[Megathread] Path of Exile

[Deleted]

I have a very similar build, just instead of that huge circle of HP nodes next to iron grip, i'm going for the ones in the marauder starting tree.

Will check out the guide, thx.

[Laikai]

And now to get a bow with a lot more base dps, rolling it until its better, recoloring and refusing again!

[Redblade]

I think you didnt understand what i typed.
PoE is said to be oriented to the hardcore comunity. I think u must agree with me that the "casual" comunity is much much greater. Being much greater most likely they contribute with more money then a small hardcore comunity.
Lets take the example of D3.
It sure drove many potencial players away due to the difficulty. Blizzard sensed this and couldnt just ignore the vast majority of the playerbase hence making the game easier to satisfy the casual player needs. As any company they want to make money and when the great majority of the paying customers arent eager to contribute with their money they just tend to their needs.

What i meant with ".. he hardcore players wont be supporting the game by buying stuff as much as they want to..." is that 5% of the playerbase doesnt contribute as much as the other 95% being this 95% the casual playerbase.

Unless each hardcore players is paying 20 times more than each player on the casual side

P.S the 5% and 95% numbers are made up and were meant to give a sense of proportion about what the sizes of casual vs hardcore playerbase.

Your whole theses is made up, there is nothing to support your claim, you would have to factor in how long the casual player sticks around compared to the hard core, how many paying casual players there are per non paying and compare that to the same information from the hardcore side, and so on.

It's a commonly used argument that the casual player base is what brings in the cash but so far I have not seen any hard evidence to support it. This is not to mention that PoE would all of the sudden be in competition with D3 and TL2 for the same players instead of carving it's own niche within the ARPG genre, a niche that no one else is filling currently.

[Kuntantee]

It's a commonly used argument that the casual player base is what brings in the cash but so far I have not seen any hard evidence to support it.

World of Warcraft(post-WOTLK), League of Legends, D3 and Facebook games are great examples. The decisions are made after serious analysis in these companies and I am pretty sure they saw the actual money comes from big majority which is casuals. However, that doesn't mean hardcore-player oriented games are not profitable.

[Redblade]

Crit-cold sorc, its not so much the build is weak, its just my gear aint up top pair, no great wealth, and nobody is selling items anyway when I'm spamming trade :/


Using totem with ice spear (Its not so much for damage, more to freeze mobs), frost-nova (I run into mobs to AOE, perma-freezing them if I dont die before I get my freeze up :P), another Ice Spear for high single target hit (Around 800 DPS atm, where my frost-nova is only like 250) and cold curse thingie. Simple build. Had all the gems and stuff for long time, and now also using 3 aura's. Gonna change Evade aura out for resist aura at some point I think. Else clarity and Energy shield aura is stable.

Its just with 1k energy shield I get near one-shot all the time.

My build at 59 just to illustrate the difference, from here on out I'm mostly filling in damage nodes.

Clicky.

Btw, trade chat is split up so if you have issues finding stuff try logging every now and then to move chat, at least that's how I think it works.

World of Warcraft(post-WOTLK), League of Legends, D3 and Facebook games are great examples. The decisions are made after serious analysis in these companies and I am pretty sure they saw the actual money comes from big majority which is casuals. However, that doesn't mean hardcore-player oriented games are not profitable.

That's an assumption and not hard evidence, there is a huge difference between the two.

[Enkidulgaa]

World of Warcraft(post-WOTLK), League of Legends, D3 and Facebook games are great examples. The decisions are made after serious analysis in these companies and I am pretty sure they saw the actual money comes from big majority which is casuals. However, that doesn't mean hardcore-player oriented games are not profitable.

You're just assuming stuff
For all we know PoE could have made 10 000% profit from its original invesment while WoW barely manages not to lose Actiblizzard money.
On the other hand PoE could ruin the company and create a huge debt while WoW prints billions of dollar every month
Nobody knows

[Lochton]

Tried it, liked quite alot of it, but the feel and atmosphere of the game was a bit too Diablo. Enjoy the setup of your specc, but has to feel different for me to want to keep playing it.

[Kuntantee]

That's an assumption and not hard evidence, there is a huge difference between the two.

So you whole argument based on simple players(like me) can not find company records, thus, can not produce numerical evidence about the claim and making you right? I won't be providing you numerical data but some concepts are indisputable.
-Companies always target as large audience group as possible(with exceptions)
-The number of casual player is way way more larger than number of hardcore players
*Again, I can't provide numerical data but considering required time commitment for being hardcore player, this should be very clear that not much people can play that much
-If you add these information with large companies targeting casual audience and consider the hardcore-only games in the market, you can safely say that targeting casual audience is more profitable.

What I write is not hard-evidence but it's much more than an assumption.

[Edge-]

-Companies always target as large audience group as possible(with exceptions)

Actually, false (except for your "with exceptions part"). For example; until recently, From Software (the Dark Souls guys) only targeted their core audience. When was the last time you saw an Armored Core game made for mass market?

There are a ton of smaller developers that make games for specific audiences rather than for the biggest possible audience, specifically with enthusiast developers like GGG.

Hell, the guy in charge at GGG flat out stated during the GameSpot livestream that they're making the game for fans of the genre and don't want to make it more accessible for "broader appeal".

-The number of casual player is way way more larger than number of hardcore players
*Again, I can't provide numerical data but considering required time commitment for being hardcore player, this should be very clear that not much people can play that much

In the short run, yes. In the longer run though, your players who will remain with a game like this for a year+ are going to be your core/hardcore audience. The casual players will find another game to play, or will turn into the core/hardcore audience.

-If you add these information with large companies targeting casual audience and consider the hardcore-only games in the market, you can safely say that targeting casual audience is more profitable.

You're functioning under the understanding that the only point of making a game is to make a profit. For bigger publicly traded companies, that's much closer to the truth (legal obligation to shareholders to make a profit and all). But for small enthusiast developers like GGG, this isn't necessarily the case. They absolutely do want to ensure profitability so that they can keep making/supporting their games, but GGG has been pretty clear that they have zero interest in making PoE appeal to the broader market.

What I write is not hard-evidence but it's much more than an assumption.

An assumption based off of false premises which I have laid out above.

[Redblade]

So you whole argument based on simple players(like me) can not find company records, thus, can not produce numerical evidence about the claim and making you right? I won't be providing you numerical data but some concepts are indisputable.
-Companies always target as large audience group as possible(with exceptions)
-The number of casual player is way way more larger than number of hardcore players
*Again, I can't provide numerical data but considering required time commitment for being hardcore player, this should be very clear that not much people can play that much
-If you add these information with large companies targeting casual audience and consider the hardcore-only games in the market, you can safely say that targeting casual audience is more profitable.

What I write is not hard-evidence but it's much more than an assumption.

No, it's still only an assumption As I said previously you would have to take a wide variety of factors in to account to provide hard evidence, turnover rate being one of the major once.

Sure your casual crowd might be paying more than the hardcore here and now but how does those numbers look after 1 year, 2 years and so on. You are making assumptions without looking at the whole picture.

[Resentful]

I look like a F'ed version of Clinkz from Dota



Lol'd

[Kuntantee]

Actually, false (except for your "with exceptions part"). For example; until recently, From Software (the Dark Souls guys) only targeted their core audience. When was the last time you saw an Armored Core game made for mass market?

Since we are talking about "profitability potential" of casual vs hardcore it's good to consider practices of companies dominating the video game market. Also, that statement applies to any kind of company. The more audience you target, the more money you can make. So statement is correct. Your examples are the ones that I claimed as exceptions.

In the short run, yes. In the longer run though, your players who will remain with a game like this for a year+ are going to be your core/hardcore audience. The casual players will find another game to play, or will turn into the core/hardcore audience.

Wrong. Casual != GOTTA CHANGE A GAME EVERY 3 MONTHS. It's all about time spent per day. I played WoW casually. Somedays I didn't even log but until MoP I canceled my subscription only one or two times with 1 month break at max.

You're functioning under the understanding that the only point of making a game is to make a profit. For bigger publicly traded companies, that's much closer to the truth (legal obligation to shareholders to make a profit and all). But for small enthusiast developers like GGG, this isn't necessarily the case. They absolutely do want to ensure profitability so that they can keep making/supporting their games, but GGG has been pretty clear that they have zero interest in making PoE appeal to the broader market.

I am not sure how did you understand my post but, again, I was discussing the profitability which lead me to the examples of big companies. I am a amateur game developer and I support free software. My mind never functions with the way you described. I was merely stating the factors that one should consider when talking about how profitable a crowd is

---------- Post added 2013-02-08 at 11:12 PM ----------

Sure your casual crowd might be paying more than the hardcore here and now but how does those numbers look after 1 year, 2 years and so on. You are making assumptions without looking at the whole picture.

You are assuming casual do not spend money over game or just leave the game after two months which is not the case. Some players leave, some players do not. Also casuals are not "my" crowd.

[Slaughty8]

World of Warcraft(post-WOTLK), League of Legends, D3 and Facebook games are great examples. The decisions are made after serious analysis in these companies and I am pretty sure they saw the actual money comes from big majority which is casuals. However, that doesn't mean hardcore-player oriented games are not profitable.

This is half-truth. The second half is: hardcore players are inspiring casuals to play the game. Without hardcore players, casuals have noone to compare and chase.

[Redblade]

You are assuming casual do not spend money over game or just leave the game after two months which is not the case. Some players leave, some players do not. Also casuals are not "my" crowd.

It's your casual crowd, as in the casual crowd you are using in your argument. Not that you are specifically a part of said crowd.

And I'm not assuming anything, I'm telling you that there are a wide array of factor to take in to account, and presented some alternative possibilities.

[Whitepepper]

This is half-truth. The second half is: hardcore players are inspiring casuals to play the game. Without hardcore players, casuals have noone to compare and chase.

Almost by default I question whether the majority casual players would care about or even know the name of e-famous hardcore players. Why do you assume a casual player would compare and chase anyone other than their own friends playing the game?

[Enkidulgaa]

I look like a F'ed version of Clinkz from Dota

http://i.imgur.com/QfkerQf.png

Lol'd

Damn, now I want to make an actual clinkz character
What armor looks like a skeleton? And how do I make burning arrow viable lol

[Redblade]

Almost by default I question whether the majority casual players would care about or even know the name of e-famous hardcore players. Why do you assume a casual player would compare and chase anyone other than their own friends playing the game?

Same reason people know who famous athletes are, or rich people, or celebrities in general. As to why, why do people get up in the morning to work 8-10 hours a day, it sure as hell isn't because the majority enjoy it that's for sure, the possibility of becoming the "other" guy, as simple as that.

[Djuntas]

This is half-truth. The second half is: hardcore players are inspiring casuals to play the game. Without hardcore players, casuals have noone to compare and chase.

I agree, these are the people that can be the back-bone to the community off games. I didn't even think much about POE until Krippiran gave it a try so.

Also casual gaming sure tends to be a good business-model. More people will buy games, and games dosen't haft to last for to long. I shiver just thinking about console games where you pay 60$ dollars, and it only last 40-50 hours. I had a game that lasted that long bought off stream recently (Sleeping Dogs), sure it was good, but I would have fucking hated it, if I was paying anything more than like 20$.

Its good if games have time-sinks and can last long Personally any game that last under 200 hours for me is pretty average. But thats just me...

[Shinzai]

I've been stuck with the game 'Checking Resources' for 30 minutes or so now, anyone know a fix for this, or is it literally just a case of waiting it out?

[Redblade]

No idea, try the support forum and see if anyone else has the issue, the game is up and working is all I can say.