1. #1

    PvP concerns since WotLK

    So I posted this on the "I don't want to play a new game" thread where Neth has been addressing the concerns of players with regards to major changes each expansion. I guess this post wasn't the best for there but I realized I had included some things that are major concerns every expansion since WotLK with regards to PvP.

    "Yes change is something that everyone needs to get used to. Yes, the vast majority of the changes are evolving the game in a great direction and always have.

    But there are A LOT of questionable design decisions that are seemingly against Blizzard's own philosophy.

    Such things include but are not limited to:
    1. PvP changes:

    a. I remember GC's blog post about the "CC arms" race way back while Cataclysm was in beta. That post seems to have gotten completely ignored in the design changes since then. CC has only increased across the board. I have heard a trillion and one times players and blues saying that "no one likes to not be able to play their character" except that every change since seems to go 100% against this idea. This ties in to the next thing.

    b. The dispel system. The change you guys made to it has been a long time coming. Except that in the face of more CC than ever, this change is actually a step backwards instead of forward in PvP. I'd say the dispel system should be reverted until the CC issues are actually addressed instead of exacerbated.

    c. Burst damage. You guys seem to have a very VERY hard time addressing this concern. I understand, you want to provide awesome unique abilities that can be used in both PvE and and PvP. That IS very difficult to balance. But come on, when people are getting bursted down in seconds through 80%+ damage reduction something's gotta give. The thing is, there's a few classes that are the culprits to this and the ONLY reason they're at this state of PvP imbalance is because you are shoe horning them into PvE viability. Did I mention this was at the expense of PvP balance?

    d. Burst healing. This is the worst it's ever been in the history of this game. And there's a single culprit to this. One that everyone and their mother have talked about on the forums but have gone unnoticed: PvP power effecting healing. For some reason, PvP power is providing a massive 40% increase to damage and healing in PvP. This makes the change to breaking PvP resilience in defense/power null and void moving from the previous expansion. Nerf PvP power damage. Remove PvP power healing completely. It makes no sense that someone should be healing for more in pvp than in pve especially when it scales to insanity with the damage reduction from resilience.

    2. Saturation of abilities. There are way WAAAAY too many abilities in the game. This is mostly a PvP problem as PvE utilizes a very small % of one's toolbox.

    a. This is overwhelming to new players; a concern that you guys have repeatedly voiced yourselves but continue to act against in some regards.

    b. It's no fun having to press 2 or 3 more buttons than another class to get similar results. Going off of that the next concern:

    c. Inevitable homogenization. When there's this many abilities in the game, it's obvious that classes are going to get homogenized no matter how ridiculously hard you try to keep classes unique.

    There's probably a lot more but I can't think of it right now. All I ask for is some consistency and more exposure to the larger overarching concerns to the long term of this game that effect all players. I know you're doing your best over there and thanks for all the responses Neth but you must understand that there ARE things that players want that have been backed up by Blizzard in the past but have been wholly ignored since."

    Let me know what you think and how best Blizzard could address this. Better yet, I think we should draw more attention to these concerns because they've been talked about but completely ignored for 3 expansions now.
    Quote Originally Posted by High Overlord Saurfang
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  2. #2
    Deleted
    I agree with everything here. But you got too many abilities as a leftover from the last talent system which had to bring new tricks every expansion. IMO half of abilities should be removed from every class since they aren't used ever. I know people hate it, but I like the new talent system, and that's how usable abilities should work too. Instead of having all abilities and getting only 1 usable and 2 passive per spec extra, more emphasis should be on the spec.

    What I'm trying to say is, BM and MS hunters can't use any traps, frost mages can't cast any fire spells, focus the skills more into each spec for rogues and warriors, and stuff like that. If every spec of every class had 8 usable abilities it would be more than enough, it's certainly more than players use on a daily basis. I spam 4 buttons with my MS hunter all the time and my unholly DK has a rotation of 4 abilities and works fine. Sure, I'm not the best player in the world, but it's a game and I can't be arsed to study my class like goddamn engineering in order to play it the best that it can do.

  3. #3
    Mechagnome Mitak's Avatar
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    Its very nice that you are so passionate about the game Flaks, unfortunately Blizzard has proven that they do not really listen to such posts. At the end of the day they will do whatever they want until they brake the back of the game, which i actually want to see happen and im positive it will some day.
    I absolutely agree on the amount of CCs in the game, its only going up. When you have an arena 3v3 or the dreaded 5v5 you spend half the time CCd, which is absolutely no fun for me and im sure a lot of other people. The problem in mass pvp (5v5, RBGs) is that you have all those different classes each with couple of CCs, which combined is a total horror. If you ask me, id put a common CC DR on all CCs in the game so basically thy cant be chained. But meh, this will not change and im tired of writing on the blizz forums.

    My major concern however is the healing that you mentioned. I am very aware that the healing the DPS classes have right now might seem OP and people are crying (because thats easy than thinking), but its quite clear that this is normalized for lvl 90 and when you have 300K health a WOG heal for 30k will be nothing. What worries me are healers and scaling with pvp power,that is simply bad design. So why would i need to even apply by 20% healing debuff on a healer, when he has 40% pvp power?
    Anyway we will see how everything goes when we hit 90. So far it looks like the Cata pvp but worse, where at the end of cata healers were immortal unless you had 2 pocket UH DKs spamming necrotic strikes.
    The truth may be out there, but the lies are inside your head.

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