They changed Ji Firepaw :(

[Blufossa]

Ahahaha. A shame.

His counterpart comes off as a little bland to me. Pity he couldn't keep his pseudo-lecherous demeanor.

Him and Aysa are bland. I haven't felt any "tension" while playing the starter zone (I've leveled a Monk, Shaman, Warrior, Rogue, Hunter, and Priest there).

Blizzard has been changing so many small details it's starting to hurt my head. No tails for males and no fluffy-flirty Ji Firepaw. Also, him being flirty wouldn't hurt his position in the Horde leader line-up one bit.

This is the stupidest threat I have ever seen. ONE LINE OF TEXT FROM AN NPC HAS CHANGED!!!!!!!! If this is the focus of your day, I pity you.

One changed/deleted line may lead them to changing his overall personality since this is Beta. I don't want to lose the only other Horde leader I have respect for right now (besides Baine and Vol'jin).

[Count Zero]

we can when it's a deliberate subversion of negative qualities, otherwise it's supporting that quality and unacceptable. one pointlessly sexist line in the Beta of a video game from one of thousands of NPCs has no cultural weight to justify its existence, it's just passive misogny and I'm glad they changed it.

the first thing I said in this thread was; whine about this in an equal world. I stand by that, as it stands accept that positive discrimination is the only effective method of combatting the prejudices inhererent in our attitudes and behaviours.

I didn't realize feminism had grown such fascist tendencies.

[Deleted]

Nah, people hate feminists because they respect women. Also because they ARE women.

This is absolutely ridiculous. People don't hate feminist because they respect women or because they are women. A lot of people don't like feminist (not hate) because what they are doing aren't giving female equal rights, in stead they often point out that they are the lesser party (whether true or not) to get their right.

I don't like feminists, does this mean I hate all women?

[crabmousse]

This is quite funny. If Ji was a female NPC and was flirting with a male nobody would care, but now it's a male flirting/complimenting a female character and it's sexism.

because of course we live in an equal world with no persecution and no oppressed minorities right? I'm sure plenty of people would care, all the white western men in this thread who refuse to aknowledge that they still rule the world and get the easy ride while everyone else suffers.

---------- Post added 2012-04-12 at 04:03 PM ----------

I didn't realize feminism had grown such fascist tendencies.

you gotta be extreme to have an affect unfortunately.

---------- Post added 2012-04-12 at 04:03 PM ----------

I don't like feminists, does this mean I hate all women?

no, you like the unenlightened ones.

[Deleted]

So, where does it end ? Let's assume for a second, for argument's sake, that Ji's original line is sexist. Are we not allowed to depict negative qualities in fiction anymore ? How many classic works of literature, film, song, poetry, would have to be banned, or re-written ?

Gotta agree with this point. When an author creates a character with negative attributes they are not automatically to be assumed of possessing the same negative attributes or indeed of promoting them. At what point did we start demanding that our fictional worlds be idealistic in concept and free from all the negative qualities of our own society? Let's not dwell on the fact that changing the dialogue is a bigger insult than the original lines as it suggests that not only were they "wrong" in the first place but that they are something our womenfolk need protected from. It's not really about any implied sexism in the original text; it's the fact that Blizzard due to a very few complaints went back on their original intent. I can't be arsed doing HoT instances to reach my VP cap anymore, so I'm going to the official forums to start a bitching thread about making LFR be able to make me reach my1k VPs alone.

[Tastyfish]

Need to change it back.
Look what the QQ has gotten us in cata.

[Deleted]

because of course we live in an equal world with no persecution and no oppressed minorities right? I'm sure plenty of people would care, all the white western men in this thread who refuse to aknowledge that they still rule the world and get the easy ride while everyone else suffers.

---------- Post added 2012-04-12 at 04:03 PM ----------


you gotta be extreme to have an affect unfortunately.

---------- Post added 2012-04-12 at 04:03 PM ----------


no, you like the unenlightened ones.

I don't know where you live but over here in western Europe women are pretty much equal to men. I agree that there are still some differences when talking about top positions and salaries but what exactly is it that men can do and women can't? Next to that, would this be an issue if Ji was a female NPC flirting with males and not female characters? Or would that be considered "ok"?

[Alewen]

This is absolutely ridiculous. People don't hate feminist because they respect women or because they are women. A lot of people don't like feminist (not hate) because what they are doing aren't giving female equal rights, in stead they often point out that they are the lesser party (whether true or not) to get their right.

I don't like feminists, does this mean I hate all women?

I'm all for equal rights between genders. However I think some feminists take things way too far. It gives women a bad name when they get offended over the most innocent things, like being told they are gorgeous, from an in character standpoint. Ji wasn't flirting with us the player. He was flirting with our character. And even then, it wasn't even an "Oh my god he is going to violate my character!" kind of flirt. It was him complimenting her beauty. So how is being told you look good, offensive? It shouldn't be offensive. Why would a straight man, tell another man he is beautiful? It wont happen. Men tend to tell other men they look strong, and women they tell them they look pretty.

[crabmousse]

I don't know where you live but over here in western Europe women are pretty much equal to men

here's where I'll bow out of this discussion, there's no point arguing against a brick wall of ignorance that solid.

[Deleted]

Nah, people hate feminists because they respect women. Also because they ARE women.

Feminists often like to point out how women are ruled by "The Patriarchy" and how they are subservient to men.

How is any woman not offended by that? How can any woman not be offended when feminists portray women as the mindless slaves of men? How are you not offended by the misogyny of feminism?

Granted, this is more the stance of radical feminists but that is where the majority of dislike for feminism lies, anyway.

/rant

[Narveid]

whine about this change in an equal world. it's not a big deal to you, it is however a big deal to someone who has to deal with the spectre of constant sexual harassment on a daily basis. removing a line of dialogue that was unpleasant for someone else shouldn't matter for you unless you disagree with the reason for it's removal, i.e you are a casual misogynist.

What sort of joke is this? Every person who disagree with the removal of a line that underlined what sort of character we are dealing with, because of a very vocal minority who overreact to a single line in a video game, is a misogynist? Does that also mean that every guy who ever complimented a girl is also a misogynist? We are talking about a character who says whats on his mind when things pop up in there, and what Blizzard did was to nerf his personality (to the ground). I've linked it to several female friends of mine. Not one of them thought it to be offensive. They found it to be sort of silly, or didn't react at all.

[Serpens77]

This gives me hope; if a small group of people can get one line of unimportant text changed, then the large group of people that want tails for male pandaren might have a chance to change Blizzard's minds ;P

[Deleted]

Why is it calling a girl "gorgeous" sexist? Also, what if a character is sexist? We got racist characters, we got people who promote genocide, murder, the spread of the plague, etc. but the offensive thing is to compliment female characters?

It's an heterosexual character. It makes sense that it would compliment women on their beauty, men on their strength. There's nothing sexist on it and there will never be.
The same women who complain about this are the same ones that are missing that sexual energy is a very, very important trait in relationships between men and women.
That person who started the thread at the US forums should not forget that if it wasn't because his father, most probably, chased his mom calling her gorgeous, she wouldn't be in a forum complaining about a line and forgetting how plenty of Horde racial leaders are totally racist and we accept it because they are characters and that doesn't mean that they are promoting such attitude.

[Tastyfish]

we can when it's a deliberate subversion of negative qualities, otherwise it's supporting that quality and unacceptable. one pointlessly sexist line in the Beta of a video game from one of thousands of NPCs has no cultural weight to justify its existence, it's just passive misogny and I'm glad they changed it..

Well if it has no cultural weight, no power, why do you care?
I think you forgot a long time ago about picking your battles.
ALL your so called misogny and the rally against it, is laudable.
GO rage against the slutty armor styles and actually do something with meaning, with a real effect. But I suspect you wouldn't because why try when you know nothing will change.

It's easier to attack stupid little things with very puffed up sense of idealism.


I guess I can call you a homophobe cause of a toon named blood fart too. You know cause it's an allusion to making jokes about gays.
( see how crazy we can get being on hyper defense?)
Edit: I do find it funny that your profile pic reminds me of the 40s, which were a wonderful time to be a woman, lol

[Tides]

We don't feel very well today, do we?! In every post you make there's something pessimistic!

That doesnt make it wrong

[Deleted]

nah people hate feminists because they hate women.

False.

I hate neo-feminism, but I totally respect women. Exactly the same as I respect men and both are giving a fair chance in my life. Any of both mess up and they are out.

[Keoren]

It begins.

here's where I'll bow out of this discussion, there's no point arguing against a brick wall of ignorance that solid.

I must be in the kitchen since I am obviously surrounded by pots and kettles.

[Deleted]

here's where I'll bow out of this discussion, there's no point arguing against a brick wall of ignorance that solid.

Instead of bowing out of our little discussion perhaps you could enlighten me instead? What if I don't know any better? Maybe that would change my way of thinking into a, for you, more preferable? Or do you rather have me continue this way? By reading the other reactions I'd say the first one, right?

[crabmousse]

Well if it has no cultural weight, no power, why do you care?
I think you forgot a long time ago about picking your battles.
ALL your so called misogny and the rally against it, is laudable.
GO rage against the slutty armor styles and actually do something with meaning, with a real effect. But I suspect you wouldn't because why try when you know nothing will change.

It's easier to attack stupid little things with very puffed up sense of idealism.


I guess I can call you a homophobe cause of a toon named blood fart too. You know cause it's an allusion to making jokes about gays.
( see how crazy we can get being on hyper defense?)

you can't solve a problem with an idea in something which holds no cultural weight, but you can certainly continue to propogate a problematic attitude by doing so. I prefer to pick my battles in the real world thanks, you don't know who I am or what I do. I come here for leisure, I'm arguing here for lesure. I don't need to pick my battles thank, I will continue to battle on indiscriminantly.

[Tastyfish]

False.

I hate neo-feminism, but I totally respect women. Exactly the same as I respect men and both are giving a fair chance in my life. Any of both mess up and they are out.

Well to be honest, you never argue with people who just see things in black and white. It allways just ends in logical fail.

I don't think the guy understands the middle ground, you know where you are able to see both extremes. LIke, hell,o for every vagina hater, there is a penis hater too.
Like you can totally fight for equal pay, because it's rite, and think Ji's lines are fine.. lol