Are supports really worth it?

[Migey]

Hey.

Are supports really worth having? I understand that they do make early game a little easier and can be very beneficial, but late game they really seem to peter out a little bit. I jst wonder if it isn't worth having less dedicated supports which scale better into late game. For example, Taric, or Soraka are great early game, but both just kinda stop being so useful later in the game, when everyone has a finished build. Not to say they are not useful at all, both bring plenty to the table, but not quite as much as other champions could late game. For example Lux is a decent support, perhaps not as great as Taric or Soraka, but late game she becomes a formidable AP carry, which I would find vastly preferable to Soraka. Alistar can become a solid tank, Blitzcrank makes a good anything (tank, ap, ad), etc. Why is a dedicated support so common in the current metagame where they just don't bring as much as other champions in the final stages of the game?

[Maelstrom51]

The great thing about Soraka is that she makes your AD carry near invincible for a few seconds. Also, support characters are generally those that can function without much gold, which is why you almost never see supports do any kind of carrying. The reason you take a character who doesn't need gold, is to feed your AD carry. If you didn't know, AD carries scale much much better in damage than other roles.

[Deleted]

Yeah the farm simply isn't there to gear up your support beyond the essentials. The top support picks reflect that; they're all good even though they end up with very little in the way of items.
Janna's CC is just as strong with 0 AP as it is with 500.
Soraka's silence doesn't grow in duration with more AP and neither does her armor buff.
Sona can still lock up the entire enemy team with her ult and provide useful auras for your team regardless of AP.

[StNimrod]

Well, heals and shields are really nice to have in lane, especially if you're a glass cannon who needs farm.

And CC beasts like Alistar, Blitzcrank and even Janna (dat ulti!) are priceless, grabs, stuns, knockups and knockbacks are very helpful to the team.

[Dundebuns]

Your support becomes a very useful tool for warding late game. A good support will always keep one item slot free so they acn still purchase and place wards. Also, depending on how you build a support, you can transition to a different role (although it only really works for an offensive support). Support Fiddle can transition to an AP carry, WW can become a great roamer and split pusher, Nautilus becomes a natural tank with insane amounts of CC and a good initiate.

[Deleted]

Alis and blitz are another thing..they are/can be bruisers and cc champs, not just supports who are squishy healer/shielders

But heres the thing I guess..

What else its gonna be?
You should have tank/bruiser already so thats no.
Surely it cant be another jungler.
Two AD carries at bot wont work either.
Its just going to be support anyway.

Tho yes, I would generally prefer lux/alis/blitz/Kayle as support over others. Maybe because I havent gotten used to the others (or I play them - poorly..but someones gotta do it)

[akts]

Why is a dedicated support so common in the current metagame where they just don't bring as much as other champions in the final stages of the game?

Because no game lasts that long. You want your AP and AD carries farm their final builds. THEN you can (and should) allow supports to take farm because the only thing you need is elixirs and GA swaps which is not extremely pricey. However realistically no game lasts beyond that point.

If riot someday introduces a new map that has, say, 4 lanes and a jungle, thus 5 sources of gold, 1 per champion, that map would have no 0 cs dedicated supports in its metagame. Much like Dominion meta.

[Maelle]

Half the time my question seems to be: is this carry really worth my support xD

can't last hit
can't take advantage of kill setups or charges into a group of 2 3 enemies like rambo
rages if I accidentally last hit and get a kill (even after they have died wtf)
wants me to facecheck bushes as a squishier support and rages hard when refused

Half the time for me, the carry is a bigger liability / is more useless than the support.

[cherb]

Running someone like Lux as a support can be decent but she should really not get to ap carry status if you are truly supporting. She won't get the damage necessary to do well when she is not getting last hits, and if someone is stealing last hits from their AD carry they are doing it incredibly wrong.

Also, they bring a ton of utility usually and often bring some sort of sustain or damage reduction tool, making it easier for your team to get ahead. 99% of the time games do not last deep into end game, unless the winning team is purposefully trying to drag it out just so they can have a full item build, which is a stupid way to play the game. I have MAYBE gotten a full, 6 item build on any role, in 1 of the last 100 games I've played, and probably even less than that.

[doot]

Half the time my question seems to be: is this carry really worth my support xD

can't last hit
can't take advantage of kill setups or charges into a group of 2 3 enemies like rambo
rages if I accidentally last hit and get a kill (even after they have died wtf)
wants me to facecheck bushes as a squishier support and rages hard when refused

Half the time for me, the carry is a bigger liability / is more useless than the support.

I'm with you I had a game where I was playing Sona and I spent three ults before my carry did anything with it.

[Jahoota]

I'm with you I had a game where I was playing Sona and I spent three ults before my carry did anything with it.

I see everyone is stunned (dancing) and within a few attacks of dying...perfect time to port back.

[ZerOKami]

Yes. /10char

[Boomcats]

There honestly is not a more talked about role on these forums then support. There has to be a thread a day on how they are " not fun / so fun! / boring / can't carry/ carried myself to 1800!"

Supports are inherent CC machines that protect the one person who wins team fights, your ADC. Whether it be early in lane, mid game fights around dragon, or late game fights at baron- your support should give you map awareness and protect the shit out of your carry. If you honestly dont think a heal from soraka, a stun from Taric (not to mention passive armor, and an ult that gives you 50AD/50AP), or a shield + pop up from Janna is important - you don't understand the basic concept of league of legends.

Watch any good team play, with the exception of some great mids, protecting the ADC / killing the ADC is the most important thing past 20 minutes. And a good support can do just that.

Also not to mention go look up whose at the top of solo que ELO (at least on the NA servers), then look at most of their top played champs. Oh whats that? they are mostly support mains, with an occasional ADC thrown in? Weird.. I thought supports couldn't carry.

[Deleted]

Bads babysit their carries and then cry that they can't do a shit when they are bad as well.


In reality you're allowed to do everything as everyone else. And beyond that, the fact that you usually cannot farm also means you have a bit more freedom. Use your own judgement and you can easily win the game via everyone in your team (your freedom might be instrumental in helping jungle, and if played right people in your team get ahead). That's it, the only thing that's really out of your grasp is winning the game by yourself, you just don't have money or levels to do that.

If you babysit carry whole day long without him/her really ever getting edge, you'll be liability to your team in fights. And that's kinda the moment when support-less team can just win ( or perhaps if their character scales a bit better without items, like alistar), because it's 5v4 for them.

[Deleted]

Half the time my question seems to be: is this carry really worth my support xD

can't last hit
can't take advantage of kill setups or charges into a group of 2 3 enemies like rambo
rages if I accidentally last hit and get a kill (even after they have died wtf)
wants me to facecheck bushes as a squishier support and rages hard when refused

Half the time for me, the carry is a bigger liability / is more useless than the support.

This so much. I used to play a lot of HoN where I almost only played support. I never play support in LoL and I never will.

I was going to try Tristana in a bot game since I just got her but somehow I accidently ended up with Sona. I was just like "fuck this , I'm not going to play support". Went with an AP build and ended up with 10/1/10.

[Tisarian]

Supports are worth it. They help your AD get farmed, with wards, oracles and crowd control. It isn't everyone's job on the team to go 20/0/0.

[Hanyuu]

One of the other posters really nailed it. There's alot of factors you can't control (ie you get counter picked and how much skill your team has), but the most tangible difference between a good and bad team is gold generation. There's basically 4 areas to earn gold...the three lanes and the jungle. As was mentioned before, AD carries need experience less than gold and are fragile early on, so a support allows them to generate gold better. Heals and shields let you stay in the lane more and crowd control helps win both small encounters and team fights. Supports as mentioned again, also function pretty well with little to no gold. Truthfully, it is much easier building your defenses and cool down reduction. They tend to take a hit for the team and drop wards like crazy, though in really good games...everyone buys wards and uses them.

From my limited personal experience, I've found supports to be a blast to play. I still am struggling with jungling and I actually find AD carry pretty difficult to play in terms of balancing offense with enough defense not to get killed too quickly in a team fight (though maybe if my friends were better organized, we'd protect the AD carry better.) The biggest misconception is the game is all about kills...it is but it also isn't. The game is again about gold generation. The top lane often turns into a farm fest, and some champions that go mid like say Karthus or Morganna can play defensively and do the same. Likewise, many carries would rather have a support with great sustain than go for a kill lane and simply last hit better. Farming gold might make a more passive game, but it is usually a way to show off your skill and wrack up a large number of minion kills. Ironically, last year, Riot nerfed heals pretty hard on a few of the more "toxic" characters and at least the game I've played are much more passive. Junglers do spice things up, but that's my again limited experience at least.

So in essence, support are the characters that assist and really have sometimes the strongest influence on the game. If you are good at it, you'll set your team up to win team fights and in turn the game. It isn't the easiest job to get recognition for doing well, but it is certainly rewarding knowing you are really have the highest impact on the game. I've had a much higher win percentage with support than any other role.

[Deleted]

Supports are worth it. /endthread

[Deleted]

AS I've said in other threads, a good carry gets carried by a good support.

[Deleted]

essentially supports are the guys that give their best to protect important targets, focus down other important targets and generally spend a lot of gold on utility such as wards and oracles.

one well placed ward can let you know where their entire team is opening up for initation or even telling you if it's safe to go grab your red buff without getting killed in a heartbeat.