Field of view

[Xuvial]

Resolution is irrelevant to FoV argument. There are only two factors that matter in calculating a proper FoV: Size of the monitor and distance from watcher's eyes to the monitor.

I wasn't referring to the resolution, I was referring to the aspect ratio. 1080p is 16:9, 1200p is 16:10, etc etc. Wider monitor = need higher FoV.

[Mif]

1080p is 16:9, 1200p is 16:10, etc etc. Wider monitor = need higher FoV.

/looks at 48:9 three monitor setup

[Lucky_]

I wasn't referring to the resolution, I was referring to the aspect ratio. 1080p is 16:9, 1200p is 16:10, etc etc. Wider monitor = need higher FoV.

Aspect ratio only impacts FoV in terms of changes to absolute monitor size. In other words your FoV needs to be adjusted for having more actual horisontal and less actual vertical viewing space.

But this should happen automatically in drivers/video rendering in game iirc and doesn't impact actual FoV slider. Or at least, it shouldn't if implemented properly.

Finally proper FoV does not need to be exact. The difference between FoV of the person at distance of the monitor and FoV implementation in game needs to be fairly significant to cause problems even in most sensitive individuals. Going 16:10<>16:9 is extremely unlikely to cause issues outside extreme cases such as near-zero view distance.

Also, triple monitor setups are additionally impacted by the viewing angle of side monitors, making finding proper FoV something of a hit and miss, and adjustable more by angling and repositioning monitors then software implementation beyond basic FoV.

[Nexrex]

Aspect ratio only impacts FoV in terms of changes to absolute monitor size. In other words your FoV needs to be adjusted for having more actual horisontal and less actual vertical viewing space.

But this should happen automatically in drivers/video rendering in game iirc and doesn't impact actual FoV slider. Or at least, it shouldn't if implemented properly.

Finally proper FoV does not need to be exact. The difference between FoV of the person at distance of the monitor and FoV implementation in game needs to be fairly significant to cause problems even in most sensitive individuals. Going 16:10<>16:9 is extremely unlikely to cause issues outside extreme cases such as near-zero view distance.

Also, triple monitor setups are additionally impacted by the viewing angle of side monitors, making finding proper FoV something of a hit and miss, and adjustable more by angling and repositioning monitors then software implementation beyond basic FoV.

So are saying that a FoV slider isnt needed or that it would be needed? Kind early here so maybe I'm just not up to date on cognitive abilities atm..

[DanBowie]

Im sure ill be happy with default view

[Nexrex]

Im sure ill be happy with default view

That's great for you. Really it is.
But that doesn't mean others have to suffer now does it?
If you are happy the way it is, then don't redo any settings. I simply want the option to change settings so it's at a level where I feel comfortable with it. That too much to ask?

[galaxiah]

I'm confused on what they could do for an FoV slider. Are you saying they input a slider that moves the camera vertically (like the horizontal one they have) to position your character closer to the bottom of your screen so it's not in the middle and I don't feel like i'm awkwardly always looking at the ground>? or this plus more? like affecting the sharpness of "non focused" directions you're looking in? if that makes sense...

I think i just confused myself

I might be having the same issue you're having, while I don't get sick I do feel something is "off" and feels like my character is placed wrong. The video's you posted helped me make the connection that it's the FoV, and hopefully it's available at launch.

[Lucky_]

So are saying that a FoV slider isnt needed or that it would be needed? Kind early here so maybe I'm just not up to date on cognitive abilities atm..

1. Typical "console" PoV: 60 degrees.

2. One of the smallest typical monitor PoVs: 90 degrees.

3. Difference from shifting aspect ratio from 16:10 to 16:9: approximately one degree.


Increase between 1. and 2. is 50% or greater. Increase between 1. and 3. is less then 2%. Increase between 2. and 3. is slightly over 1%. Some of these increases are meaningful and noticeable. Others are not. I'll let you draw the conclusions yourself.

[Nexrex]

I'm confused on what they could do for an FoV slider. Are you saying they input a slider that moves the camera vertically (like the horizontal one they have) to position your character closer to the bottom of your screen so it's not in the middle and I don't feel like i'm awkwardly always looking at the ground>? or this plus more? like affecting the sharpness of "non focused" directions you're looking in? if that makes sense...

I think i just confused myself

I might be having the same issue you're having, while I don't get sick I do feel something is "off" and feels like my character is placed wrong. The video's you posted helped me make the connection that it's the FoV, and hopefully it's available at launch.

What you are referring to here is in fact the placement of the camera. And yes I would love to see a slider like the one that moves the camera to left and right currently, but then up and down instead. That way you won't feel like you are seeing to much ground as you put it. It's something that would go along way for fixing the feeling of looking at things from the wrong angle so to speak. Like when you tilt back the camera to look at the horizon you end up under your character's waistline looking up. A more natural feel would be looking from the eye-height of your character.
It would also, while being a more comfortable level, have the added effect of catching more of this beautiful world they have created and not just transition from one type of ground clutter to another...

The FoV issue is however different if slightly related. A narrow fov makes it seem like you are forced to a sort of tunnel vision mode, cause you have a sense that there should be more peripheral vision, and you just don't get that. And for me that means my brain interprets the visuals as "off" or misleading, which in turn makes me physical sick if I keep on gaming.

So all though the camera position and the FoV are related, it's not the same thing. Hope that clears it up for you.

[Xuvial]

I'm confused on what they could do for an FoV slider. Are you saying they input a slider that moves the camera vertically (like the horizontal one they have) to position your character closer to the bottom of your screen so it's not in the middle and I don't feel like i'm awkwardly always looking at the ground>? or this plus more? like affecting the sharpness of "non focused" directions you're looking in? if that makes sense...

I think i just confused myself

I might be having the same issue you're having, while I don't get sick I do feel something is "off" and feels like my character is placed wrong. The video's you posted helped me make the connection that it's the FoV, and hopefully it's available at launch.

Err no it's not the character placement. It's the angle of view you have on the world, that angle is too narrow for PC monitors. An FoV slider would increase that angle.

Go back to those FoV videos to truly understand, or play a first person shooter which allows you to adjust the FoV (Far Cry series, Crysis series, Battlefield series all allow this).

For now, a simple comparision of Crysis PC FoV vs console FoV:



A lot of people say "well the guy simply moved back a few steps in the bottom screenie" but actually the guy hasn't moved at all, only a wider camera angle

To apply the same logic to an MMO, your character would still be standing in the same place and be the same size. Except having an FoV slider would allow you to "widen" the camera angle as displayed in the above screenshot of Crysis.

The reason you're feeling something is off (or make people straight-up sick) is because your peripheral vision is "blocked" because of the low FoV - essentially tunnel vision. Your brain and eyes are used to focusing everything in a 60-degree angle in front, but they're also used to having a 180-degree peripheral vision that is extremely good at sensing movement (even though you can't focus on it).

The tunnel-vision effect of low FoV's confuses your brain and can cause motion sickness - basically a disagreement between the eyes and the brain.
The brain concludes that a foreign substance must be in your body making you hallucinate, and tries to reject the foreign substance by telling your stomach muscles to go in reverse (i.e. throw up) and/or make you feel dizzy, or in minor cases just make you feel something is off.

Similarly when bobbing up and down in the ocean inside an enclosed boat, your ears sense movement but your eyes and brain see that everything around you is still - so your brain concludes that a foreign substance is making you hallucinate, etc etc until eventually *BLUERRRRGH*.
It's a pretty ancient (and annoying) mechanism that humans still have :P

[Nexrex]

Err no it's not the character placement. It's the angle of view you have on the world, that angle is too narrow for PC monitors. An FoV slider would increase that angle.

Go back to those FoV videos to truly understand, or play a first person shooter which allows you to adjust the FoV (Far Cry series, Crysis series, Battlefield series all allow this).

For now, a simple comparision of Crysis PC FoV vs console FoV:



A lot of people say "well the guy simply moved back a few steps in the bottom screenie" but actually the guy hasn't moved at all, only a wider camera angle

To apply the same logic to an MMO, your character would still be standing in the same place and be the same size. Except having an FoV slider would allow you to "widen" the camera angle as displayed in the above screenshot of Crysis.

The reason you're feeling something is off (or make people straight-up sick) is because your peripheral vision is "blocked" because of the low FoV - essentially tunnel vision. Your brain and eyes are used to focusing everything in a 60-degree angle in front, but they're also used to having a 180-degree peripheral vision that is extremely good at sensing movement (even though you can't focus on it).

The tunnel-vision effect of low FoV's confuses your brain and can cause motion sickness - basically a disagreement between the eyes and the brain.
The brain concludes that a foreign substance must be in your body making you hallucinate, and tries to reject the foreign substance by telling your stomach muscles to go in reverse (i.e. throw up) and/or make you feel dizzy, or in minor cases just make you feel something is off.

Similarly when bobbing up and down in the ocean inside an enclosed boat, your ears sense movement but your eyes and brain see that everything around you is still - so your brain concludes that a foreign substance is making you hallucinate, etc etc until eventually *BLUERRRRGH*.
It's a pretty ancient (and annoying) mechanism that humans still have :P

Basicly all of the above. I welcome all camera adjustments at this point. Especially a FoV slider.

[Nexrex]

Did anyone else manage to make a ticket regarding the fov issue during last stress test? I didnt have a chance to play much, all i did was log on so I could at least write one, so its brought to the attention of Arenanet. Do believe I saw a post somewhere (facebook maybe?) stating they were spesificly looking for input on technical issues. Atm on facebook it seems they are more busy riding bikes than developing

[Deleted]

Did anyone else manage to make a ticket regarding the fov issue during last stress test? I didnt have a chance to play much, all i did was log on so I could at least write one, so its brought to the attention of Arenanet. Do believe I saw a post somewhere (facebook maybe?) stating they were spesificly looking for input on technical issues. Atm on facebook it seems they are more busy riding bikes than developing

They were doing some technical testing by cramming loads of people in one zone and seeing how the servers held up last stress test. I didn't really get a chance to make a ticket cause I wanted to get in a lot of play time and I had missed the first 3 hours of the test :P

[Nexrex]

They were doing some technical testing by cramming loads of people in one zone and seeing how the servers held up last stress test. I didn't really get a chance to make a ticket cause I wanted to get in a lot of play time and I had missed the first 3 hours of the test :P

How was the stress test overall for you? :-)
Well I hope someone other than me actually made them aware of the FoV and other camera issues. Did cat h the new move the camera to the left or right for a over the shoulder look. Cool to see more camera options being opened up. Really wish fov is next or high up on the to do list.

[Citizen Mo]

But that's an extremely "scenic" screenshot and really gives no idea of perspective since literally everything in view is twisted/broken and set at odd angles, I can't tell how far anything is in relation to the character. It's also not a camera angle anyone would use while actually playing the game. Also Charr are naturally huge. Definitely not the camera example I'm looking for

Hi there. I uploaded a quick gameplay video of me doing pointless things in Lion's Arch during the stress test from August 12. I played a Charr, with the camera at maximum zoom out (until 3:37 in the video where I zoom in a couple steps). I had the "camera rotation speed" slider in the options all the way to right (fastest). For as close an in-game experience as possible, set it to 1080p and switch to full screen.




I hope this video gives you a better idea of where things stand as of 1 week ago

Also, sorry about the FPS in the video. When not recording, I was getting a very respectable 50 FPS average (in Lion's Arch, mind you).

[Queen of Hamsters]

Well, if they don't fix it by launch, theres gonna be alot of very ill and angry gamers within a few hours. Which will more than likey cause alot of bad publicity.

Buy Guild Wars 2 and throw up..... like that'll attract people to buy the game :/

Well I sure won't keep playing a game that does this to me...no matter how good and pretty it is in other aspects. Kinda concerned still since nobody's been in this thread to tell us that it's been taken care of...and as usual, some people would rather have people with this problem suffer than to accept that it's one feather less in the hat for the game as a whole.

[Rife]

Well I sure won't keep playing a game that does this to me...no matter how good and pretty it is in other aspects. Kinda concerned still since nobody's been in this thread to tell us that it's been taken care of...and as usual, some people would rather have people with this problem suffer than to accept that it's one feather less in the hat for the game as a whole.

I find the way you phrased your opening sentence pretty hilarious; "I sure won't keep playing a game that does this to me". As if Anet is deliberately working against your needs as a gamer by chosing to use the FoV they use. Also, you've already bought the game so whatever you do from now makes no difference to Anet. Play or don't play, fix your issue or don't. Make your choices and stop whining about Anet not fixing an issue you could fix yourself.

The vast majority of players don't have a FoV problem, either. There is nothing that states the game must have a certain FoV or cater to a few people who shouldn't be gaming at all if they have such huge issues with staring at a monitor on their desk unless it has very specific properties.

People who get ill by looking at a screen should have realised when they started gaming that an eyefinity/surround setup would solve all of their purported problems without needing to rely on developers to cater to their personal problems. So why the hell would so many people choose to rely on developers to fix their problems when they could so easily fix it themselves?

I don't understand this shit at all.

[Bonkbonk100]

Strange. I am usually the first to get sick if there are problems with the FoV settings, but I've never had any problems with GW2 and I've played that for many hours in a row. I guess I will pay closer attention next time.

[Kelesti]

Prior to a certain youtube personality doing a feature on Field of View and how it affects an ultra-minority of people, I've never even heard of this issue. Ever. Ultra minority. After, it's all I see pretty much anywhere I go. Self-diagnosed "omg I have that too", more often than not (Hey I've got a bridge to sell you!). People that have had this issue have had this issue with television gaming with 60. I've personally spoken to people who can't play anything "below 95" (yet one of these loudmouths is on XBL all the time ). So yeah, let me be the first to call a lot of bullshit.


But for people legitimately affected, however few of you that actually really is, tell me so that I can actually understand this. Because I don't. Field of view is what you see. Camera is what you use to see it. Am I wrong so far? I saw a diagram awhile back and I still don't get it, if my Field of View doesn't let me get a clear view of this coffee mug sitting next to me, I either have to A) Turn my head, or b) lean a little back, and it's in my FoV.

Why is this different in games? What does it actually change by telling your flatscreen to fishbowl an effect? Because I really, truly, don't understand it.

[Rife]

People with FoV problems:
Options:
1. Play for minutes at a time and try to tough it out without making yourself throw up all over your keyboard. This won't be a pleasent way to play any of your games.

2. Don't play games that don't have sufficient FoV. This could be very limiting.

3. Petition for FoV adjustments to be made which resolve your issues in every game you play forever. This rellies entirely on developers and by the looks of it, has not worked well in the past judging by comments in this thread.

4. Fix the problem yourself! Yes, it is possible! Holy crap, who knew that you could actually fix all your FoV issues in every game you'll ever play with one fix!
a) Eyefinity/Surround setup with regular monitors. Get monitors with thin bezels and a decent graphics card. Samsung S27A950D or 750D are 120hz 27" monitors with extremely thing bezels that the internet has pretty much decided is one of the best 120hz LCD monitors on the market, and it's relatively cheap! Get 3.

b) Get a 2560x1440 monitor. No bezels, no amazing graphics card required. $350 on ebay for a 27". That's a 30% increase in horizontal and vertical FoV. Get 3 of these if you're running quadfire 7970/680's under water and are willing to pay top dollar for the best possible graphical setup available, short of spending tens of thousands of dollars. Eyefinity on these bad boys would be insane. 7680x1440!!

c) Go for 5760x1080 resolution with no bezels by forking out a stack of cash for top of the line curved monitors or 3 top of the line projectors.

d) DIY option for those who can't fork out $1000 for 3 monitors and eyefinity/surround. Buy 3 secondhand overhead projectors and 3 15.1" old LCD monitors with 1920x1080 resolution. Follow a good guide online for making your own projector and setup your room with a wall for your new 150" eyefinity display. You'll lose out a bit on clarity/brightness but your budget DIY setup will outperform $500 projectors x 3 and offer that nice 300% horizontal eyefinity.

Solution:
Pick an option.