eat raw fish, egg, squid, fish egg, beef, ham nearly 1 time each a week. A lot of raw egg tho..many times day.
I even had raw horse once.
It's about the food being freah. That's what the Japanese people have told me.
But on topic...I gues It would be fine if its fresh.

1 year ago i thought it was impossible to eat raw meats. That we would get really sick.

[Snow White]

You know, just saying "I know somebody who does it, therefore it's good" isn't as good as a study that you can let us read. If you want to prove a point provide evidence that we can see for ourselves.

I'm not trying to prove a point, I'm trying to gather information from those who use this diet or have tried it. That's all.

[Austilias]

I don't know about that exactly...I heard the same thing..but I've been in japan for a year eating all sorts of raw foods and haven't gotten sick once.
I never had anything raw till i came here.
I eat raw fish, egg, squid, fish egg, beef, chicken, ham nearly 1 time each a week. A lot of raw egg tho..many times day.
I even had raw horse once.
It's about the food being freah. That's what the Japanese people have told me.
But on topic...I gues It would be fine if its fresh.

1 year ago i thought it was impossible to eat raw meats. That we would get really sick.

My point is more the fact that uncooked/untreated foods do tend to have a greater capacity to carry germs/diseases and, in the case of meat, potential worms and the like, that can do us a great deal of harm that cooking and the like often effectively kill/eliminate. I've no doubt the freshness is key, more the fact that is there is a bug which causes food poisoning and the like, it's probably more likely to be found/caught from uncooked food. Freshness is indeed key, but the other thing to remember is that uncooked meat (in the case of dogs) is often much harder to digest; cooking loosens the proteins, softens the fibres and so on, and if the dog is a small breed, like a Bichon Frise for example, then it might experience digestion problems. I gave my dog (which is the breed I mentioned) a bone from the butchers which still had a good mount of leftover meat/gristle etc upon it, and let's just say I was busy cleaning up after the thing for a while. Who knew that a little dog could produce so much...i'll stop there.

[kiwamaru]

My point is more the fact that uncooked/untreated foods do tend to have a greater capacity to carry germs/diseases and, in the case of meat, potential worms and the like, that can do us a great deal of harm that cooking and the like often effectively kill/eliminate. I've no doubt the freshness is key, more the fact that is there is a bug which causes food poisoning and the like, it's probably more likely ito be found/caught from uncooked food. Freshness is indeed key, but the other thing to remember is that uncooked meat (in the case of dogs) is often much harder to digest; cooking loosens the proteins, softens the fibres and so on, and if the dog is a small breed, like a Bichon Frise for example, then it might experience digestion problems. I gave my dog (which is the breed I mentioned) a bone from the butchers which still had a good mount of leftover meat/gristle etc upon it, and let's just say I was busy cleaning up after the thing for a while. Who knew that a little dog could produce so much...i'll stop there.

I don't really disagree..
Uncooked foods do hold a higher risk..freshness is key for sure.
Helps to know the animal was raised In good habitat too..not a filth hole.
Japan is also good with that.
But they don't often feed their animals raw foods here I don't think.

But hey wild animals kill and eat raw meats...freshness is key eh?! Lol.

[Kam12]

You should ask the veterinarian and not in a forum.

[Deleted]

You should ask the veterinarian and not in a forum.

Sadly, most vets know very little about nutrition.

[Ryve]

First and foremost, you are right, a healthy dog should be able to digest raw meat without issue, your dog also probably has a stronger immune system than you when it comes to dealing with the bacteria and parasites found in that raw meat. However, there are a few more things to take into consideration...

If you dog was getting sick from eating the Purina, did you ever stop to consider that perhaps the dog became sick due to other external influences, or that the dog has a weak stomach/pre-existing ailments that could be made worse by digesting the raw meat which will for all intents and purposes put greater strain on the animal's immune system?

Meat being fresh isn't as much of an issue with modern refrigeration, because we are effectively slowing down the rate at which the meat will deteriorate, likewise certain bacteria can not live through the colder temperatures. However, on the inverse if the meat is frozen you are destroying a lot of the flavour from the meat. This is probably why dogs will prefer the packaged foods that have additional flavouring and preservatives. You probably don't like bland tasting food, and neither does your dog. And there's still the matter of how while refrigeration may control some of the nasties, proper cooking will kill a lot more of them.

I was going to go on about balancing the nutritional value with the dog's exercise levels and how grains will leave the dog full while limiting it's food intake, as well as the fact that your dog is not hunting or scavenging for its food meaning it will probably be eating 2-3 times a day, as opposed to a far less stable routine in the "wild" with far more exercise mixed in... But it's getting late. Just understand it will be harder, because a slab of meat does not come with recommended portion sizes.

The one thing I don't really understand is why you'd really want to make a habit of conditioning a carnivorous animal that's potentially bigger and stronger than you to eat fresh meat. You know, when we've been raising them on food that looks and tastes less like us for a damn long time... Growing up if a working dog bit a sheep and drew blood, it was getting a bullet, because it could no longer be considered useful as a working dog since the taste for blood often leads to a hunger for more of it. And if it bit a human and drew blood it was probably getting as many bullets as the gun had chambers, as well as a fair serving of swearing. Your dog has been bred to be docile and loyal, but it will still have the instinct to hunt and kill, as well as sharp teeth. I guess all I can say on that is that familiarity breeds contempt.

At the end of the day, it's your dog, and your choice. And although I don't particularly care for the idea if it were my own animal, as long as you're ensuring the dog is healthy either way, I really don't care what you do.

[Oneleg]

talk to your vet before you feed any animal raw meat. In most cases is it NOT good for your dog, your dog is not a wolf.

A good quality dog food will keep them healthier and to live longer, pay a little extra to feed them half as much and clean up half as much in the yard.

btw never ever give a dog any type of poultry bones, they tend to splinter which can cause all kinds of damage.

---------- Post added 2012-04-11 at 06:09 PM ----------

How can there be no benefit from putting a carnivorous animal back on their natural diet?

Hundreds of years of breeding have taken that carnivore and turned it into a fluffy pet, German Shepherds are the closest to wolf and even then raw is not any better then a high quality dog food.

Costs is half again as much, but they eat 1/2 to 1/4 as much and get the protein they need.

[Elenion]

I don't know about that exactly...I heard the same thing..but I've been in japan for a year eating all sorts of raw foods and haven't gotten sick once.
I never had anything raw till i came here.
I eat raw fish, egg, squid, fish egg, beef, ham nearly 1 time each a week. A lot of raw egg tho..many times day.
I even had raw horse once.
It's about the food being freah. That's what the Japanese people have told me.
But on topic...I gues It would be fine if its fresh.

1 year ago i thought it was impossible to eat raw meats. That we would get really sick.

It's not just about freshness, wasabi, soy sauce and others have antibacterial properities to help.

[Tinykong]

I've been giving my Jack Russel terrier raw turkey necks for as long as I can remember, and when I could find it locally, I gave her other types of raw meats (all obtained from a local butcher, not a grocery store.) I won't give her any ground products, and I only buy meat that is suitable for human consumption (not going to run out and kill a racoon and let her eat that.)

Dog kibble is nothing more than ground up meat and by-products, which may or may not be fit for human consumption, that is mixed with fillers and sprayed with fat to add flavor. I don't see how either one is any worse, after all, the dog food in the bag is only as clean as the facility it's made in, and they are not subject to the same types of USDA inspections and standards as human food producers.

I look at it this way: my dog likes the raw food, I only let her eat it on a non-porous surface that I can sanitize, and I don't leave her poops in the backyard. I'm not going to go out there and grow vegetables in the yard, so I'm not worried about spreading disease through her poop. I keep her teeth clean, make sure she has plenty of fresh water, and keep her paws and nails free of excess growth and bacteria. If it cuts her life short by a few years, at least she got to enjoy herself.

[Cruor]

Cooked meat is better for anything that eats meat, be it a human, dog, or lion. Theres a reason we started cooking.... it kills germs, makes the meat less tough, and it tastes better. "natural" isnt always better... Most animals who are raised in captivity (and are well cared for) outlive their wild versions by a very wide margin.

[cherb]

As someone said, 99% of dog breeds are not even "natural" as you seem to think. A German shepherd, great dane, beagle, basset, retriever, *insert any other breed* are not naturally wild animals. They did not develop by themselves in nature hunting in packs. They have been bred by humans, so to assume that w/e breed of dog you have is naturally wild is kind of dumb

[Deleted]

I'd try talking to a vet, if they can't give you enough answers, ask them to point you to someone who can. Sciencedirect has 0 hits for raw canine diet or any similar searches, and sites with no academic sources aren't best trusted when it comes to something which may elicit health concerns.

For now I'd stick to what you know to be safe, which is probably dried/tinned food, just til you have consulted some experts.

[Deleted]

Still interested as to where you got that information you quoted from can you provide a link?

Weve tried our dog on raw food, he doesn't like it nor did it agree with him. he does however like mash potatoes and gravy (and cooked meat) (but not peas, he licks the gravy off them and makes a pile of peas in his bowl, its funny to watch)if we have any left over tho it gives him gas so its more of a treat then a diet.

on the subject of Cheap foods = bad, my dog prefers cheap dog food, hell leave the more expensive foods but eat the Asda own brand (not smart price) but this is wet food not dry

(he wont eat dry food at all)

EDIT: Typo

[Malcho]

Farmed meat is actually a risk for your dog. It is likely that the animal has been treated with chemicals that do not occur in "prey." If you can find organic, free-roam chicken or other meat, feel free, but it will cost a lot.

[Deleted]

Farmed meat is actually a risk for your dog. It is likely that the animal has been treated with chemicals that do not occur in "prey." If you can find organic, free-roam chicken or other meat, feel free, but it will cost a lot.

Dogs don't have prey. 99% of all dogs only exist due to domestication.

[Deleted]

Still interested as to where you got that information you quoted from can you provide a link?

Weve tried our dog on raw food, he doesn't like it nor did it agree with him. he does however like mash potatoes and gravy (and cooked meat) (but not peas, he licks the gravy off them and makes a pile of peas in his bowl, its funny to watch)if we have any left over tho it gives him gas so its more of a treat then a diet.

on the subject of Cheap foods = bad, my dog prefers cheap dog food, hell leave the more expensive foods but eat the Asda own brand (not smart price) but this is wet food not dry

(he wont eat dry food at all)

EDIT: Typo

I have asked for the original source twice, don't hold your breath.

[Deleted]

I have asked for the original source twice, don't hold your breath.

Yea i saw i was hoping two asking would be better then one

the guy with the cat tho seems to have the best idea a little raw and some dry feed, seems to be best of both?

also what bread you got (just curious) mines a cross collie, god knows what hes crossed with, hes a bit of a mongrel runt of the litter, we love him tho so it doesn't matter!

[Malcho]

Dogs don't have prey. 99% of all dogs only exist due to domestication.

Say whatever you want. I've seen strays pursue smaller creatures, kill, and eat them. Please cite your sources that completely bend and nullify the reality that I witnessed.