Skarner ganking.

[Deleted]

Imo Frozen Heart > Randuins. The slow from Randuins is almost wasted since you're .. well Skarner and slow constantly anyway. Frozen Heart gives a shitload of mana, probably the best anti AD aura in-game, and shitloads of CDR, which together with AS makes your CD's extremely low.

Sheen is good yeah but Wit's End too imo, the AS from Wit's End makes you autoattack so fast that your spells are off CD before you know it. That + since skarner attacks FAST, the procs from Wit's End really give a lot of damage + some nice MR.

I haven't played Skarner a lot the last few weeks, but my build is generally something like:

Merc/ninja boots.
Shurelya
Frozen Heart
Wit's End
Banshee/FoN

And by this time the game is over. If it isn't I might start saving up for a Triforce. I love Triforce, but it's so damn expensive.

[Xorious]

Imo Frozen Heart > Randuins. The slow from Randuins is almost wasted since you're .. well Skarner and slow constantly anyway. Frozen Heart gives a shitload of mana, probably the best anti AD aura in-game, and shitloads of CDR, which together with AS makes your CD's extremely low.

Sheen is good yeah but Wit's End too imo, the AS from Wit's End makes you autoattack so fast that your spells are off CD before you know it. That + since skarner attacks FAST, the procs from Wit's End really give a lot of damage + some nice MR.

I haven't played Skarner a lot the last few weeks, but my build is generally something like:

Merc/ninja boots.
Shurelya
Frozen Heart
Wit's End
Banshee/FoN

And by this time the game is over. If it isn't I might start saving up for a Triforce. I love Triforce, but it's so damn expensive.

The thing is, Frozen Heart usually gets picked by the top or the AP on your team as a defensive item when other team has a lot of AD, so you don't need to take it.
If they don't have a lot of AD's Randuin's is also a better option because of the tiny health and the slow is also movement speed decrease in a pretty big aoe.
On top of all of that Randuins builds out of HoG, which is a gp5 item so it's very nice to get early for Skarner.

The problem with Wit's End is that lategame it's not giving a lot of useful stats, the MR is pretty tiny, the AS is nice but the point of high AS is that you get more Q's off, and your Q's really start giving u a huge damage increase once you actually have that Sheen/Triforce. Also, Wit's End is about 2.1k while Sheen is about 1.3k, if you got 2.1k you can buy a sheen and a heart of gold or a wit's end, I know I'd definetely pick the 1st option.

[Deleted]

The thing is, Frozen Heart usually gets picked by the top or the AP on your team as a defensive item when other team has a lot of AD, so you don't need to take it.
If they don't have a lot of AD's Randuin's is also a better option because of the tiny health and the slow is also movement speed decrease in a pretty big aoe.
On top of all of that Randuins builds out of HoG, which is a gp5 item so it's very nice to get early for Skarner.

The problem with Wit's End is that lategame it's not giving a lot of useful stats, the MR is pretty tiny, the AS is nice but the point of high AS is that you get more Q's off, and your Q's really start giving u a huge damage increase once you actually have that Sheen/Triforce. Also, Wit's End is about 2.1k while Sheen is about 1.3k, if you got 2.1k you can buy a sheen and a heart of gold or a wit's end, I know I'd definetely pick the 1st option.

Strange, most AP I see (apart from old Ryze) really don't pick Frozen Heart, hell they have a lot better anti AD items available. Plus when do they take it? By that time I farmed up 4 Frozen Hearts if I wanted too. That and your team has to itemize according to your needs too.

Randuins is a great item, but Frozen Heart's stats all just scream Skarner. Sure it doesnt build off a HoG but that doesn't matter, by the time you get Frozen Heart or another big item you can just sell it back.

No useful stats? The MR doesn't change and is quite good since most comps these days have 1 AP. The attack speed is pretty damn high which results in far lower CD's, especially when you're already around 40% from items. Early game it greatly speeds up your jungle and it adds A LOT of damage to Skarner.
By the time I find it worth to start saving for Triforce, the game has long ended.

[Xorious]

Strange, most AP I see (apart from old Ryze) really don't pick Frozen Heart, hell they have a lot better anti AD items available. Plus when do they take it? By that time I farmed up 4 Frozen Hearts if I wanted too. That and your team has to itemize according to your needs too.

Randuins is a great item, but Frozen Heart's stats all just scream Skarner. Sure it doesnt build off a HoG but that doesn't matter, by the time you get Frozen Heart or another big item you can just sell it back.

No useful stats? The MR doesn't change and is quite good since most comps these days have 1 AP. The attack speed is pretty damn high which results in far lower CD's, especially when you're already around 40% from items. Early game it greatly speeds up your jungle and it adds A LOT of damage to Skarner.
By the time I find it worth to start saving for Triforce, the game has long ended.

Frozen Heart still depends on the comp, it's ofcourse a strong item for Skarner, but in my personal experience in endgame someone on your team would have picked up a Frozen Heart.

You should try getting an early Triforce as your first big item, it allows for heavy carrying during mid/lategame compared to a Wit's End which will make you do more damage, but Triforce damage increase is just way way higher. Also, if you go for a Triforce you can build a Sheen and almost a Zeal which still gives you the attack speed and also movespeed/crit while sheen gives you the big damage hits.

Maybe should just try out both in 2 games and see the difference, imo Triforce > Wit's End, but guess it may depend on personal preference.

[Deleted]

In end-game, why end-game when YOU can have Frozen heart + Philo + Hog + tier 2 boots before 20 minutes?

And Triforce will never be my first item, not unless we're stomping the enemy so hard I could win by buying wards alone. It's shitloads of gold and junglers generally get gold a tad slower then laners. Plus it gives you no real defenses which basically means that by mid game (when you finish your TF) and teamfights start to happen, you don't have any defenses whatsoever. I like my Skarner in the middle of their team stomping that carry without having to worry I die within 4 seconds. Doing extra damage is quite useless when you're dead (something which a lot of carries don't understand in this game). With just Glacial Shroud + Wit's end I already have CDR, Mana, Attack Speed and great defenses combined with loads of damage.

IF I ever buy a TF, it's my very last item just to completely stomp anyone by that point.

[Xorious]

In end-game, why end-game when YOU can have Frozen heart + Philo + Hog + tier 2 boots before 20 minutes?

And Triforce will never be my first item, not unless we're stomping the enemy so hard I could win by buying wards alone. It's shitloads of gold and junglers generally get gold a tad slower then laners. Plus it gives you no real defenses which basically means that by mid game (when you finish your TF) and teamfights start to happen, you don't have any defenses whatsoever. I like my Skarner in the middle of their team stomping that carry without having to worry I die within 4 seconds. Doing extra damage is quite useless when you're dead (something which a lot of carries don't understand in this game). With just Glacial Shroud + Wit's end I already have CDR, Mana, Attack Speed and great defenses combined with loads of damage.

IF I ever buy a TF, it's my very last item just to completely stomp anyone by that point.

Guess playstyles are different then ^^
I just like being able to carry games hard and the best way for that is just to get a Triforce early to get insanely strong ganks, with your build I'd guess you farm more and are more a teamfight guy. Correct me if I'm wrong ofcourse, but that's what I get from how you explain your build

Just tried Wit's End in a game again, enemies were 3 AP champions, in that case it's ofcourse a very good choice but I think when you meet a team where the enemies have only 1 AP Wit's End isn't a good choice. With 2 AP's on enemy team it depends I guess.
I still like Sheen early better then Wit's End, oh well ^^

[Nawy]

Basically i like to play low tier junglers because solo queue sucks anyway. Masterys, runes and items i go full jew build. And my summoners are rally cv. This is just how i play tbh. And it's quite effective.

[Deleted]

Guess playstyles are different then ^^
I just like being able to carry games hard and the best way for that is just to get a Triforce early to get insanely strong ganks, with your build I'd guess you farm more and are more a teamfight guy. Correct me if I'm wrong ofcourse, but that's what I get from how you explain your build

Just tried Wit's End in a game again, enemies were 3 AP champions, in that case it's ofcourse a very good choice but I think when you meet a team where the enemies have only 1 AP Wit's End isn't a good choice. With 2 AP's on enemy team it depends I guess.
I still like Sheen early better then Wit's End, oh well ^^

It's .. better with less AP in the enemy team? It basicaly means you can buy Wit's End and have enough MR for the rest of the game. So you have enough MR, and a massive daamge boost instead of just MR.

And again, I always buy Philo + Hog + tier 2 boots first, then my first big item. By the time I completed a Triforce I can barely gank since most lanes have a tower destroyed and it's more about teamfights etc. Teamfights in which you'll just die if you don't have any defense. Skarner is a farmer as he's 1 of the fastest junglers around, generally I have as much if not more cs then our solo top or mid. He really isn't the "I gank a lane every 15 seconds" kind of jungler.

Now with Maw of whoeveritis I would even get a Sheen/Triforce later, if I'd get it. Maw + Wit's end is around 85 MR or something while greatly boosting the damage you do through AD, passive effects, AS and being able to spam spells since you attack so damn fast. And on top of that you become a lot more tanky.

Ideal situation of:

Tier2 boots,
Shurelya
Frozen Heart
Wit's End
Maw
Warmog (or Frozen Mallet depending on amounts of CC)

And you're this 3.6k health Scorpion which barely takes any damage and "slowly" but surely eats massive amounts of health from any enemy while they cannot get away. The best part? The more damage you get, the more damage you're actually doing.

[Deleted]

Skarner too op

---------- Post added 2012-05-03 at 10:11 AM ----------

lee sin op also

[FoShizzleMyGrizzle]

Build IMO: Philostone, merc threads (ninja tabi if they dont have so much AP), RUSH TRIFORCE ! which means: Phage > Sheen > Zeal
Then, get a Frozen heart to go retardmode @ their AD/AD carries. Go Gunblade, also you can go Will of the Ancient (WotA) to heal like a boss.
So, build Skarner Hybrid, cus thats what he really IS. Hybrid.
Also, never. buy. RAGEBLADE. Its the worst item in the game. Even a longsword is better for Skarner. Also, you can go a bit tankier with Omen, FoN, Mogs instead of going Wota. Yes. you want Gunblade for the AP/AD and the use slow. Which is really really good.
Uhm..Maw anyone? havent tested it, but it can save your life with the Hexdrinker proc !
I play Skarner at 1.3k 1.5k elo matches. Always works out the way I want.
Forget Maw ! GO Wits end. Forgot about that 1.

[Axethor]

While I would never build a triforce early, I also don't build a wit's end. I save triforce as a last item when I have a shit ton of gold stocked up. Sheen is good enough for early/mid game. The only jungler I rush triforce on is Hecarim, and even then I grab some defense first.

Sheen and Wit's End are just two different build styles, because you certainly aren't buying both if you want to be a tank. I see the potential in Wit's Wnd, but it is a more expensive item and I would rather grab a Hexdrinker if your doing it for the MR + damage, because you can then build a Maw of Malmortius.

[FoShizzleMyGrizzle]

While I would never build a triforce early, I also don't build a wit's end. I save triforce as a last item when I have a shit ton of gold stocked up. Sheen is good enough for early/mid game. The only jungler I rush triforce on is Hecarim, and even then I grab some defense first.

Sheen and Wit's End are just two different build styles, because you certainly aren't buying both if you want to be a tank. I see the potential in Wit's Wnd, but it is a more expensive item and I would rather grab a Hexdrinker if your doing it for the MR + damage, because you can then build a Maw of Malmortius.

Any idea how much your dmg / survivability will increase with an early Triforce?
its tons.

[Duilliath]

Far less than a Sheen + Negatron Cloak + Chain Mail + Giant's Belt.

Surviving with only a Triforce is crap seeing how the damn thing costs 4k, which is TONS OF GOLD and lets everyone else complete one other major buy and purchase half of a second (such as Glacial Shroud to upgrade into FH).

[Toxigen]

Wit's End is too good, I really think that and Frozen Heart are required Skarner items.

Build order is the toughest question. I find myself trying to get to this setup

T2 Boots
Philo
HoG
Wit's End
Glacial Shroud

Good armor / MR, some CDR, and attack speed to keep those Qs pumping. Your jungle clear times are through the roof, the gold is coming in hard and fast which allows you to ward the hell out of their jungle...which is WAY more important than a lot of people realize. As a double GP/5 jungler, you should be buying just as many wards as the bottom lane support.

I like to keep the GP/5 items as long as possible, but having a Shurelyas for team fights is incredibly important. As soon as people group up I'm upgrading that and keeping the HoG to tick away for ward money.

Skarner Core:
T2 Boots
Wit's End
Frozen Heart
Shurelyas

Everything else is icing on the cake, and I think you simply build based on the individual game.

If you've always played Skarner rushing Sheen into TF, please...please....try Wit's End / Frozen Heart.

[Deleted]

I agree Frozen Heart is nice, but for an AP heavy team what's a good MR counterpart?

[Toxigen]

I agree Frozen Heart is nice, but for an AP heavy team what's a good MR counterpart?

Force of Nature or Banshee's Veil plus Wit's End

[Deleted]

Build IMO: Philostone, merc threads (ninja tabi if they dont have so much AP), RUSH TRIFORCE ! which means: Phage > Sheen > Zeal
Then, get a Frozen heart to go retardmode @ their AD/AD carries. Go Gunblade, also you can go Will of the Ancient (WotA) to heal like a boss.
So, build Skarner Hybrid, cus thats what he really IS. Hybrid.
Also, never. buy. RAGEBLADE. Its the worst item in the game. Even a longsword is better for Skarner. Also, you can go a bit tankier with Omen, FoN, Mogs instead of going Wota. Yes. you want Gunblade for the AP/AD and the use slow. Which is really really good.
Uhm..Maw anyone? havent tested it, but it can save your life with the Hexdrinker proc !
I play Skarner at 1.3k 1.5k elo matches. Always works out the way I want.
Forget Maw ! GO Wits end. Forgot about that 1.

WotA on Skarner? I have honestly never ever seen someone do it, let alone even think about trying it. Imo that's 2500g poorly spend.

[Axethor]

Wit's end Skarner. Just tried it in a game, and I feel while your early game damage doesn't ramp up as fast as a sheen, your late game damage stays more constant. All my cool downs were up so fast I had my ult for pretty much every team fight and a few skirmishes in between. My shield only fell off if I was focused. I was able to turn a 3v4 losing team fight into a win for us, and our Hecarim had like 10% health left when it started, though that is probably saying more about ult usage and enemy skill than the build itself (the enemy WW was even surprised I pulled it off).

I haven't had that much fun playing Skarner in a long time and I'll play a few more games with this build before I use it in ranked.

[FoShizzleMyGrizzle]

WotA on Skarner? I have honestly never ever seen someone do it, let alone even think about trying it. Imo that's 2500g poorly spend.

Oh yh...That was pre-"nerf" of WotA btw... Tho it does work, you'll heal like crazy with E>Q combo on creeps

[Deleted]

So after playing him for like 6 or 7 times since this thread, and winning all the games quite easily (or so it felt at least), I'm here to say Skarner is still quite OP.