Bioware is asking for feedback about Advanced Classes

[Arlee]

Originally Posted by SWTOR

Hi everyone – we’re looking for some specific feedback from you about Advanced Classes and their specs. We encourage you to take the time to respond to these threads for each AC and spec you play! Please make sure to follow the guidelines in the thread; we're looking for two specific answers that do not exceed 3 sentences. Below, you'll find the links to each thread:

Guardian
Sentinel
Juggernaut
Marauder
Commando
Vanguard
Mercenary
Powertech
Sage
Shadow
Sorcerer
Assassin
Scoundrel
Gunslinger
Operative
Sniper

These are not discussion threads, so please post your own feedback, but avoid commenting on others'. Of course, these aren't the only threads we’re looking at for your class feedback (we read the forums and gather feedback from all of them), but just some requests for specific insights. Thanks for letting us know your thoughts!

(Source)

[Dakia]

Awesome.

I'm going to have to work together something about Commandos. I know that the watch and respond to threads, but I'm glad that their asking for feedback on how the players feel in an official thread.

[Profyrion]

Hmm, interesting.

[Arlee]

For all the threads they just want people to answer two questions:

1. How do you think your (Insert class name) spec is perceived by other classes?
2. How do you perceive your own spec?

That sort of limits things... but there are quite a lot of things you can say to each of those questions. Though I sort of feel like responses will be more PvP oriented than PvE.

[Lathais]

Looking through the answers to the Assassin thread, and wow, are Assassin tanks really that bad now?

[philefluxx]

That sort of limits things... but there are quite a lot of things you can say to each of those questions. Though I sort of feel like responses will be more PvP oriented than PvE.

This will probably be the case for sometime, at least until more tools are available to gauge class performance in PvE. Even with the combat logging its tough to get a idea of how others are doing compared to you. I see the combat logging as a way to gauge changes in your performance only.

[Arlee]

Looking through the answers to the Assassin thread, and wow, are Assassin tanks really that bad now?

I was wondering about that too... it's just confusing to me though because like I have said elsewhere one of our main tanks is a shadow and he is neigh indestructible.

---------- Post added 2012-07-16 at 03:17 PM ----------

This will probably be the case for sometime, at least until more tools are available to gauge class performance in PvE. Even with the combat logging its tough to get a idea of how others are doing compared to you. I see the combat logging as a way to gauge changes in your performance only.

Well there are some tools out there, but I think it is a very very small minority of people who make use of them. So you are probably correct about that.

[Kelimbror]

Don't worry, this is just training for their new summer interns on wading through pages of poop to find the nugget of real information. No way they could design a better test...so let your customers do it for you!

[quras]

Looking through the answers to the Assassin thread, and wow, are Assassin tanks really that bad now?

There not destroyed but they did take a rather massive hit from the nerf bat this last patch.

They can still tank any of the HM content but it's a much harder up hill battle than it was before the nerf.

[Lathais]

I was wondering about that too... it's just confusing to me though because like I have said elsewhere one of our main tanks is a shadow and he is neigh indestructible.

I logged in last week, since the free week thing was up and I ran a Story Mode KP. I felt I held aggro a lot better than a few months ago and I didn't really seem to take much damage at all. It really didn't feel all that bad, but was only Story Mode and I am near full Rakata geared. Was wondering what it would be like if I tried to get back into the game and join a guild doing Hard and Nightmare modes. Will I have to go DPS or just re-roll. Neither option entices me, I want to be an Assassin Tank, so hopefully they "fix" it if it really is broken.

[Dakia]

Though I sort of feel like responses will be more PvP oriented than PvE.

I think that will likely be the case as well. The classes in PvE content, while not perfect, aren't severely gimped in regards to any single class. There are a lot of individual classes that have severe issues in PvP though.

[Lathais]

There not destroyed but they did take a rather massive hit from the nerf bat this last patch.

They can still tank any of the HM content but it's a much harder up hill battle than it was before the nerf.

That's good to hear, what about NiM though? Hopefully they re-balance them a bit and HM won't be so bad. I am still seriously considering coming back, but if my class has been nerfed that bad, or even if it's just the perception that they have, then there is little point in coming back as I do not want to level another toon. I do have a Jedi Guardian that is in her 30's though, so maybe it wouldn't be so bad to switch sides and level her.

[quras]

That's good to hear, what about NiM though? Hopefully they re-balance them a bit and HM won't be so bad. I am still seriously considering coming back, but if my class has been nerfed that bad, or even if it's just the perception that they have, then there is little point in coming back as I do not want to level another toon. I do have a Jedi Guardian that is in her 30's though, so maybe it wouldn't be so bad to switch sides and level her.

To be honest it was a fairly easy adjustment to the nerf. We lost some armor and some self healing mainly. It was a pretty heavy handed nerf but it in no way broke the class. So far it has not stopped myself from clearing HM EV or KP and not stopped our main shadow tank in clearing HM EC.

Other peoples perspective is we got hit hard and we did but with a little effort no one will ever know when you play it right.

[Leonard McCoy]

I love my sentinel. As I told them in my post I'm not one who usually plays melee classes but Sentinel really does it for me for some reason.

1. I'm not sure how others perceive us. The very broad feeling I get is that we're apparently OP in pvp but to squishy in PVE.
2. I love my sentinel but theirs a few things that bug me. For one as I mentioned in the above it feels that in many pve encounters I'm constantly looking for the next dmg reduction cooldown. Seriously, we're soft in pve gear. Other than that, I've noticed some combat issues still persist with my sent. Animations will sometimes just not go off and gcds will trigger with no abilties. It's not a frequent occurance but after prolonged periods of play (3+ hours) it will happen. Generally I find the spec has an abundance of abilities, in some cases it feels like I never stop doing anything. That's a really good feeling for the most part but at other times it almost feels button mashy. I'm constantly rolling from one thing to the next, even if it's just the strike ability. I would like to see some of the bloat reduced. On that note I would also say that the merciless slash buff is a bit to unforgiving IMO. Theirs a combination of reasons for it but the core of the problem is that it's way to easy for it to fall off. It's dependant on to many other factors to maintain. Other than that I love my sentinel. Force leap is the best thing ever and watching the numbers just tick off from mobs and other peeeps is great. Most fun I've had playing any sort of melee character in these games for years.

[jayinjersey]

I concur about the assassins nerf that it wasn't so bad...

They got a HUGE nerf from their perspective...but it was akin to choping Andre the Giant off at the knees

They are very on par with the others now and not light years ahead. (and in PvP you can actually KILL them...which is new)

[WarpedAcorn]

I concur about the assassins nerf that it wasn't so bad...

They got a HUGE nerf from their perspective...but it was akin to choping Andre the Giant off at the knees

They are very on par with the others now and not light years ahead. (and in PvP you can actually KILL them...which is new)

PvP is a different monster altogether. But in PvE I hear that Assassin/Shadow Tanks are still viable, but not preferable.

[Forsedar]

Luckily Bioware has done a great job with Merc PvE balancing... however PvP is a different story.

[noahjam326]

I was laughing to myself constantly reading between the Juggernaut and Assassin threads. Juggernauts claim to be the worst now and Assassins "took der jobs." Meanwhile Assassins are complaining that they are the worst tank.

[RoninaThorstone]

Every class needs tuning. And always will. Just how MMOs work.

That said, I had a fair amount to say on these threads.

To sum up:
1: Concealment feels clunky. The 12 second cooldown on backstab is painfully long. I would have it deal less damage for less energy if I could get a more active rotation going in pvp. The sustained is crap. Lethality is vastly superior and even that lags behind other classes in PVE. Even if I had duel spec I would have 2 healing specs on my operative.
2: My assassin is deception. This spec works great when picking off medium / light armored targets in the back while their front line is distracted. However, if the team consists mainly of heavy armored targets... You end up in a bad place. The enemy teams composition almost decides your performance which makes you feel helpless. Many deception assassins ask for survivability buffs but that's not what we need. We need to deal more force damage like madness.
3: My combat sentinel either globals or dents people depending on if I complete my master strike combo. That's less than ideal on both accounts. I have killed geared operative healers without them being able to move the entire time... That shouldn't happen. Also, I can't get off my combo against a smart sniper or sorc. I feel like the insta kill vs do nothing mechanic forces me to spec watchmen for more consistency.
4: My tank vanguard is amazing in pve. Just... Amazing. In pvp I run into a rocks paper scissors thing. Which seems to be a growing trend. If the target deals mixed damage or pure force/tech all my defensive stats are nullified. That is a pain in the ass. They are the majority of my secondary stat and they shouldn't completely lock down some of the weapon damage based specs and do nothing against the tech/force damage specs.
5: Juggernaut tank. I've capped the huttball in under 10 seconds. That is all.
6: Sage healer hybrid 25:14: 2 dominates melee with a 21 second slow and a 5 second knock back snare on a 20 second cool down, 3 second sprint on bubble, force speed, force slow, telekinesis, wyntech freeze grenade... I mean. I can even cleanse the force based slows. So long as a weapon damage ranged isn't able to plow me its just... difficult to die. The reason I say weapon damage ranged is because I do have low armor and a good marksmen sniper can deal a significant amount of damage with the right combo. Point is, this is the swiss army knife of healers in terms of control. Very strong. Almost too strong.

[Arlee]

I was laughing to myself constantly reading between the Juggernaut and Assassin threads. Juggernauts claim to be the worst now and Assassins "took der jobs." Meanwhile Assassins are complaining that they are the worst tank.

Which honestly... probably means that both classes are just about right. The old "if everyone is a little bit upset with you then you have done a good job" mentality.