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  1. #201
    Mechagnome
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    Quote Originally Posted by matiasve View Post
    Thank you

    And I'm sure the one-time development cost and technological research would be nothing compared to the annual tax-money that is getting pumped
    into prisons.

    Why should they be getting degrees and free healthcare in prison anyways?
    Make them work for the state, and earn their place in society through hard labour, depending on the crime off course.
    I see where you're coming from, and I think it's better to have criminals (idd depending on the crime) do service instead of being stashed away in a costly prison. Mind you, though, that if they're getting degrees in prison, they will eventually also be able to earn their place in society, in a much more natural way.

  2. #202
    It depends on which country and prison system you're talking about. Here in America, the prison system is set up to be a place to put the people we don't want in society, and NOT a system that is designed to rehabilitate these people. They provide all these luxuries to prisoners as a means to keep them happy enough to avoid rioting (which happens anyway), and most of the people in our prison system are not violent offenders, but people with drug related offenses.

    So because the prison system is part of the private sector in here, it's become a business with people lobbying for increased criminalization as a money making business for prisons.

  3. #203
    If it were up to me, the first time someone committed a crime, it would be (depending on the crime) however much time in jail or prison, and a fine. If that person later commits the same crime (so any repeat offender of anything) then they would be executed. If the penalty for crime was greater, people would be less likely to do it. The only problem I really see with my idea is with rape. Too often these days is that getting falsely accused, and if the people had sex, there is no way to really prove whether it was or was not forced. As an anti feminist, I would hate a system where if a guy gets unlucky and dates two bitches who accuse him of rape after they break up, he gets executed.

  4. #204
    The Lightbringer Kerath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by caractacus View Post
    I am not sure if I agree with you. I kind of agree with what Will Self is saying in that vid about what it means to be evil and can a 10 year old boy really be super evil? When I was about 4 years old at Nursery I had an argument with another kid there and I picked up a metal toy car and smacked him around the head with it. I got an almighty telling off for it that I will never forget. Luckily It never caused any damage but in all reality it could have killed him. But if it had killed him should I have been locked in a mental institute for the rest of my life or would it have been just a horrible accident.
    Whole different kettle of fish. With the Bulger case, the two 10 year old boys abducted a toddler, abused and tortured him then weighed him down with rubble and left him on train tracks to be cut in half by a train. That's not a horrible, terrible accident because they didn't understand the consequences of a lashing out momentarily. That was absolutely cold-blooded murder.
    What they did was evil. Whether the two boys themselves are evil is something I would debate... I cannot fathom why two 10 year old boys would do something like that. I was born in the same year - I didn't understand it then and I don't understand it now.

    Anyway, on topic. I believe the main focus should be on rehabilitation.
    Society has tried various methods of deterrence and punitive measures over the centuries - methods of execution have included crucifixion, hanging, beheading, impaling on spikes, burning at the stake, boiling alive, flaying and god knows what else.
    Thieves would have their hands cut off (or hanged), liars would have their lips cut off, people were mutilated in the name of the law for centuries.
    It didn't seem to work out too well.

    Prisons should provide basic amenities but should not provide luxuries, and efforts should be made towards education and rehabilitation.
    I accept that sometimes rehabilitation is not possible - which would leave little other option than indefinite incarceration.
    Avatar and signature made by ELYPOP

  5. #205
    Merely a Setback JohnBrown1917's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tinykong View Post
    So, you're saying people would be afraid of prison then? If so, then it worked.
    No, it wouldn't. Those prisons would not be used. thus they would be a waste of money.

    ---------- Post added 2012-07-24 at 01:56 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Itisamuh View Post
    If it were up to me, the first time someone committed a crime, it would be (depending on the crime) however much time in jail or prison, and a fine. If that person later commits the same crime (so any repeat offender of anything) then they would be executed. If the penalty for crime was greater, people would be less likely to do it. The only problem I really see with my idea is with rape. Too often these days is that getting falsely accused, and if the people had sex, there is no way to really prove whether it was or was not forced. As an anti feminist, I would hate a system where if a guy gets unlucky and dates two bitches who accuse him of rape after they break up, he gets executed.
    So steal a item worth 25$, gets arrested, and then does it again, gets arrested and then executed?

    Horrible system.

  6. #206
    The Undying Themius's Avatar
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    The blatant disregard for life is ridiculous here.

    "if someone is in prison for 40-50 years why not just execute them" seriously? There have been people who have ended up in prison for a long time for bs.

    In Florida a woman was jailed for 20 years mandatory because she fired a warning shot in the house as her husband/bf was abusing her. 20 YEARS! MANDATORY MINIMUM.

  7. #207
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    Prisons in Finland are like hotels. You get better food than our students in schools, you can even have PS3, tv, computer and other stuff in your cell. I believe its the same in every nordic country.

  8. #208
    Quote Originally Posted by rederoin View Post
    No, it wouldn't. Those prisons would not be used. thus they would be a waste of money.
    So, if they aren't being used, why would people not be confessing because of them? Your logic doesn't make any sense.

  9. #209
    Merely a Setback JohnBrown1917's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tinykong View Post
    So, if they aren't being used, why would people not be confessing because of them? Your logic doesn't make any sense.
    Because they know they would be used if they confessed. And i'm not even going over the fact that even confessing doesen't proof that they did it with 100% accuracy
    Your logic is the one that doesen't make any sense.

    And the fact that you're okay with people enduring torture, a fate worse than death, says a lot about your character.
    Last edited by JohnBrown1917; 2012-07-24 at 12:53 PM.

  10. #210
    I'd say make it like so!

    For people on death row give them a deathrace/running man scheme. Gives them a chance to get them off death row (not out of prison bwahahah)

    For the remaining prisoners not on death row they work on mining the materials from the mines under the moon base we use as the prison! Oh yes the moon base.

    This prison mind you is for the worst scum on earth. The normal prisoners who have only done minor offences will be given rehabilitation programs and all the help they need while serving time to get them back into society.

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by khalltusk View Post
    I'd say make it like so!

    For people on death row give them a deathrace/running man scheme. Gives them a chance to get them off death row (not out of prison bwahahah)

    For the remaining prisoners not on death row they work on mining the materials from the mines under the moon base we use as the prison! Oh yes the moon base.

    This prison mind you is for the worst scum on earth. The normal prisoners who have only done minor offences will be given rehabilitation programs and all the help they need while serving time to get them back into society.

    You realize that in the running man the main character was innocent right..? And that the whole system was corrupt?

    Not exactly the best idea...

    (The same goes for death race)

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by rederoin View Post
    Because they know they would be used if they confessed. And i'm not even going over the fact that even confessing doesen't proof that they did it with 100% accuracy
    Your logic is the one that doesen't make any sense.

    And the fact that you're okay with people enduring torture, a fate worse than death, says a lot about your character.
    Someone confesses to a crime, and that doesn't prove they did it? What burden of proof do you need to find someone guilty, seeing the actual crime yourself? Glad you're not in charge of the justice system.

    Some people deserve a fate worse than death.

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Purlina View Post
    You realize that in the running man the main character was innocent right..? And that the whole system was corrupt?

    Not exactly the best idea...

    (The same goes for death race)
    and who here said it has to be an uncorrupted system? I have a MOON base in this scenario ofc im a power mad dictator ruling over the lives of my prisoners.

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by Tinykong View Post
    Someone confesses to a crime, and that doesn't prove they did it? What burden of proof do you need to find someone guilty, seeing the actual crime yourself? Glad you're not in charge of the justice system.

    Some people deserve a fate worse than death.
    There could be a multitude of reasons why someone could confess to a crime they didn't commit

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by caractacus View Post
    There could be a multitude of reasons why someone could confess to a crime they didn't commit
    And how many of those reasons are legal? None of them.

  16. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by Tinykong View Post
    Someone confesses to a crime, and that doesn't prove they did it? What burden of proof do you need to find someone guilty, seeing the actual crime yourself? Glad you're not in charge of the justice system.

    Some people deserve a fate worse than death.
    because noone in the history of the world have ever confessed to a crime they didnt do...
    They do it for many reasons... To protect others, for fame, or because they are coerced.

    ---------- Post added 2012-07-24 at 03:59 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Tinykong View Post
    And how many of those reasons are legal? None of them.
    coercion would be legal on the confessors part.

  17. #217
    Quote Originally Posted by Tinykong View Post
    And how many of those reasons are legal? None of them.
    Such as blackmail, coercion, and torture? Yes those are illegal.

  18. #218
    This is a very interesting thread. As a sociology major I spent a lot of time reading and learning and prisons. I do not think the current system is working but I also do not know what would work better.


    I do not believe that locking someone up for years helps our society and that everyone who does something bad is a horrible person. Sometimes good people do bad things, one time and will never do something bad again. Also, I believe that not all crimes are equal. A 20 year old man having sex with his 16 year old girlfriend should not make him a sex offender for the rest of his life, if the sex was consensual.

    I do believe that some prisoners should be allowed to attend school or be required to work during their time. Not necessarily at a real job but doing something like sorting trash from recycling and that everyone should receive counseling and rehabilitation if they do not have a life sentence without parole.

    The trouble with our current system is someone does something, say selling drugs or stealing from a store because that is how they make their money, they go to jail/prison for however many years and during that time they sit in a cell. When they are released they have no skills or abilities to go out and become a productive member of society. They do not understand technology updates, have no place to live and no way to resume life. A schooling/education/rebahb program would help to equip someone with tools to be able to go out and do the right then. Obviously, this will not work for every person, some people will just commit crime and crime.

  19. #219
    The argument for how northern European prisons work so great has one issue.

    They work great because of the massive social welfare in those countries for when prisoners get out.
    The most successful tyranny is not the one that uses force to assure uniformity but the one that removes the awareness of other possibilities.

  20. #220
    The Insane Daelak's Avatar
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    Prisons should be places of mental rehabilitation. There is no point in capital murder. It doesn't change anything and it takes forever in the appeals process. Drugs offenses like marijuana possession should be reduced and released from prison. Pedophiles and other mentally ill should be transferred to a mental care health facility where they will go through treatment and sequestration.
    Quote Originally Posted by zenkai View Post
    There is a problem, but I know just banning guns will fix the problem.

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