Alliance Theramore Scenario - Get your fist pumping pride here!

[Deleted]

By the way, so I don't forget, based on how the quests are formulated, the Horde came, destroyed Theramore and left, leaving 2-3 orcs and a siege engine to destroy what's left and kill any survivors. This is like going to attack a military base, destroying it, then putting 2 guards at the gate to make sure the enemy doesn't take whatever is left back and they come and kill the two guards and plant their flag back.

As I said, you want both factions to feel ok-ish? Good, we need to destroy Theramore, fine by me, but leave something for the Alliance, say that maybe a Horde skyship was left above it since they thought Jaina is still around and you, as an Alliance player, destroy at least that.

The Horde say "remember Taurajo". Well remember Taurajo? You, as Horde went, helped survivors... then killed the general responsible for your loss alongside many of his soldiers and the looters. We, Alliance, let your general escape and only kill the looters and don't even help survivors, but put the bodies to rest, since they're all dead except Jaina...

[Infernix]

Honestly, the whole thing is disappointing. If I played Alliance characters at ALL, I'd be pissed beyond words.

The whole thing smacks of laziness, of half-hearted interest in a faction that they don't care for.

They could have made the Alliance-side Scenario so amazing. The tools are there, the situation is prime for a "Last Stand" scenario at Theramore's shattered gates, but no. No, they decide to make the alliance come in and play clean up. "TOO LATE LOL NOW GO KILL SOME STRAGGLERS AND A BOGGED DOWN SIEGE ENGINE".

That isn't going to get fists pumping. It's going to get people unsubbing and going to play a game where both factions get reasons to be proud of their colors.

[Trassk]

I just find it disgusting how they are making this for the horde. Ok, so the horde is currently lead by a warmonger tyrent who now goes as far to bomb his rivals cities and dam to the innocent civilians, showing the speech he made in stonetalon to have been utter crap. But having the player forced to follow with this, this is the first time I might just skip the whole thing, since as an rper, my characters are against seeing innocents killed by reckless acts of war and violence.

This there is no option in this, and as horde we're meant to just nod our heads and go along with it, without getting to choose 'do you want to follow these warsong marauders, or do you want to step away from this attack', then I just refuse to do it.

[luccadeo]

I'm shocked Alliance characters don't have to buy a book to actually get their story. Sadly once more it shows Horde favoritism by Blizz.

[Falrinn]

By the way, so I don't forget, based on how the quests are formulated, the Horde came, destroyed Theramore and left, leaving 2-3 orcs and a siege engine to destroy what's left and kill any survivors. This is like going to attack a military base, destroying it, then putting 2 guards at the gate to make sure the enemy doesn't take whatever is left back and they come and kill the two guards and plant their flag back.

As I said, you want both factions to feel ok-ish? Good, we need to destroy Theramore, fine by me, but leave something for the Alliance, say that maybe a Horde skyship was left above it since they thought Jaina is still around and you, as an Alliance player, destroy at least that.

The Horde say "remember Taurajo". Well remember Taurajo? You, as Horde went, helped survivors... then killed the general responsible for your loss alongside many of his soldiers and the looters. We, Alliance, let your general escape and only kill the looters and don't even help survivors, but put the bodies to rest, since they're all dead except Jaina...

You are making a lot of assumptions.

We don't know how many Horde soldiers remain. It probably won't be a huge number, but I'd be willing to bet it'll be a heck of a lot more then 2 or 3. Also while we only have an objective to find Jaina, that doesn't mean she's literally the only Alliance member left alive on Theramore Isle. Who knows how many people she'll have with her, or escaped outside the context of the Alliance scenario.

I'll agree however, that blowing up the Horde gunship that was used in the attack on Theramore would probably be a lot more fulfilling then destroying a ground Siege Weapon. Hopefully it's a really, really big siege weapon at the very least.

[Tripz]

Heroic last stand? You guys unknowingly got glassed! For example, Japan was so shocked when their city's got bombed, they surrendered!

Be happy the alliance wont surrender.

[Falrinn]

I just find it disgusting how they are making this for the horde. Ok, so the horde is currently lead by a warmonger tyrent who now goes as far to bomb his rivals cities and dam to the innocent civilians, showing the speech he made in stonetalon to have been utter crap. But having the player forced to follow with this, this is the first time I might just skip the whole thing, since as an rper, my characters are against seeing innocents killed by reckless acts of war and violence.

This there is no option in this, and as horde we're meant to just nod our heads and go along with it, without getting to choose 'do you want to follow these warsong marauders, or do you want to step away from this attack', then I just refuse to do it.

Well you can always not do the Scenario.

What would stepping aside even entail anyways? Entering the scenario then almost immediately leaving? Would it lead to a completely different scenario, so that the Horde basically get 2 different scenarios for the same event? What would happen if part of the group wants to go forward with the attack, and another wants to step aside?

The game isn't really set up to allow a moral choice system. While I understand your motive in suggesting it, it's just not feasible from a game mechanics standpoint without implementing a complete moral choice system into the core of the game (likely requiring far more dev time then every expansion pre-event put together).

[mysticx]

You say this, so if that's the case why would anyone launch a surprise attack ever? For that matter, how could anyone ever take any land? Any minor confrontation should result in the full military power of either side instantly being teleported on top of each other by that logic.

Well, this IS a fantasy game, but beyond that it's yet another "Caught with their pants down"-moment for the alliance, since after an expansion full of horde aggression we totally didn't see this sort of thing coming, right?

It just isn't any fun to be stuck doing cleanup-work after the fact (Digging out Jaina and killing some stragglers, truly the thing epic fantasy is made of) when you know that the horde gets to actually accomplish something in their scenario in the same area (And actually seeing the attack to boot), it's the difference between "Something happened! go mop up!" and "Something is about to happen, take part in it!" that is getting very, VERY old by now.

[Falrinn]

I'm shocked Alliance characters don't have to buy a book to actually get their story. Sadly once more it shows Horde favoritism by Blizz.

I don't really think there is a lot more Alliance lore then Horde lore that's completely locked up in books. For every major Alliance event that is, there's almost always an important Horde event as well.

Anyways Blizzard has admitted they need to do a better job at getting major book events implemented into the game, and this is likely part of that goal. I wouldn't be surprised if wanting to show the aftermath of the battle as told in the book was part of the reason Blizzard chose to set the Alliance scenario at that point.

[Blayze]

I'm shocked Alliance characters don't have to buy a book to actually get their story. Sadly once more it shows Horde favoritism by Blizz.

We are. It's called Tides of War. This is just bullshit cleanup by nameless "heroes."

[StaeleAilar]

Ohhh, you get to destroy a... siege engine! One lonely siege engine! It's ok, Garrosh has 10 at the backgate of Orgrimmar. Now if you'd have destroyed a Horde skyship I'd have said, it's epic for both the Horde and the Alliance, but a siege engine? hahhahahahahahahahaha.


Indeed, considering how most Alliance bases look and how Theramore looked in that preview a few weeks ago, we just need a bunch of tents and it's as good as any Alliance stronghold:
-tents check
-partially destroyed walls check

Exactly what im thinking >.> Sigh, if this is the crap we have to play Alliance side, Jaina better become some kick-ass character and not fall by the wayside because "it didn't fit" (Hello Abyssal Maw in an elemental themed expansion... ah now i'm rambling.

I understand we have to account for the possibility that Blizzard is going to mess this one up. But always assuming the absolute worst is no way to enjoy the game.

It is, however, the safest way to not get your hopes up or get excited at the prospect that your lore characters have been promised development but realistically, probably will not get it.

[FlacidGladiator]

Reading some of the posts here is both mind-boggling and hilarious. You're getting your panties in a wad that Theramore is being razed for its part in the invasion of the Barrens and the resulting massacre at Camp Turajo. You saw some consternation from hordies, but man, nothing like what you guys are spouting off. If you want to know why the horde is burning Theramore to the ground take a stroll through the Barrens and see the forts that will soon be choked of supply and material being built there. See the still smoldering ruins of Camp Turajo. You honestly expect that the horde would just let this happen with no response? You feel its unjustified? I'm surprised its taking them this long to burn the only deep water mainland port the alliance has to the ground. Expect the harbor to be mined by the goblins and the debris from Theramore bulldozed into the harbor to make it unserviceable. That's what I'd do.

[Falrinn]

Well, this IS a fantasy game, but beyond that it's yet another "Caught with their pants down"-moment for the alliance, since after an expansion full of horde aggression we totally didn't see this sort of thing coming, right?

The funny thing is, the reason there is so much Horde aggression in Cataclysm is because the intial state of questing has the Alliance very deep in Horde territory, while the Horde is mostly absent from low-level Alliance lands. Had the Alliance kept winning in say, Azshara, they would of won the war by the time players hit level 20. Not to mention the Alliance invasion of the Southern Barrens, which had the potential of breaking through into Mulgore if it kept being as successful as it was initially.

That isn't to say that the Horde doesn't have it's more then it's share of aggression, just that the problem was more one of story execution then the actual story.

[StaeleAilar]

Reading some of the posts here is both mind-boggling and hilarious. You're getting your panties in a wad that Theramore is being razed for its part in the invasion of the Barrens and the resulting massacre at Camp Turajo. You saw some consternation from hordies, but man, nothing like what you guys are spouting off. If you want to know why the horde is burning Theramore to the ground take a stroll through the Barrens and see the forts that will soon be choked of supply and material being built there. See the still smoldering ruins of Camp Turajo. You honestly expect that the horde would just let this happen with no response? You feel its unjustified? I'm surprised its taking them this long to burn the only deep water mainland port the alliance has to the ground. Expect the harbor to be mined by the goblins and the debris from Theramore bulldozed into the harbor to make it unserviceable. That's what I'd do.

Admittedly haven't read all of the posts in this thread, however of the ones i did read, i don't recall, nor do i get the impression anyone is in a miff because Theramore gets destroyed. More the fact that we get to, as alliance, YET AGAIN arrive too late to do anything meaningful for our faction. Just like all of the cata questing zones, we JUST start to get ahead, then we are sent elsewhere and we lose on that front.

[Deathgoose]

How come Horde players can say, "They destroyed Camp Taco! Theramore staging ground! RABBLE! !" it's not whining, but in fact perfectly fine justification.

But if Alliance players would suggest, for instant, we go nuke Undercity finally, since "They destroyed South Shore! Turned everyone to goo! RABBLE! !" then it is instantly labeled typical Alliance crybaby whining?

[luccadeo]

Admittedly haven't read all of the posts in this thread, however of the ones i did read, i don't recall, nor do i get the impression anyone is in a miff because Theramore gets destroyed. More the fact that we get to, as alliance, YET AGAIN arrive too late to do anything meaningful for our faction. Just like all of the cata questing zones, we JUST start to get ahead, then we are sent elsewhere and we lose on that front.

This is exactly how I feel on all my Ally toons. It is sad really.

[Ebildays]

How come Horde players can say, "They destroyed Camp Taco! Theramore staging ground! RABBLE! !" it's not whining, but in fact perfectly fine justification.

But if Alliance players would suggest, for instant, we go nuke Undercity finally, since "They destroyed South Shore! Turned everyone to goo! RABBLE! !" then it is instantly labeled typical Alliance crybaby whining?

Maybe because Undercity is a major Horde city and Theramore is not a major Alliance city. It would be overkill for them to go that far because South Shore was destoryed.

From a questing stand point in the old world Alliance had better questing and more questing areas, in the bid to make things more equal the Alliance had to lose more ground than the Horde because they had more. It looks like the Horde is being favored but it is not. This is just my take from having leveled both Alliance and Horde characters in the old world 1-60 zones.

[mysticx]

How come Horde players can say, "They destroyed Camp Taco! Theramore staging ground! RABBLE! !" it's not whining, but in fact perfectly fine justification.

But if Alliance players would suggest, for instant, we go nuke Undercity finally, since "They destroyed South Shore! Turned everyone to goo! RABBLE! !" then it is instantly labeled typical Alliance crybaby whining?

It's called double standards, i have seen so much of it in horde reactions to alliance concerns, as well as their "Remember Taurajo"-chanting, we could do the same, but yelling "Remember Southshore! and Silverwind refuge! Gilneas as well! and that druid school up in Stonetalon! and Bael Modan! Andorhal too! and soon Theramore!" just doesn't have the same "Oomph" to it, i suppose...

But beyond that, it's not even the losing all the time that gets to me (Well, doesn't get to me the most anyway), it's the fact that besides that druid school, it all happens off-screen, there's no real involvement, just "While you were away we did the alliance-thing and failed!", so claiming "It makes for a good story" is a silly argument too, maybe "It makes a great story for the horde", since they're the ones who, you know, actually see it!

[Trassk]

What happened to camp taurajo was terrible, and yes those from theramore made the first move, and many tauren died. But I hold Varian accountable for that in pushing for this to happen.

Blizzard truly failed to establish Jaina's thoughts on the invasion of the barrens and if she did or didn't agree with it. I honestly can not accept Jaina would agree with Varian's choice to invade the barrens, after she herself helped Baine reclaim thunderbluff from the grimtotem, its such failed and inconsistent lore its shameful.

[luccadeo]

They won't have time to create content for Alliance as they are busy creating amazing things for the Horde.