Structured PVP [1st BWE Feedback]

[Deleted]

We have few topics about general feedback, but I would like to narrow things down do structured PVP to be more precise. I'm really interest in what people think about this form of PVP in GW2.

1. Maps
Personally I'm impressed with map design. Maps are nice, details are there, but environment is not distracting you from combat. In Battle of Kyhlo we have trebuchet, it's a great feature as proper use can really help your team to catch up. But its slow rate of fire and logistics involved in setting it up makes it double edge sword, to the point where every missed shot may cost your team a potential win. Forest of Niflhel have two veteran (elite) NPCs which can be killed for point boost (50pts), while this idea is great, they are waaaaaaay too easy kill. I can solo them on my Engineer and he is oriented more on damage than survival, so I'm guessing more defensive Guardian can solo them without a scratch. Overall: 9/10, just make the NPCs harder to kill in FoN and we are set.

2. Conquest Mode
I wasn't really honest with people about it before beta. I was defending it, but deep inside I was very worried about no deathmatch style gameplay. Fortunately almost every doubt about conquest was swept away in this beta event. Anet has reached almost perfect balance in points awarded between player kills and holding points. What I could only suggest is to increase the point cap to 750pts as 500 is making matches too short. There's fighting on points, on the roads and for secondary objectives - I was very impressed by it. The tournament 5v5 bracket looks even more delicious as it will allow for great variety of teamplay tactics. It's not uncommon to overturn even 300pts difference which adds to excitement and rewards better play. Overall: 8/10, they need to adjust the cap.

3. Flow of Combat
At first, everything looked.. chaotic, spammy and without a purpose. But with every match it was easy to catch up on class mechanics and fights were becoming more organised. You spam = you die, period. Abilities need to be timed, you need to predict enemy's movement, team play is crucial, positioning is key. If they really add ability to change the intensity of particle effects the combat will gain even more depth as using cross professions combos will become more reliable. I also loved how much visible it was which player knew what he was doing and how much difference the proper use of skills made - it is very rewarding.

There is also no issue of "melee profs having a hard time", omitting the fact that every class can do range damage, I just want to say that (based on current beta) when it comes to PVP, this is the best balanced game in melee vs ranged department. My friend was playing mostly warrior during this event and when we had met in opposing teams, I never felt I had an advantage over him and neither did he.

Overall: 7/10, fix the particles and it will be instant 10/10

4. Profession balance
Bit too early to formulate accurate cases. For example, for me at first Mesmer seemed very "OP", but after changing just one utility skill they become very manageable. If you feel that particular profession is dominating you it generally means your build is out of "balance", by that I mean that it's too specialized or there is no synergy between your weapon setup and utility skills. Overall: too early to say

5. Number crunching/theorycrafting
Orgasm. Yup, I went there. For a math freak like me, this game is gold. You have your weapon skills, healing skills, utility skills, 5 trait lines with various effects that affect skills in a very strong manner, runes on gear, gems in accessories, sigils on weapons, multiple MEANINGFUL stats (vitality, power, toughness, precision, prowess, expertise, malice, compassion, concentration), class specific stats (like ingenuity, brawn etc) - all this makes up one huge puzzle that's delicious and I will devoured it.

Putting nerdgasm aside, it allows for huge class customization. Runes, gems and sigils have really big impact on your performances and the number of them (A LOT) gives you lots of choices of playstyles. So no, it doesn't end on 5 wpn skills and 5 utility skills - spec building is very deep. Overall: 10/10

6. E-Sport
Anet claimed few times they want to support competitive community. My opinion? They are really on to something. Conquest mode really performs very well at delivering exciting matches (just increase the cap) and if they deliver on the promise of regulating the particle effects this game can really be very pleasant to watch for spectators. So yes, this game has a very big potential.

I also need to add how nicely the whole system worked during beta. The "Play now" button REALLY did make you.. play now ;p. Since there are no stupid factions, there are always players available to play. Auto balance feature was present, but it wasn't very intrusive. Server browser did work just like in FPS games, you could select the server and press play - done. Although you couldn't (yet) create your own match this feature is promised to be ready for launch and that only improves the chances of this game entering e-sport world.

So.. thanks for reading. Your thoughts?

[Deleted]

just make the NPCs harder to kill in FoN and we are set.

Easy to kill as a Thief and Guardian I agree also rangers dont have problems either. Dunno about other professions

There's fighting on points, on the roads and for secondary objectives - I was very impressed by it.

As for me half of fights were when people just run in 1 group zerging enemplayers scattered around the map. And even when uoy think that they should be only have 1 point when you can capture two others? Nope, Khylo is so small map that getting from 1 point to middle one as a whole team and just run over enemies is waaaay to fast. The only reasonable counter I saw for this is to get some1 on trebuchet (I love 4 kills at one time :P )

You spam = you die, period.

It wil be like ages before people realize that.

I spend most of my beta time in those two pvp maps with different professions. I was dissapointed that running as a whole team is that good. It narrows tactics to brainless zerg mode and omfg it worked too many times this weekend. And you can't even play with your friends!! This is ridiculous! The only way i found to play woth my friend was to get on the same active server from the list and couldnt even be in the same team...
But overall PVP is great I had sooo much fun playing as my "unkillable" Guardian holding up to 4 people form enemy team while my team was taking points, soloing veterans (Svanir is hard for solo but still doable) and crit for 5k as a Thief.
Two more rants for the end:
1. Autobalancing almost at the end fo round when you are in winning team and it puta you in losing one.....
2. In Forrest map killing veterans applies for last hit (killing blow) if you do that to steal kill for your party - awesome, but it "grind my gears" when enemy is doing that when I'm soloing :P

[Larynx]

This basically sums up my opinion, agree 100% especially on the minibosses being too easy. They're incredibly easy to solo, their damage is fine, but I think they need an unavoidable attack that immobilizes or snares you for a good amount of time. The chieftain's one is way too easy to dodge, and Svanir's charge is similarly easy.

The fact that they can blow somebody up if they get in range is pointless if they're unable to get in range in the first place.

Some more to add: I'd definitely like them to explore a bit more with game types, even if they never do them for competitive stuff. Capture the flag, team deathmatch, murderball, free for all deathmatch, ect. And of course, more maps, but I hear they're adding two more by release. So four is good enough for now, especially if they're all significantly different.

[Deleted]

free for all deathmatch

I dont see any good deathmatch in this game, even team deathmatch feels like "who can press buttons faster in zerg mode and focus 1 target"

[Larynx]

I dont see any good deathmatch in this game, even team deathmatch feels like "who can press buttons faster in zerg mode and focus 1 target"

To quote the OP,

You spam = you die, period.

If focusing is bad, then they should just remove PvP from GW2, and in fact any sort of game with PvP. 5v5 teamdeath match would be incredibly fast paced and intense. Literally one mistake or hesitating for a second could kill you, since there's five people attacking you.

[ShamanTankFTW]

Was a good read, and thanks for the info.

I myself didn't go into the whole PvP side of the game as I was just checking out the world and class mechanics for this beta event. I did though go into the PvP starting area to check out builds and profession custimization. I have to agree with you, the amount of builds in this game for each class is staggering. Not only that, it's the amount of VIABLE builds that is truly amazing.

Can't wait until next beta, am going to go check out the PvP side to this game for sure then.

[grandpab]

I was completely thrown off by only having to wait like 10 seconds before the gate opened each match lol

Every MMO I've played in the last 7 years has made you wait there for a minute or 2 before the battle started.

[Larynx]

I was completely thrown off by only having to wait like 10 seconds before the gate opened each match lol

Every MMO I've played in the last 7 years has made you wait there for a minute or 2 before the battle started.

Oh I loved that so much. No more useless waiting. ^^

[Deleted]

I spend most of my beta time in those two pvp maps with different professions. I was dissapointed that running as a whole team is that good. It narrows tactics to brainless zerg mode and omfg it worked too many times this weekend.

As always at the beginning of any game, zergs seem to be "THE way", but they are easily to counter. Once people will know the game, zergs will be less and less popular.

And you can't even play with your friends!! This is ridiculous! The only way i found to play woth my friend was to get on the same active server from the list and couldnt even be in the same team...

It's confirmed they'll add join as party for release - dunno if it will be added next beta though.

But overall PVP is great I had sooo much fun playing as my "unkillable" Guardian holding up to 4 people form enemy team while my team was taking points, soloing veterans (Svanir is hard for solo but still doable) and crit for 5k as a Thief.

Yeah, guardians can be a real PITA . Though as engineer I don't try to kill them - I usually knock them out of points ;>.

1. Autobalancing almost at the end fo round when you are in winning team and it puta you in losing one.....

Hmm.. never seen it happen after 400pts mark. Strange- deff something to be brought up on their forum.

2. In Forrest map killing veterans applies for last hit (killing blow) if you do that to steal kill for your party - awesome, but it "grind my gears" when enemy is doing that when I'm soloing :P

Well.. they've borrowed it from MOBA games, with all its pros and cons ;]

[Deleted]

I've to agree on almost every point you have OP. But everything is early to say and imo TEAMPLAY is gonna be the key here. In BWE you had to get a solid build that isn't niched anywhere. In the real game and tourney with a full team on skype or something you'll be able to have a niche and then complement eachothers flaws to create a even better setup.

[Deleted]

I was completely thrown off by only having to wait like 10 seconds before the gate opened each match lol

Every MMO I've played in the last 7 years has made you wait there for a minute or 2 before the battle started.

Not only that, but the fact that you can play continuously without the need to re-cue. I loved that.

[Zeek Daniels]

This basically sums up my opinion, agree 100% especially on the minibosses being too easy. They're incredibly easy to solo, their damage is fine, but I think they need an unavoidable attack that immobilizes or snares you for a good amount of time. The chieftain's one is way too easy to dodge, and Svanir's charge is similarly easy.

I think thats ok though because when a player on the other team walks in mid fight and attacks you your screwed. Its a risk reward type thing. me and a team mate stumbled on 3 guys fighting one of them and 2 were on low hp and we finished those 2 off b4 killing the miniboss.

[terrahero]

Zerging is to damn effective. Whoever zerged as a group, simply won. Going tactically for a point didnt pay of nearly as much as simply running circles around the map as a team. Capping points along the way and killing chieftains.

[Deleted]

I usually knock them out of points ;>.

That's what I do too with shield skill on number 5

And also one more thing: people tend to fight near cap points but not in them so they lose them and it hurts me inside when I see this.

[Deleted]

Zerging is to damn effective. Whoever zerged as a group, simply won. Going tactically for a point didnt pay of nearly as much as simply running circles around the map as a team. Capping points along the way and killing chieftains.

Well.. almost every time I was able to counter Zerg during my weekend. In 8v8 format, if 2 players on your team knows what to do, you can counter zerg np. That's all it takes, 2 players.

Target "pro" bracket will be in 5v5 format, so.. not an issue.