[MoP] Protection Paladin Guide

[Deleted]

Here are the stat weights bases on Theck's 5.2: http://forums.askmrrobot.com/index.php?topic=5359.0
I doubt they have changed much. Control/Haste.

Hit 1.1
Expertise 1.09
Haste 1
Strength 0.6

I cap hit and expertise, so tend to value them at the next highest stat assuming I can reforge (in this case as 1, the value of haste). I am struggling with hit though (I wear Ji-Kun's feather) - it has a 0 weight for me at the margins, as I've reforged away from it as much as I can.

[Gorfion]

Does anyone know exactly what "standing in fire" type of things do not give vengeance? For example, I know that of course boss melees and special attacks still give vengeance, but what about pulsing raid damage, or ground effects you are supposed to soak (malkorok for example)?

Also completely agreed that the 1/n aoe vengeance nerf was quite massive, it's like tanking 2 adds regardless of how many you are actually tanking other than the increased GC procs. I can't hold aoe threat against my druid co-tank, except on my main target and sometimes two others targets my avenger's shield is hitting.

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Does anyone know exactly what "standing in fire" type of things do not give vengeance? For example, I know that of course boss melees and special attacks still give vengeance, but what about pulsing raid damage, or ground effects you are supposed to soak (malkorok for example)?

Also completely agreed that the 1/n aoe vengeance nerf was quite massive, it's like tanking 2 adds regardless of how many you are actually tanking other than the increased GC procs. I can't hold aoe threat against my druid co-tank, except on my main target and sometimes two others targets my avenger's shield is hitting.

Right now, it is safe to assume none of them do.

[Deleted]

Hi Paladins!

Recruited a Paladin for our guild a few weeks ago (4-6 weeks). We equipped him inside ToT and he did his job so far very nice. He learned fast & is responsible. But in comparison with other paladins I met last tier when we went Tot with a random tank, he does less dps, soaks more damage & heals less( yeah I know battle healer was nerfed in 5.4). I know if we/I will found out what he can improve, he is always open too any kind of feedback regarding improvements.
I post you some logs & his armory link. I would be happy if someone of you had some minutes time to look over his gearing strategy & logs.

armory: eu.battle.net/wow/de/character/azshara/jammsy/
SoO log: worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-hcxupghivz77ts6l/

[pld]

The armory page is all in German(?) and I'm not sure if I can (or how to) swap it to English, haha. From what I can tell, he seems to have a good understanding on how to gear and gem. His talents seem to be in order and his glyph choices aren't bad (I would probably swap out Avenging Wrath for something else).

Taking a look at the WoL, his ShoR and EF uptime seemed a bit low, which might be why he's taking more damage. I suspect he's not pressing his buttons fast enough because his Holy Power generation is lower than where it should be. To give an example, on Sha of Pride, he generated the same amount of Holy Power as me, but our kill took 1 minute less. A part of that is definitely linked to the fact that I have more haste than he does, but it's something he can strive to improve. Hitting more spells would also bump up his DPS, although it seems quite low for someone at his IL.

[Nillo]

swap the /de/ with /en/

[Gorfion]

Was checking slootbag's armory for the progression race and happened to notice he had logged out in the int caster cloak. Does it deal significantly more damage with vengeance perhaps, or is it a random troll? I've seen armory trolls from lots of top raiders but haven't seen him do so before. Just wondering if anyone had ideas.

[Deleted]

The armory page is all in German(?) and I'm not sure if I can (or how to) swap it to English, haha. From what I can tell, he seems to have a good understanding on how to gear and gem. His talents seem to be in order and his glyph choices aren't bad (I would probably swap out Avenging Wrath for something else).

Taking a look at the WoL, his ShoR and EF uptime seemed a bit low, which might be why he's taking more damage. I suspect he's not pressing his buttons fast enough because his Holy Power generation is lower than where it should be. To give an example, on Sha of Pride, he generated the same amount of Holy Power as me, but our kill took 1 minute less. A part of that is definitely linked to the fact that I have more haste than he does, but it's something he can strive to improve. Hitting more spells would also bump up his DPS, although it seems quite low for someone at his IL.

thank you so far! I can't imagine he use his ShoR to less. As I tanked with my Paladin it was 90% on cooldown used So it seems to be more a playstyle than gear related. Any ideas how we can train him? Should he maybe try to get gold on proving grounds ? (it is difficult for paladin tanks ? needed with my dk about 7-8 tries for gold)

greetings

[Deleted]

Any ideas how we can train him? Should he maybe try to get gold on proving grounds ?

Hitting buttons faster is probably mostly just a matter of practicing the rotation on a dummy - perhaps analysing recount. It's just like trying to maximise your dps as a dpser. Using keybinds rather than clicking would help, if that's an issue.

Pressing buttons faster would help in the proving grounds, but that's not really what the tank proving grounds trains or tests (imo, the proving grounds is more about how to handle adds and their special abilities). Gold seemed straightforward as a tankadin, but I could see that endless would be challenging (see Firefly's thread).

[Nobleshield]

So quick question now that we've seen how EF works in practice: Without the T16 4pc should we try to keep 100% uptime on EF? If so, does it take precedence over SotR (barring requiring SotR for mitigation on mechanics)? Thus far I've only been using EF if I have 4+ stacks of Bastion and a Divine Purpose proc (barring normal "oh shit save meh!" usage) but this seems to make me squishier than before. Should I just use EF when I don't have it on and 4+ stacks of BoG? It seems like sitting on 5 BoG stacks is kind of a waste overall.

[gerus]

So quick question now that we've seen how EF works in practice: Without the T16 4pc should we try to keep 100% uptime on EF? If so, does it take precedence over SotR (barring requiring SotR for mitigation on mechanics)? Thus far I've only been using EF if I have 4+ stacks of Bastion and a Divine Purpose proc (barring normal "oh shit save meh!" usage) but this seems to make me squishier than before. Should I just use EF when I don't have it on and 4+ stacks of BoG? It seems like sitting on 5 BoG stacks is kind of a waste overall.

I've just been using it when I'm at 5 BoG, it isn't up, and I've got 3 HP. I try and time it following a boss swing too. I try and avoid overwriting as much as possible.

I ran EF this week as the previous week it seemed my UI was bleeding and broken and pushing a slightly different healing pattern onto the healers wasn't a welcome addition. Anecdotally it appears to be crazy strong. The only exception to this was when I went into CM's. The main time you are in danger in CM's is usually when you have 0 stacks of BoG. I probably will keep SS for CM's.

[Deleted]

Whenever I get 5 BoG stacks I sit on them until the heal will benefit me, i.e., even if I do not have EF up, I wait for my hp to drop to 50%~ before using EF. It is way more effective that way.

[Deleted]

Whenever I get 5 BoG stacks I sit on them until the heal will benefit me, i.e., even if I do not have EF up, I wait for my hp to drop to 50%~ before using EF. It is way more effective that way.

Pretty much the way I use it too.
Felt "guilty" at first compared to our 95++ uptime on sacred shield, but hell, numbers should not prevent smart play and I seem to find people who agree with that in this thread

[trystero]

Yup, padding stats isn't right as a DPS and it's not right as a tank. We're not in the era of SS where having under a "low" figure is inexcusable; as we all know SS held no opportunity cost outside of a GCD and required minimal maintenance and preparation. EF's a different animal, and it will will also affect (at least for now) SotR uptime.

I'll say it's a lot easier on me to pass the pull to my co-tank. That affords me plenty of time to generate HP and BoG stacks.

[Nobleshield]

Whenever I get 5 BoG stacks I sit on them until the heal will benefit me, i.e., even if I do not have EF up, I wait for my hp to drop to 50%~ before using EF. It is way more effective that way.

Makes sense. Thanks as always FF.

[MerinPally]

Hey guys - the guide needs some updating. I shall get to this and fix it as soon as I possibly can. I moved into my student house on the 7th and the idiot girl who said "Hey guys don't worry, I'll sort our internet package" decided to delay it til kingdom fucking come and we aren't getting it installed until Tuesday 24th Sept and even then it'll probably be absolute wank for the first few days. To make it worse, I have an exam on the 4th October which I'm going to be super late to the party revising for...

Apparently, with the 12 month contract, it made so much more sense to wait until the end of September even though we get kicked out of this house in June right? Not like it was worth paying for it (which we're going to lose 3 months of ANYWAY) when people aren't going to be here. So she decided that it's best we don't have the internet before our studies begin rather than after they finish. Logic, fuck me right?

Will get around to it as soon as possible.

[Deleted]

You kinda deserve it for letting a girl sort out your internet.....

that being said. wtb 4p so I can keep EF up 100% with 5 stack bog.

[Kethmil]

@Space: I asked in fix my tanking thread about it. How would that 4pc work when healing others on 3+ BoG? Tier wouldnt trigger? Consumes your BoG even if it wasnt a self heal?

[Deleted]

@Space: I asked in fix my tanking thread about it. How would that 4pc work when healing others on 3+ BoG? Tier wouldnt trigger? Consumes your BoG even if it wasnt a self heal?

Don't know actually. I've stopped using WoG for that outside of really really oh-shit moments and usually I have a LoH for that. Last time I really used WoG to heal others was last expansion before sotr was AM.

And sadly I have no tier pieces so probably wouldn't be able to find out for a while.

[Kethmil]

Finally found somthing about the 4pc topic. A guy commented on ptr forums about it. Thread got deleted, but you can read the post in the page cached by google:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...&ct=clnk&gl=es

He says that in previous builds of ptr you actually could have those "infinite" WoG and EF, wich people abused through harsh words and healing raid, and asks to be specified on tier description that it just applies to self heals.

Also, seems that when you SotR your target and that makes you have 3 or more BoG stacks, you get a buf: Bastion of Power. When you WoG or EF you consume that buff.

Before that buff was always consumed, no matter who you healed or damaged via harsh words. So you could just SotR -> WoG -> Sotr -> WoG ... etc.

Now the buff is only consumed when cast on self.