BWE2 Feedback/Impression Discussion Thread!

[Deleted]

rat-things

*Glares*

I don't like you anymore.

[Deleted]

*Glares*

I don't like you anymore.

*looks at avatar picture*

*nods to self*

[Squirrelbanes]

I think the best thing they did was the /say and the chat bubbles. Talking without shrieking at everyone in the zone? Yes please =3

And sadly, as much as I want to play one of the rat-things, I doubt Sylvari and Asura will be available until launch. They'll want to keep some stuff a surprise, and I understand that. Doesn't mean I like it though >=(

Asura are not rat-things, AE. I'm both shocked and saddened to see you referring to them as such :'(

---------- Post added 2012-06-13 at 12:56 PM ----------

*Glares*

I don't like you anymore.

Lol...beat me to it

[Deleted]

Asura are not rat-things, AE. I'm both shocked and saddened to see you referring to them as such :'(

I'm surprised she doesn't trip over her own oversized legs judging by her lack of anatomical knowledge.

[Squirrelbanes]

I'm surprised she doesn't trip over her own oversized legs judging by her lack of anatomical knowledge.

I met them once, what seems long ago now. They seemed so nice. I would almost say they had a slyvari's joyous zeal.
Now though.......I just don't know anymore...

[Deleted]

I met them once, what seems long ago now. They seemed so nice. I would almost say they had a slyvari's joyous zeal.
Now though.......I just don't know anymore...

I was under the impression I also shot you in the face.

[Squirrelbanes]

I was under the impression I also shot you in the face.

I ducked, remember? Guess uv still not recovered from the fireball induced concussion.

[Deleted]

I ducked, remember? Guess uv still not recovered from the fireball induced concussion.

If I had access to my screenshots, I'd prove that I shot you! Several times! Before you even realised! =p

[Squirrelbanes]

If I had access to my screenshots, I'd prove that I shot you! Several times! Before you even realised! =p

Well....that was while you were asking me to stand still so you could get some good shots xD I just thought u meant screenshots and not, like, lead shots to the head

[Glytch]

Dislike minimap changes, I demand the ability to ping and draw without having to modify click. Give us a lock option
Minimap news more gradations ESP between the closest zoom and the next higher
Agree with vega (or however he spells it) that all traits should be unlocked for hitting 30 pt. take it a step farther and allow 20 points to unlock master traits for both slot 1 and slot 2 along with idea of allowing all traits in a line unlocked for any slot in that line at 30

Thieves need more robust support. ESP ones not tied to traits. And obtainable by lvl 30
Pvp items nees a cleaner interface for augmenting armor and weapons, something similar to the gw1 pvp gear menu for pvp chars. Not banks and vendors
Numbers for healing are either off or doesn't show with a scale that's realatable to the actual effect (withdraw heals for 138 but it's really healing for more)
Higher lvl areas needs more events more often
Some enemy cues aren't easily visible in large groups
Need way too much copper ore to make shit
Still wishing for a 4th elite skill per profession (ain't happening)
The cross profession combo "splat" needs to stay on screen longer or have the option to do so. It also doesn't seem to show up all the time

Dodge gauge should turn a different color when you can't dodge (red?)

[Balfire]

Dislike minimap changes, I demand the ability to ping and draw without having to modify click. Give us a lock option
Minimap news more gradations ESP between the closest zoom and the next higher
Agree with vega (or however he spells it) that all traits should be unlocked for hitting 30 pt. take it a step farther and allow 20 points to unlock master traits for both slot 1 and slot 2 along with idea of allowing all traits in a line unlocked for any slot in that line at 30

Thieves need more robust support. ESP ones not tied to traits. And obtainable by lvl 30
Pvp items nees a cleaner interface for augmenting armor and weapons, something similar to the gw1 pvp gear menu for pvp chars. Not banks and vendors
Numbers for healing are either off or doesn't show with a scale that's realatable to the actual effect (withdraw heals for 138 but it's really healing for more)
Higher lvl areas needs more events more often
Some enemy cues aren't easily visible in large groups
Need way too much copper ore to make shit
Still wishing for a 4th elite skill per profession (ain't happening)
The cross profession combo "splat" needs to stay on screen longer or have the option to do so. It also doesn't seem to show up all the time

Dodge gauge should turn a different color when you can't dodge (red?)

I loved the map.
Enemy cues needs to be easier. I just don't know how. WoW did this through overly large bosses but it doesn't fit without the cartoony aesthetics.
I found crafting not that difficult especially because my time was well spent; crafting/gathering give decent exp.'
I thought the dodge gage was very easy to read, <half = Cant dodge.

As for my own feedback.
Engies still need some work their kits don't do enough outside of bomb kit to be worth the skill slot, mines especially need a damage buff they should be a threat used to deny an area as it is now any squishy will run over them and barely notice. Glue shot and Glue bomb do not work as advertised they slow/immobilze nothing unless you land a very direct hit. And overall engies just need a bit higher damage. Not asking for too much i love being the ultility/CC monster I am but its not worth anything without damage to back it up and leveling is an extreme pain compared to the Warrior/Ele/Ranger/Guardian/Mesmer I leveled as well.

Mesmers need a new mechanic. The shatter spells aren't very good and after last patch do not near enough damage, clones also hit for 0 90% of the time in level 1-10. I love the clones but I think the mechanic should have something to do with swapping places with them + the shatter mechanic.

Like instead of just doing damage Mind Wreck could swap us with closest clone and a second click would cause it to shatter. Similar effects added to all shatters would allow the mesmer to actually be a bit tricky and people would question where the real one was instead of THAT ONES CASTING SPELLS GET HIM. I also think Phantasms and Clones should be seperated. Like we get 2 of each. Blowing up a Phantasm hitting for 50 a hit really sucks when you have two clones there doing 0-1 dps.

Respawn rates of both DE's and MOBs need to be looked at the human zone was a constant cluster fuck of DE's 3-4 on my screen at a time in some places. And fighting your way out of a cave is crazy hard you will pull 3 mobs get 2 down and the 3rd is respawning again.

MOB exp also needs to be looked at. I don't want grinding to be a viable form of leveling but it shouldn't be a huge waste of time. With the current mobs giving such low exp its not even worth my time to fight if I get attacked. I'd rather just run away. Besides I enjoy grinding in areas I like or while waiting on people/chatting.

One last thing I missed. I really wish we could jump/fall and cast at the same time. I was really looking forward to pulling off the old rogue jump off cliff and shadowstep to the idiot following you at the last second. It really hinders some great uses of environment that should be rewarded not punished.

[Maarius]

Only thing annoying me at the moment is the silly amount of knockbacks in PvP.

With no DR on anything people with brains just chain them into you so you can't do anything.

you will have much fun by improving your stability.


@Syxz: hi there just a few words:

Leveling:

I think there might be a tiny issue for new comers when you hit an event that’s been going for quite a while. I came to the bridge, after I had ventured to the inn. They were ready to move on when I arrived. So I joined up for the next event. The assault of the centaurs and the fight with the Earth Hands. Though that was rather funny (also a little confusing, resulting in me entering downed state quite a few times), it had a severe (I feel) impact on my stance afterwards.
After the cut scene I was left with still only 1 attack unlocked and not very much xp. Okay, it’s not critical, but as a complete noob it was a little sad to see the little progress made.

My main concern was that it actually took a fair amount of time to unlock the abilities. I personally feel that the speed of which you unlock new abilities could use a tiny boost. The general idea is good. Don’t throw to many possibilities in a noobs head from start. It would overwhelm most people.

1.) those downed states in the tutorial boss battles are intended, to learn about the downed state. The following rally too. So don't be afraid the next time
2.) the tutorial area lets you become familiar with the movement and combat. Enemies are extremely weak. You level your weapon-skills by kills. It is really a good idea if you take your time and kill those invading centaurs in the tutorial. That way you level your skills much faster than by killing the stronger enemies after the tutorial. Sure, it's possible to not kill a single mob in the first minutes or even later on, but I'd recommend to take your time at the start, this way you actually safe time later on for unlocking skills.

Dynamic events:
Yet again I would like to remind that I’ve only played the first few levels.

A thing I noticed with dynamic events in the starting area is that they easily can get overcrowded.
As a human some of the first events you run into is the one “heart quest” at the farm. The one where worms and bandits appear and you have to feed the cows etc.
As a complete noob, this place felt so overcrowded, and it made it hard for me to do anything constructively. There might already be a solution to this, but it’s at least something to have in mind for launch.
Also other events had the problem. The one close to the farm, where you have to look in crates. That one suffered from a little of the same.

1.) actually the farm is not the first heart you "should" encounter, I think it was for lv.4 players, turn right after the bridge and you'll find a lower level heart, much less crowded, as well as the follow up heart on the dam.
2.) Yes I think it will be crowded at release, but don't forget: there were only 3 from 5 races playable. A lot of players will then play in these starting areas.
3.) You don't have to make the hearts in a special order, just come back to crowded ones later. You will get scaled back to the event-area and won't oneshot anything, so there is still fun in doing it later. It's really an old convention that mmo-players think they have to do things in a specific order. There is a lot to do and most things provide you xp. Even exploring gives you a lot of xp. Explore the cities of humans for example. It gives you a bonus for finding all waypoints & points of interest. You can then easily go through the Asura-portal in the centre of Divinity's Reach to visit Lions Arch and from there through a portal to the other big cities. 4.) Why not start with a heart from a lower populated race? As mentioned don't be afraid to outlevel anything in GW2, it won't happen

Duels:
Just a side note: Please implant some way to duel your friends. It has so many positive sides and I personally can’t find any negative sides.
You can test out different abilities, moves and all that kind of stuff. It’s a great way of practicing PvP.
And if you do it fancy, you might even be able to find a way for two (or even more) persons dueling an equal (or lower or higher) amount of friends.
That would be so awesome and so useful!

official word was: they are implementing it but they aren't sure if they can do it for release.

What I loved about the game in it's current state: you could duel with NPC Bots in the Heart of the Mists. They had bots in small arenas for that, I can remember an Elementalist bot, a Guardian bot and a Engineer bot, not sure if there were more of them. It was actually quite fun and challenging at first. Great to try out the skills and defensive maneuvers.

Edit: lol, you mentioned those NPCs in your next point

PVP:
Another thing that is really worth mentioning. I had a ranger friend with me and we both fought againt the NPCs. He did so much better than I because the NPCs only attacked his pet. I tried to go for minion master, and the NPCs also attacked my pet, leaving me completely alone. This is an issue because it gives a false sense of power and control. You think you’re better than you are. And not only that, it removes the point of practice, since the majority of players in PvP would not attack the pet in the most situations. They would focus their fire against ranger itself.
I think the NPCs should try to resemble that. So a way to make the NPCs mainly attack the ranger (and necromancer) would be a great idea!

good point, hope you or someone mentioned this in the beta-forums

Feeling disappointed and disoriented:

I found myself disoriented because there were so many things happening around me that I knew nothing about. What did that elementalist just do? Why did that guardian take no damage? Why can’t I move? How could that thief literally kill me in five second?
Disoriented, dying over and over again, killing no enemies, and just generally suck at the game made me disappointed. I knew nothing about how to avoid attacks. I could not “read” the situation and anticipate my enemies incoming attacks I should avoid (this maybe can be due to the fact that I probably have low frame rate because of bad computer). I did not know how to combine my damage. I did not know the best way to handle my conditions. The only thing I knew was that I kept dying, over and over again. I felt so powerless!
Yes, I was bad at the game. I probably still are. But usually I have an idea of what to do and when. I did not have that idea here.

Playing PvE helps a lot in understanding the different classes and actions. I read an interview with the developers where they mentioned this too, the game should learn you how to play in order to get familiar with your class and become ready for PvP. You can feel this in the enemy-design. Enemies don't just do damage until they or you die. Each family of enemies has different special attacks that learn you certain aspects of the game. Take, for example, the centaurs early on. They have the block-skill the warrior uses with his shield skill 5. You can't do damage when they hold their shields that way.


thanks for your feedback, found it quite interesting and well thought out opposed to other critics who just state what they think is bad but without real arguments and suggestions how it could be done better.

---------- Post added 2012-06-13 at 04:46 PM ----------

Dislike minimap changes, I demand

this is when I stopped reading

[Balfire]

this is when I stopped reading

Pretty sure he was joking dude, like when I go to my GF and "I DEMAND a sandwich" she knows I'm joking and teases me about asking nicely
I agree with his change I like drawing and pinging on GW1 very much.

[Maarius]

Pretty sure he was joking dude, like when I go to my GF and "I DEMAND a sandwich" she knows I'm joking and teases me about asking nicely
I agree with his change I like drawing and pinging on GW1 very much.

not sure, a lot of people demand certain things in the internet lately because they have the opinion Anet promised this and that Drawing on the map is still possible with shift+Mouse, not sure if this can be set in the options to 1 button. Don't see a problem with holding shift while drawing though.

[briktal]

Playing PvE helps a lot in understanding the different classes and actions. I read an interview with the developers where they mentioned this too, the game should learn you how to play in order to get familiar with your class and become ready for PvP. You can feel this in the enemy-design. Enemies don't just do damage until they or you die. Each family of enemies has different special attacks that learn you certain aspects of the game. Take, for example, the centaurs early on. They have the block-skill the warrior uses with his shield skill 5. You can't do damage when they hold their shields that way.

I don't know if the game does that well enough though. Granted, I've only played a few hours, but I never really got any sense of what kinds of things I need to be dodging/countering/etc in PvE.

[Glytch]

this is when I stopped reading

i demand that you read my damn post

srsface.jpg

---------- Post added 2012-06-13 at 01:53 PM ----------

not sure, a lot of people demand certain things in the internet lately because they have the opinion Anet promised this and that Drawing on the map is still possible with shift+Mouse, not sure if this can be set in the options to 1 button. Don't see a problem with holding shift while drawing though.

not having to rely on a modifier means everything when you need to draw quickly in a fight

thats like saying that your 1-0 abilities should be bound to shift + button, or alt + button or <insert key here> + button

because, you know, its not hard to hit a button while doing something else

---------- Post added 2012-06-13 at 01:56 PM ----------

I thought the dodge gage was very easy to read, <half = Cant dodge.

theres still ambiguity when it gets close to the black bar when you're glancing down at it in a fight, hence the color suggestion (with a meaningful difference suggested by red, both symbolically- read means bad- and the amount of change of the actual color - the majority of humans will say red looks significantly different than yellow )

colors are easier to see and more definitive instead of gut guessing if you have enough pixels or not

---------- Post added 2012-06-13 at 02:02 PM ----------

I found crafting not that difficult especially because my time was well spent; crafting/gathering give decent exp.'

i had to go back to queensdale and gather ore after i had diligently gathered it while going through the first time

i went from 33-35 just by mining copper to crack my WS over to using iron- which i had a metric shit ton of and have about 50 bars leftover without purposely trying to strip mine up half of tyria

a bit of an imbalance there

[Maarius]

not having to rely on a modifier means everything when you need to draw quickly in a fight

thats like saying that your 1-0 abilities should be bound to shift + button, or alt + button or <insert key here> + button

because, you know, its not hard to hit a button while doing something else

I have to admit that I never used drawing during action-battle in GW1... well if it is actually important than i'd suggest you ask Anet in their forum for a non-shift modifier option, shouldn't be too hard to implement if it really is that important for some.

[Deleted]

@Syxz: hi there just a few words:

Well hi :P

1.) those downed states in the tutorial boss battles are intended, to learn about the downed state. The following rally too. So don't be afraid the next time

Nice to know! Though I find it peculiar that when I made a second necromancer (my first one got trapped in the mist like many others) to play a new character with my ranger friend, I actually did avoid the downstate (and therefore logically also the rally). I don’t know if that happens because it’s then same profession as the one you have played or something like that. I just know I avoided it and thought: “Hey how did I do that xD?”

2.) the tutorial area lets you become familiar with the movement and combat. Enemies are extremely weak. You level your weapon-skills by kills. It is really a good idea if you take your time and kill those invading centaurs in the tutorial. That way you level your skills much faster than by killing the stronger enemies after the tutorial. Sure, it's possible to not kill a single mob in the first minutes or even later on, but I'd recommend to take your time at the start, this way you actually safe time later on for unlocking skills.

Well the issue was not that I did not want to kill anything. Uuuuh I would looooveee to kill things :P It was rather that the first necromancer I made arrived in time to actually barely participate in the event, making me not use my skills. It was much better when I tried to make a third character (elementalist). I got there early and unlocked a lot of skills.

2.) Yes I think it will be crowded at release, but don't forget: there were only 3 from 5 races playable. A lot of players will then play in these starting areas.

True. And it probably will also only be a problem during release. They should just be ready for it =)

3.) You don't have to make the hearts in a special order, just come back to crowded ones later. You will get scaled back to the event-area and won't oneshot anything, so there is still fun in doing it later. It's really an old convention that mmo-players think they have to do things in a specific order. There is a lot to do and most things provide you xp. Even exploring gives you a lot of xp. Explore the cities of humans for example. It gives you a bonus for finding all waypoints & points of interest. You can then easily go through the Asura-portal in the centre of Divinity's Reach to visit Lions Arch and from there through a portal to the other big cities. 4.) Why not start with a heart from a lower populated race? As mentioned don't be afraid to outlevel anything in GW2, it won't happen

I know that I do not need to them in a specific order. I’m just that type of person that like to finish what I’ve started :P So that’s why I usually stick around. But I did actually end up leaving the place and found something else.
About the exploring. Yeah I found out after the BWE. But I really love the idea! Because exploring is (personal opinion) so fun and exciting! What new wonders lies beyond that hillside? What’s down on the bottom of this lake? Wonder what mystery hides in this cave! Uuuuh I love it :P

official word was: they are implementing it but they aren't sure if they can do it for release.

That’s great news! Great news indeed!

good point, hope you or someone mentioned this in the beta-forums

I did =) Most of this post is original from my post at the beta forums.

Playing PvE helps a lot in understanding the different classes and actions. I read an interview with the developers where they mentioned this too, the game should learn you how to play in order to get familiar with your class and become ready for PvP. You can feel this in the enemy-design. Enemies don't just do damage until they or you die. Each family of enemies has different special attacks that learn you certain aspects of the game. Take, for example, the centaurs early on. They have the block-skill the warrior uses with his shield skill 5. You can't do damage when they hold their shields that way.

Well, while you’re right that the game does help you to comprehend certain skills and abilities through the PvE content, I still think that there is a need for some tutorials, and perhaps some better trait/skill/condition/boons tooltips.
I spoke with another friend who’s a beast at PvP (in any game) and he agreed with me that GW2 lack explanation. I could easily fear that in the silent majority of players, there would be a fair amount of people who feel confused. And some may, due to that confusion, get scared away from PvP, might even the game! And that would just be such a shame! Because when you start to comprehend the combat and the surroundings better, it becomes way more fun!

thanks for your feedback, found it quite interesting and well thought out opposed to other critics who just state what they think is bad but without real arguments and suggestions how it could be done better.

Well thanks a lot =) Glad you liked it! I actually feared that most people reading it would flame away. Especially after my PvP friend pointed out that my last section make me sound like such an annoying & dumb whiner (which I probably am, but that was not the intention with the feedback xD).

Though, because you just touch an interesting topic for me reading feedback, I just have a little comment regarding that :P I think that adding feedback should not necessarily be followed by suggestions of what to do. Sometimes not even arguments of why people think it’s bad. My reason for that is that just pointing out what feels wrong can be beneficial for a designer. Pointing out something is wrong can lead whoever is charge on the right direction. Because we might not have the insight to make an argument of why we think that does not work, perhaps we can’t even see what part of something it is that’s missing something. But just pointing out that something feels weird or not quite as it should be can lead to a solution. So I think it’s okay when people do it, just that it’s done in a proper tone and all that stuff :P
Well was kind of off topic, but the tendency of feedback always needing to be followed up by suggestions or arguments, is something I would like to nuance (if that’s the word).

But again, thanks a lot for reading !