About Crucifixes, Pentagrams

[ManOluck]

If you noticed when playing Diablo 3, there were almost no images of a pentagrams or actual crosses (Babylonian era) . In Diablo 3, and perhaps Diablo 4, these powerful images are censored to be shells of their true image as indicated below:





Now compare that to Diablo 1





Or Diablo 2





There is something to be said about these iconic images. In Diablo 1 you would see burning upside down crucifixes and other hellish images that could be linked to real world culture. I feel these images add a sense of horror that cannot be replicated by "fleshing out" a new world and creating "stylized" gothic images. I personally feel censorship does not belong in a game like diablo if they want to recreate a sense of horror and dread of the previous games.

What do you think?

[Schmeebs]

Its not really censorship, its more marketing. Certain countries take a hard line of using religious imagery in certain connotations. If they make it 'almost close enough' and more stylized, they get to market in more countries and face less backlash. More money goes to blizzard, and the people that super care about 'censorship' as you say, are such a small minority that alienating them makes little to no difference to the actual sales numbers (Mostly because if you want to buy the next diablo you will still buy it, and probably just complain about 'cancel culture'.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Because of the religious connection and when it comes to religion there's still quite a bit of people that take that shit super seriously. If you find that fake...look at the Bible Belt and you'll get what I mean. Personally pentagrams and such don't really make the franchise better, nor will I miss them either. Its just a religious symbol we're used to.

[Unholyground]

Its not really censorship, its more marketing. Certain countries take a hard line of using religious imagery in certain connotations. If they make it 'almost close enough' and more stylized, they get to market in more countries and face less backlash. More money goes to blizzard, and the people that super care about 'censorship' as you say, are such a small minority that alienating them makes little to no difference to the actual sales numbers (Mostly because if you want to buy the next diablo you will still buy it, and probably just complain about 'cancel culture'.

The countries that take those hard lines are garbage. Religion is just utter bullshit and has been proven such.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

So Diablo moves more towards original imagery and you think it's censorship? It was never a Christian game or based on real life. It's much better to move away from real-world imagery and do something creative.

[LemonDemonGirl]

Probably so the game dosen't get banned for imagery like that? I know that it's kinda illegal in some places to show crosses and pentagrams in video games

[A Chozo]

Times change

And it's better that they develop their in-universe icons instead of using stuff associated with the real world - who in Sanctuary was actually dramatically crucified to warrant the uses of crosses?

[ManOluck]

So Diablo moves more towards original imagery and you think it's censorship? It was never a Christian game or based on real life. It's much better to move away from real-world imagery and do something creative.

Its hard , if not impossible to recreate the emotional impact these images have after centuries of culture. Hell the word Diablo is just Spanish for "Devil". Based on your logic they should rename the game.

- - - Updated - - -

Times change

And it's better that they develop their in-universe icons instead of using stuff associated with the real world - who in Sanctuary was actually dramatically crucified to warrant the uses of crosses?

Lol if you play diablo 1, the whole game is littered with upside down crosses and people cruxified upside down. Hell they're even burning.

- - - Updated - - -

So Diablo moves more towards original imagery and you think it's censorship? It was never a Christian game or based on real life. It's much better to move away from real-world imagery and do something creative.

How was Diablo 1 and 2 not creative? These images are part of "gothic horror" which so many people criticized Diablo 3 lacked. You can't recreate these images and expect the same emotional impact. They are supposed to be disturbing and offensive. That's the entire point.

[XDurionX]

How was Diablo 1 and 2 not creative? These images are part of "gothic horror" which so many people criticized Diablo 3 lacked. You can't recreate these images and expect the same emotional impact. They are supposed to be disturbing and offensive. That's the entire point.

There's hardly anything more cliché and sucked dry than pentagrams and turned crosses, come on. Are you 14?

[Shelly]

It was less about censorship and more about making the game more original - although I'll agree that they tended to veer more towards generic magic symbols than anything else.

It remains true though that the religions depicted in Diablo are not Christianity so just throwing out Christian symbology doesn't really make sense unless you are just looking to be an edgelord.

[ManOluck]

It was less about censorship and more about making the game more original - although I'll agree that they tended to veer more towards generic magic symbols than anything else.

It remains true though that the religions depicted in Diablo are not Christianity so just throwing out Christian symbology doesn't really make sense unless you are just looking to be an edgelord.

I agree the new symbols are pretty generic. Although, I firmly believe the original symbolism adds , albeit a subconscious, emotional impact that cannot be recreated with a creative take. There's just to much history behind these symbols to ignore this fact.


For example, if you recall the image in the game (Diablo 1) of a child on an Altar that has been exsanguinated by a priest of faith endowed with crucifix's on his sash, it would have a less impactful meaning if the sash had the Nike symbol.

[Schmeebs]

The countries that take those hard lines are garbage. Religion is just utter bullshit and has been proven such.

Be that as it may. Blizzard is a company, making a video game they want to sell to make the maximum number of moneys. To do so they should maximize their marketshare, getting banned from a country with large conservative christian majorities (First to come to my mind atm is Poland with its recent abortion ban) is a bad business decision. And since blizzard isn't trying to make a particular pro-satanist/anti-christian stance with their game, it makes no sense to try and alienate them.

[Unholyground]

Be that as it may. Blizzard is a company, making a video game they want to sell to make the maximum number of moneys. To do so they should maximize their marketshare, getting banned from a country with large conservative christian majorities (First to come to my mind atm is Poland with its recent abortion ban) is a bad business decision. And since blizzard isn't trying to make a particular pro-satanist/anti-christian stance with their game, it makes no sense to try and alienate them.

Ya and it makes them sellouts unfortunately.

[Hellobolis]

wasnt the first scene of the announcement trailer a cross?

[Schmeebs]

Ya and it makes them sellouts unfortunately.

Cant really be a sellout when you are already a AAA big game corporation, they already are 'The Man'

[ManOluck]

Be that as it may. Blizzard is a company, making a video game they want to sell to make the maximum number of moneys. To do so they should maximize their marketshare, getting banned from a country with large conservative christian majorities (First to come to my mind atm is Poland with its recent abortion ban) is a bad business decision. And since blizzard isn't trying to make a particular pro-satanist/anti-christian stance with their game, it makes no sense to try and alienate them.

I feel It has nothing to do with being pro or anti satanist or christian. It's the world they built using concepts based in reality to drive home the emotions attached to the game itself when the user interacts with the product. It's the fact these images are so well known in society and how they have effected how the world was shaped, as we know it, that allows the player to feel what they feel when they play Diablo(again may I remind you that the name Diablo is just Spanish for Devil).

They talk about Angels and Demons, beings based in Christianity, its a very conflicting point of view to only go half assed with the concepts when you have already created a precedence in your previous games. Why call them Angels and Demons at all? Why not just call them YUmashdlkasjd and XIhomsdad so you can remove all semblance of a reality based link in your game.

The move feels completely forced and reeks of censorship. Hell just look at the Diablo 3 image at the beginning of this thread with Adria on the pseudo Pentagram....

[Dread Pirate Phayde]

Can't say I'd really call it censorship when Blizzard decided to make those changes, they weren't "forced" to do it. Its about fitting the theme of the game I'd say. Seeing that stuff also doesn't evoke any emotion in me, its all just part of the art design.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

pseudo Pentagram....

It looks like one and if you showed it to an evangelical, they'd freak out. Its not a case of censorship either.

[ManOluck]

Can't say I'd really call it censorship when Blizzard decided to make those changes, they weren't "forced" to do it. Its about fitting the theme of the game I'd say. Seeing that stuff also doesn't evoke any emotion in me, its all just part of the art design.

And yet Diablo 3 was criticized so harshly for its art Design and not feeling like a Diablo game at all. Granted the art design critiques of Diablo 3 are multi faceted but I feel small changes like the ones mentioned above had a huge impact on the "gothic feel" not being captured that was expressed by fans. This is just one facet that may not have been considered and hence the discussion.

[Schmeebs]

It has nothing to do with being pro or anti satanist or christian. It's the world they built using concepts based in reality to drive home the emotions attached to the game itself when the user interacts with the product. It's the fact these images are so well known in society and how they have effected how the world was shaped, as we know it, that allows the player feel what they feel when they play Diablo(again may I remind you that the name Diablo is just Spanish for Devil).

They talk about Angels and Demons, beings based in Christianity, its a very conflicting point of view to only go half assed with the concepts when you have already created a precedence in your previous games. Why call them Angels and Demons at all? Call them YUmashb and XIhoms so you can removed all semblance of a reality based link.

The move feels completely forced and reeks of censorship. Hell just look at the Diablo 3 image at the beginning of this thread with Adria on the pseudo Pentagram....

Again, you can't really 'sell out' when you are already one of the biggest Triple AAA studios.

Self-censorship is something everyone does. You wouldn't run around your workplace spouting racial epithets and profanity even if thats how you interact with close friends online.

I think you are way more invested in Diablo having pentagrams, crucifixed, and such, than any Blizzard developer ever was :P