One Problem with GW2 and BGs

[Zeek Daniels]

I mentioned in another PvP thread on an idea for adding a Capture the flag type map. It still has the 3 node map style other sPvP maps currently add but its unique mechanic is a Flag. The flag spawns in a random location that can be marked or unmarked on the map. Once a player finds it he has to move it to one of the nodes he controls for it to start gaining him points.

Its at this point that the other team needs to act. The node that the flag is being held at will start gaining points at either a rate 2 or 3 times faster than other nodes or it will give 2 or 3 times more points than it usually gives. Forcing the other team to kill the player with the flag or force him off the node. If the player with the flag dies the flag disappears and respawns after a set amount of time. (flag cannot be passed around, once you pick it up its on you for good you cant set it down)

Now im in no way a pvp designer of maps but this could clearly have imbalance issues. Prolly also needs a mechanic for holding the flag without ever standing on a node after a certain time has passed.

[Ynna]

I mentioned in another PvP thread on an idea for adding a Capture the flag type map. It still has the 3 node map style other sPvP maps currently add but its unique mechanic is a Flag. The flag spawns in a random location that can be marked or unmarked on the map. Once a player finds it he has to move it to one of the nodes he controls for it to start gaining him points.

I'd certainly make it marked on the map. That way you keep the battle moving towards that spot and make it less random.

[Zilong]

Drake is right, it is blizzard, but I had fun a bunch of times nonetheless. I just don't want to expect the "Too hard to balance" reasoning to keep up just one mode. And while it would be good to have a conquest map with secondary flag mechanics (regardless of the balance) it is not the point (not mine anyway xD). I am asking for a dif game mode so I can enjoy a different primary goal.

The reason why I think the balance is not that much of an "Excuse" for players to back it up claiming fair longevity for the pvp is that even in gw2 the conquest altho providing different secondary mechanics (cool ones at that), they are indeed still neglectable as the fight for the nodes are what will probably make you win (I got excited when I learned that you could keep 1 node and just kill bosses, but I think that was prior to the nerf on their points value and was very risky).

So in all fairness I think a dif primary goal would be mint, I don't care when as long as it happens xD.

@Beazy

Still, I'm in the forums and I like to discuss about it .

We don't want ideas given from WoW please. I've literally had enough of hearing and seeing that joke of a game. GW2 is new and fresh, with there own ideas.

We are just debating them, it's healthy. I think all (ok, most) will appreciate that we want what is best for gw2. We are not implying we want WoW in Gw2. Asking for a different primary goal in a PvP setting is not equal to get WoW ideas (which obviously you dislike XD) and put in gw2. And as you saw they tried a few different games, but didn't find the perfect balance to it. Now it truly comes to either will they find a balance for it, or will they just move on to another idea. I think from what they said, its the latter, but who knows.

@Zeek

It's a nice idea and I would like to see it. But it falls again to the most of what My post is about. Secondary mechanics often get excluded, be it in EoTS or in the gw2 maps (which already happens. Thus the discussion for different modes

[Deleted]

i dont know where it was postet and its long time ago but i remember Arenanet said there will be a lot and different "BG" maps but not on release cause they have to concentrate on balance it out

later they will add more maps and modes
and dont know - for me its enough cause when i wanna mass pvp i go WvWvW and when i wanna team pvp i can have it too

[jvbastel]

I think it's good that they focused on 1 game mode and tried to make it as good as possible for launch.

Sure, they could implement more later (and they should especially GvG should be in the game one way or another) but right now they want to keep it easy and understandable for observers and players alike.

[Lanarchy]

I'm fine waiting on PvP maps and some extra content

[rigoremortis]

I think it's good that they focused on 1 game mode and tried to make it as good as possible for launch.

Sure, they could implement more later (and they should especially GvG should be in the game one way or another) but right now they want to keep it easy and understandable for observers and players alike.

^ this.

people expect all these new mmo's to have EVERYTHING WoW or whatever their favorite mmo already has after nearly a decade of development, and its one of the main reasons why all these mmo's fail, they try to add entirely too much; it doesnt get balanced right, and people quit.

so i say, "fuck it, let them take their time, its not like im gonna be paying a sub fee anyhow!"

[Deleted]

I think there will be serveral numbers available in the different maps in spvp, at least by looking on spvp info on website even though they didnt test it in beta events. Hopefully that is true. Competitive then ofc the number is locked to 5vs5 but that doesnt seem to be what you are looking for.

I'm pretty sure as well they will keep adding pvp maps to the game, but this is what the game launch with. Just keep playing and post on official forum ideas when game is launched and perhaps they listen if you get enough players to like your ideas.

I dont know how launch spvp will look exactly, but I hope more like their website than the betas. Personally I hope for duels added as well and ability to queue with friends in casual battlegrounds.

[Zilong]

I think there will be serveral numbers available in the different maps in spvp, at least by looking on spvp info on website even though they didnt test it in beta events. Hopefully that is true. Competitive then ofc the number is locked to 5vs5 but that doesnt seem to be what you are looking for.

I'm pretty sure as well they will keep adding pvp maps to the game, but this is what the game launch with. Just keep playing and post on official forum ideas when game is launched and perhaps they listen if you get enough players to like your ideas.

I dont know how launch spvp will look exactly, but I hope more like their website than the betas. Personally I hope for duels added as well and ability to queue with friends in casual battlegrounds.

Yeah, Ill be burning the foruns with ideas , altho mine (posted here and there too) didn't had much success.

I think by their answer on queue with friends might be tricky, as their answer to is was already out as : Want to queue with friends, go tourny. Casual BGS are to test your play and strategies and also we need to keep people from queueing together to keep the balance. (Not in these words but thats what Mike Ferg from Anet said to the ppl asking for it in the PvP lobby.)

Now, about duels its coming. I would have it sooner rather than later but...Ill wait. XD

[Beazy]

Yeah, Ill be burning the foruns with ideas , altho mine (posted here and there too) didn't had much success.

I think by their answer on queue with friends might be tricky, as their answer to is was already out as : Want to queue with friends, go tourny. Casual BGS are to test your play and strategies and also we need to keep people from queueing together to keep the balance. (Not in these words but thats what Mike Ferg from Anet said to the ppl asking for it in the PvP lobby.)

Now, about duels its coming. I would have it sooner rather than later but...Ill wait. XD

Wait, are you saying that I cant queue for BGs with my friends in GW2? I have to set up a tourney and find other teams to compete with ~ or does the application do that for me??

How does the tourney system work?

[DrakeWurrum]

Yeah. Unless you want to do a 5v5 tournament set up, there's no way to queue with a friend and ensure you're on the same team.[/FONT]

....huh. That's kinda weird. O_o

I could've sworn there was a way to jump into a casual sPvP match with your friends.

[Zilong]

Wait, are you saying that I cant queue for BGs with my friends in GW2? I have to set up a tourney and find other teams to compete with ~ or does the application do that for me??

How does the tourney system work?

Yeah. Well There is the browser games, and the tournaments:

The browser games you can join with the "hot join button" which will take you to a random map/game or pick a server and join it. (The last stress test I made sure that if you are grouped with someone you will know where he is, and you do have a button to join him in the map)

The problem with that is that you just might not join his team, which will probably be the reason of people asking for a "queue together" feature.

Other way around is to tell a friend which server you are on (number 83) join, and he joins right after. (With good chances to not be in the same team too).

(all this info is my empirical evidence. Therefore might not be 100% accurate XD)

--

There are like 2 kinds of tournaments:

Free, which you don't have to pay anything to enter. And only the highest 3 or 4 teams (out of 8) get rewarded.

Paid, you can pay with tournaments tickets (which are won in chest I think) which grants a reward for everyone regardless.

with that said there are 2 ways to do the tournaments (team pick up wise).

There are the tournaments that you have to come up with 5 players.

There are tournaments that you can have you and a friend or you and 2 friends. And the game itself will match with another group with only 2 or 3 players.

PS: I do not know if these tournaments are apart from each other (which I would like them to be), or if they merge together.

--

A quote from gw2 site:

Tournaments are the more organized side of structured PvP. Talk to the tournament master to join. Tournament play is always 5v5 and matches take place on the same maps that are used for hot join play. Tournaments run with varying frequency, and different reward levels allow some players to get their feet wet in the smaller tournaments while more-organized teams battle it out in the larger tournaments.

Each tournament pits eight teams of five players against each other. Teams that excel during the three-round, single-elimination tournament are rewarded with tournament chests full of valuable loot.

Tournaments come in the following flavors:

Pickup: single-elimination tournaments wait for 8 teams to join before starting. This tournament has 3 rounds of eliminations, with winners receiving qualifier points.
Monthly: Require an amount of qualifier points from the pickup tournaments to join.
Yearly: These grand tournaments feature the winners from the monthly tournaments slugging it out for the right to call themselves the best PvP players of the year.
Player-Run: customized by players, these tournaments allow for great flexibility and unique bragging rights.

But to be honest I'm not sure how updated this is.

[DrakeWurrum]

Yeah. Well There is the browser games, and the tournaments:

The browser games you can join with the "hot join button" which will take you to a random map/game or pick a server and join it. (The last stress test I made sure that if you are grouped with someone you will know where he is, and you do have a button to join him in the map)

The problem with that is that you just might not join his team, which will probably be the reason of people asking for a "queue together" feature.

Other way around is to tell a friend which server you are on (number 83) join, and he joins right after. (With good chances to not be in the same team too).

(all this info is my empirical evidence. Therefore might not be 100% accurate XD)

Definitely hoping they address this. One of the big things about MMOs is that friends want to play together, and often it's small 2- or 3-man groups. A LOT of people complained about how hard it was to make sure you were still on the same "shard" as the friends in your party, so they eventually added a way to join your party on the overflow shard.

They're going to have to do something similar for BGs. There will definitely be a shitstorm about this until they do.

I mean, in LoL, if I want to queue up for a pug non-ranked game with my friends, I can do so - with any number of them, up to a total 5-man pre-made team. I don't have to jump into ranked, and in fact it's ranked that restricts pre-made size.

[Zilong]

@Drake

I can see both sides here, but I would like the feature to be added too regardless. I grouped up with grandpab last stress test and found the "Join friend in pvp". Luckily I got in his team, but we crushed other hard usually. Which reminds me of the balance issue. So yeah...lots to considers.

[grandpab]

@Drake

I can see both sides here, but I would like the feature to be added too regardless. I grouped up with grandpab last stress test and found the "Join friend in pvp". Luckily I got in his team, but we crushed other hard usually. Which reminds me of the balance issue. So yeah...lots to considers.

There was one game where we actually ended up on different teams at the beginning of the game, but before any fighting really started I was able to switch teams. You can only switch teams if the team you're trying to switch to has less players on it, has to be at least 1 less player.

I've played quite a bit with friends, and with my experience playing with 1 or 2 friends it usually keeps you on the same team. When I played with 3 friends though we were often split up with 2 of us one team and 2 of us on the other.

I don't have that much of a problem with it though, but I think it's kinda fun fighting your friends once in a while.

[DrakeWurrum]

I don't have that much of a problem with it though, but I think it's kinda fun fighting your friends once in a while.

It can be, but I'm thinking about this situation as it pertains to playing with my girlfriend. Pretty sure she would not enjoy being separated from me, as we like to play as a pair in pvp.

[Zilong]

There was one game where we actually ended up on different teams at the beginning of the game, but before any fighting really started I was able to switch teams. You can only switch teams if the team you're trying to switch to has less players on it, has to be at least 1 less player.

I've played quite a bit with friends, and with my experience playing with 1 or 2 friends it usually keeps you on the same team. When I played with 3 friends though we were often split up with 2 of us one team and 2 of us on the other.

I don't have that much of a problem with it though, but I think it's kinda fun fighting your friends once in a while.

I think when we got in separate teams, was because I changed to my elementalist, when I was mainly playing with my ranger.

But no matter, I raped you hard on him and saved my ally, at the time XD. Then we rejoined on the same team.

Edit: @Drake

You have a GF? Blasphemy! XD Joking

[grandpab]

It can be, but I'm thinking about this situation as it pertains to playing with my girlfriend. Pretty sure she would not enjoy being separated from me, as we like to play as a pair in pvp.

I don't think that will be too much of a problem. Like I said, with my experience so far when I'm grouped with 1 other person it tends to place us on the same team. Then if you ever do end up on separate teams it's pretty easy to switch teams with all the leavers you encounter in spvp. It will pretty much always put you on different teams if you join at the same time though. It's definitely a minor inconvenience.

[DrakeWurrum]

I don't think that will be too much of a problem. Like I said, with my experience so far when I'm grouped with 1 other person it tends to place us on the same team. Then if you ever do end up on separate teams it's pretty easy to switch teams with all the leavers you encounter in spvp. It is a minor inconvenience though.

Shouldn't be an inconvenience at all. :P

[grandpab]

Yea...I can't really argue for it or against it myself though, that's how neutral I am on this particular topic. I'm just saying there is a sort of an inconvenient way to get on the same team if this is something that isn't fixed.

I wouldn't mind if they did something like Smite does actually. Premade pug games are limited to groups of 3 people. I think allowing 3-4 people to group together in spvp wouldn't be so bad, but if you allowed 8 players to consistently group together it would probably just become the norm since it'd make glory farming so much faster. Then people that solo queue end up getting steam-rolled.