[Guardian] - Patch 5.4 Survival Guide

[Mandibleclaw]

Thanks for testing this Mandibleclaw. I updated Catus to v31. Your Catus will autoupdate the next time you launch it.

There is a new Guardian form button, which uses the proper armor specialization (+5% stamina). I also made it compute your bear form armor using Nature's Guardian mastery modifier. Activating this button exposes the [x] Enforce Crit Cap checkbox.

yea just tested it, all working fine

[Viromand]

Well, I am crit soft capped w/ rentaki atmo (almost), but if I'd loose the 1.7k exp, I will have to reforge more to exp (using pure crit gems in all slots atmo) and loose crit.
And I don't see getting crit soft capped, as only upgrades for me will be probably from Heroic, which will take time.

Maybe as I will have zero chances to get HC BL, I might as well run w/ Rook and Vial (if I get 'em)....

Does Rook work on most boss and add AoE abilities?

Like some already said you cant say Ill change trinket a for trinket b the whole time.

And yes Rooks work on almost all fights.

I havbe vial hc, rook flex, rena hc and bl normal, and I swap them alot

we are currently on thok heroic so dont know which trinkets Ill use on the last three but currently i use

Immerseus: depends doesnt really matter last time I used vial/rena (dont really use bl alot cause I only have the 530 one)
Protectors: Same
Norushen: BL and rena
Sha: Vial and Rena
Galakras: I dont knwo cause im doing the towers and grunts I am afk 50% of the fight cause im too lazy to go in an aoe the waves. We have a very good aoe comp so we dont need it but i would use vial plus rena.
Juggernaut: rook and rena (you can use it if you tranq in p2 and help your healers aswell as for the cone attack the gives you the stacking dot)
Shamans: vial and rena
nazgrim: vial and rena (dont know why exo used rooks there but I quess in 25 m you need the extra stam)
malkorok: Rook plus rena or bl depends on healer setup dont really need vial doesnt provide that mucht it will get even worse if you manage to kill him in 1 p2.
spoils: rena and bl
thock: rooks and vial, I solo tank him and you want as much cooldowns as you can get for first p1. Those 600k melees and 1.2million screeches at high stacks will kill you.

The rooks effect works on
Immerseus(conal attack)
protectors(not really that helpfull but it works on the slaming add from rooks transition and the aoe dmg from suns)
norushen(works on all aoe abilites even the ones in the other phase for extra vengeance)
sha: works on every aoe he does
galakras: Dont know if this is really true but it doesnt seem to work on the aoe from the orbs. but works on hunter tower aoe.
juggernautp2 and flamebreath only the initial tho)
shaman works on all aoe stuff, even slime spawns.
nazgrim: works on all aoe.
malakrok, perfect for p2 if you have 1-2 tanks solo it.
spoils: works but no real gain.
thok: works on conal, screech and if you solo tank him rooks is very helpfull and vial is the trinket that will provide you the most dps due to low cd on our HP gain, which wlll give you more vengeance /dps than and other trinket would.

[Sonnillon]

Thanks for the long post Viromand.

I am speaking of changing a to b, cause it is a pain to re-reforge each and every time I would equip Rentaki for something, if lets say I would have other trinkets w/o reforgable stats.
And bit on the expensive side as well. I barely manage to earn enough gold to keep my gear fixed... (not enough time)

As we're done w/ HC for this reset (due to missing few key ppl who make HC progression worth while), we're gonna clear the place, so hopefully something drops for me...

[exochaft]

nazgrim: vial and rena (dont know why exo used rooks there but I quess in 25 m you need the extra stam)

It was when he was a progression boss, and we had some... special people... who tended to get hit by Nazgrim's abilities, making him War Song a lot more than he should have. Rook's works against that ability, especially if your raid lacks cooldowns to deal with it (let's our healers worry about getting the raid back up instead of the tanks). I should mention we didn't have a problem with the DPS requirement when he was progression, otherwise I might have considered more DPS-oriented trinkets once my survival was guaranteed.

Rook's also works on frontal cleave damage, such as Korven's Viscious Assault (pretty sure it would work on Rook himself for the Protectors encounter). I use the trinket to effectively solo-tank Korven on heroic Paragons, as it eliminates needing to taunt-swap and prevents second-guessing where the Vicious Assault will be at any given time... as those who have enjoyed this encounter know, positioning is everything. There's actually quite a few mechanics that Rook's will work on during the heroic Paragons encounter, making it invaluable for pre-planned and emergency use.

[Sonnillon]

Another glorious reset and no Vial. Coined Molkorok for 3 items, coined Immerseus to get gold x_x

But all what is written makes me want to slap the Rook's on instead of BL. So thanks for the advice. WTB some better chance for loot.

[Jurman]

Another glorious reset and no Vial. Coined Molkorok for 3 items, coined Immerseus to get gold x_x

But all what is written makes me want to slap the Rook's on instead of BL. So thanks for the advice. WTB some better chance for loot.

Yeah i have same succes Coined at malkorok and got WF agi polearm instead of WF ring or vial !

[Deleted]

Whats your guys opinion on Agil enchants for legs/shoulder/wrist(LW) instead or stam? is it worth sacrificing that health for some extra crit dps, rage generation ect. cheers

[Elunedra]

yes it is worth it to the crit enchant
this is also why blizzard buffed bears hp becase other tanks where getting stamina enchants \ gems while we bear kept going for crit

but personasly i wont take agi over stamina,
thats why i got +750 stamina on bracer rather then 500 agi

[Deleted]

I pick the agility enchants over the stamina enchants no matter what. I sit at around 1M HP raid-buffed, and I don't need any more HP; Rather get the damage.

[exochaft]

I personally use the stamina versions of the leg/shoulder/wrist enchantments. I'm already well over crit soft cap, and I find my DPS output is affected more with my Vengeance and how I execute my fight rather than some extra crit/agility... and sometimes extra health will allow me to get substantial Vengeance gains. However, everyone and their raid/situation is different, so doing what fits best for the individual is generally the way to go.

[Mandibleclaw]

+750 stamina wrist enchant for me. and will never use the agi one.

[Dreyen]

Looking at the AGI to armor talent, I feel pretty excited at possibly having agility as our main stat... Although I guess they said they'll be removing main stats from gems thou, only secondaries.

It sounds so frigging powerful at the current value they've set thou, it's like a 50% armor increase, 50% more EH, nomnomnom

[Kioga]

Help me out guys cuz I can't find a straight answer. I know that Windsong is superior to Dancing Steel after reaching 79% crit in terms of RPS but what about DPS? Does the random crit/haste procs of WS outperform the guaranteed agi/crit of DS? I raid 10m and don't find myself in need of rage for FR often; if anything I am spamming Maul so not to waste any. On harder fights I tend to run DoC so there is usually a big heal for me if i need it just in case I may not have the rage for FR.

Lastly, has anyone ran the numbers yet to fig out which trinket is the best for DPS? I would guess it is either Haromm's, Thok's Tail Tip or Hubris. I think hubris would possibly win IF you are running NV and Inc but I'm not the best with math to fig out the answer.

[Arielle]

I know that Windsong is superior to Dancing Steel after reaching 79% crit in terms of RPS but what about DPS?

Needs to be simmed. Chances are you wouldn't notice the difference anyway.

Lastly, has anyone ran the numbers yet to fig out which trinket is the best for DPS? I would guess it is either Haromm's, Thok's Tail Tip or Hubris. I think hubris would possibly win IF you are running NV and Inc but I'm not the best with math to fig out the answer.

Again, needs to be simmed.

[Maximum]

Lastly, has anyone ran the numbers yet to fig out which trinket is the best for DPS? I would guess it is either Haromm's, Thok's Tail Tip or Hubris. I think hubris would possibly win IF you are running NV and Inc but I'm not the best with math to fig out the answer.

I mainly play feral but i know a lot and used to main guardian. This teir I have only played guardian for our H garrosh kill and for 1 week of farm, where the only fun thing i did was solo tank H malkorok. When I went full crit for farm My crit was close to 90% with no crit procs or agi procs, I dropped a little bit for haste so my multistrike would put me as little over 100% crit as possible. Even then the on use of curse of hubris would only be worth close to 10% crit which is just terrible (Besides gimping a good synapse springs). By far the best trinkets are multistrike and thoks. I wish I had either of those when i solo tanked


PS. I know that haste after a certain soft cap of crit is worth it for RPS, and all the theorycrafting guardians are big into that. I just find it way more fun to have more crit and do crazy damage, and because as a guardian I feel like if you are good at the game you could never die, just heal yourself to full whenever out of range of healers and dodge literally fucking everything. Also, running full crit I have never been short on rage to NOT maul pretty much off cd and kerep savage defense up when it matters and heal to full all day long. Guardians OP

[Braindwen]

Yeah, Hubris is really annoying with synapse springs

But really, you waste way too much of the crit on Hubris's proc for it to be worth it. Even stopping at 79% crit (not ideal for DPS, mind you), Hubris would only be worth about a 14% DPS increase while it's up, so unless you plan to fit nearly half of your damage into 15 out of every 90s, there's just no way it'll compete for DPS. Stamina is pretty handy, admittedly, just not from a DPS point of view.

Which leaves Thok's and Haromm's. 580 Thok's is a 9% boost to haste/mastery rating, 9% crit amp (4.5% DPS increase at 100% crit, just shy of 4% at 79% crit), and a strength proc. 580 Haromm's is just a straight 6% DPS boost and an agility proc.

Basically Hubris is "I need a stam trinket but rook's proc is kinda useless".
Thok's is "I wanted a DPS trinket with some haste on it, and we have no str. DPS"
And Haromm's is "I just want a DPS trinket, who cares about living?"

[Dreyen]

Guess who did one heroic ToT run and got a heroic thunderforged bloodlust talisman

[Kioga]

Needs to be simmed. Chances are you wouldn't notice the difference anyway

So I am a novice at using SimCraft but if I did this right using 10,000 iterations over 600 secs, the difference between Dancing Steel and Windsong is less than 500 dps across several variations of fights. Assuming my sims are correct, Windsong provides nearly identical dps while also being a RPS gain over dancing steel. I cannot think of reason not to use it.

[Arielle]

So I am a novice at using SimCraft but if I did this right using 10,000 iterations over 600 secs, the difference between Dancing Steel and Windsong is less than 500 dps across several variations of fights. Assuming my sims are correct, Windsong provides nearly identical dps while also being a RPS gain over dancing steel. I cannot think of reason not to use it.

Dancing Steal will be slightly better in low-vengeance situations (since SimC can't actually do swaps or other mechanics where Vengeance goes up and down....yet). But yeah, like I said you wouldn't notice the difference in terms of DPS anyway.

Obviously if you're sharing weapons with a Feral spec then it's different.

[Dreyen]

So wait.. windsong is the better enchant? I mean, if it's more dps in normal situations, more rage gen, on top of some mastery procs as well.. sounds like it's just way better.