GW2 - Poorest Account Security ever?

[Shadylol]

Again. Stop caring about who is at fault. What you should be concerned about is what you can do different to prevent this from happening in the future. That's what gets results, not whining.

I'm not whining bro, I don't have any problems with my Guild Wars 2 account (or any other accounts). I'm simply pointing out that rampant, senseless victim blaming isn't helping anyone, including your oh, so beloved company, who'd like to continue their revenue stream

[zaphon]

Again, I know it's almost cliche now, but for all of you talking about the authenticator and WoW, let's remember that it wasn't released until June of 2008, a full 3.5 years after the game came out. And if your account was hacked in Vanilla (my wife's account was hacked in 2005, completely her fault), you we're LUCKY if you got the account back at all. She got her account back (and it was a painful process that included getting documents NOTARIZED and sending them via snail mail), but that's it. They didn't restore one single item. I know that everyone compares GW2 to what Blizzard has today, but remember it took them years to get there.

Plus my personal opinion is that Blizzard led people to having a false sense of security by giving them the authenticator, as while it protected you, you weren't warned everytime someone tried to login (and had the right password), but got the authenticator wrong, so you had no idea that your password was known by people, and you should change it. But that's neither here nor there, the damage is done.

[Shadylol]

Again. Stop caring about who is at fault. What you should be concerned about is what you can do different to prevent this from happening in the future. That's what gets results, not whining.

---------- Post added 2012-09-12 at 04:54 PM ----------


Yes. The Arena Net devs and support team have been actively posting on Reddit with verified official accounts since headstart, if not before that.

Devs, and the first Tier of the "support team" != CSRs who can actually restore account variables, and assist in account recovery

Furthermore, I doubt they would consider reddit a proper medium for contacting them about a compromised account

[DrakeWurrum]

I'm not whining bro, I don't have any problems with my Guild Wars 2 account (or any other accounts). I'm simply pointing out that rampant, senseless victim blaming isn't helping anyone, including your oh, so beloved company, who'd like to continue their revenue stream

Who is victim blaming? It's statistically verifiable that most users are "at fault" for why they got hacked, and they could have taken further preventative measures to protect themselves. I personally know more people than I count on my hands that are stupid enough to fall for phishing scams, and will then turn around and get mad at the company for not protecting them from phishing scams - they'll go so far as to lie about whether or not they got an e-mail at all in their depraved ravings of rage and anger, and only after account access has been restored will they admit to their mistake.

If that's still considered "victim blaming" then sorry, but it's justified blaming. It's not somebody telling you "shut up and get out" it's somebody telling you "This is what you did wrong, now do something to fix it"



Random aside: http://securingwow.blogspot.com/2010...r-account.html
Authenticator does have a flaw.

---------- Post added 2012-09-12 at 04:58 PM ----------

Devs, and the first Tier of the "support team" != CSRs who can actually restore account variables, and assist in account recovery

Furthermore, I doubt they would consider reddit a proper medium for contacting them about a compromised account

It's strange, yes, but they've helped people out through reddit over the past two weeks. I honestly don't know if they're still making use of Reddit, but it makes sense to do so, considering you can't access the forums when hacked.

[Shadylol]

Again, I know it's almost cliche now, but for all of you talking about the authenticator and WoW, let's remember that it wasn't released until June of 2008, a full 3.5 years after the game came out. And if your account was hacked in Vanilla (my wife's account was hacked in 2005, completely her fault), you we're LUCKY if you got the account back at all. She got her account back (and it was a painful process that included getting documents NOTARIZED and sending them via snail mail), but that's it. They didn't restore one single item. I know that everyone compares GW2 to what Blizzard has today, but remember it took them years to get there.

Plus my personal opinion is that Blizzard led people to having a false sense of security by giving them the authenticator, as while it protected you, you weren't warned everytime someone tried to login (and had the right password), but got the authenticator wrong, so you had no idea that your password was known by people, and you should change it. But that's neither here nor there, the damage is done.

That was then... this is now

You can't compare a new game that came out in 2012, to the state of WoW in 2004-2006. That just doesn't make sense, nor does it help anyone

[Deleted]

I'm being entirely rational. I am however getting frustrated with you. The very next ">" was this: "> submitting a ticket returns an automated message telling you your ticket hasn't been submitted." What use is submitting a ticket if you receive an email telling you that they are no longer accepting tickets regarding the issue? I'm getting frustrated with you, Drake, because you seem to be of the following traits:

> reads (poorly) between the lines
> responds to things with incorrect information regarding WoW (saying that authenticators were a recent addition when they were introduced in 2008, a year after GW2 development had started)
> arguing that failures are allowed to occur because non-AAA (who don't use words like, evolution, revolution mind you) fail with the same issue

I don't know what to do, but perhaps you should remove yourself from the thread because really I don't understand what you want me to say:

"Okay, ANet, you win. I'll force myself to use 15 billion different emails and passwords and I'll buy 10 copies of GW2 just so I can be secure with my account."

Are you happy?

[DrakeWurrum]

That was then... this is now

You can't compare a new game that came out in 2012, to the state of WoW in 2004-2006. That just doesn't make sense, nor does it help anyone

Nobody is making that comparison. What is being said is that nobody has ever had it perfectly flawless at launch.

[Shadylol]

Who is victim blaming? It's statistically verifiable that most users are "at fault" for why they got hacked, and they could have taken further preventative measures to protect themselves. I personally know more people than I count on my hands that are stupid enough to fall for phishing scams, and will then turn around and get mad at the company for not protecting them from phishing scams - they'll go so far as to lie about whether or not they got an e-mail at all in their depraved ravings of rage and anger, and only after account access has been restored will they admit to their mistake.

If that's still considered "victim blaming" then sorry, but it's justified blaming. It's not somebody telling you "shut up and get out" it's somebody telling you "This is what you did wrong, now do something to fix it"



Random aside: http://securingwow.blogspot.com/2010...r-account.html
Authenticator does have a flaw.

---------- Post added 2012-09-12 at 04:58 PM ----------


It's strange, yes, but they've helped people out through reddit over the past two weeks. I honestly don't know if they're still making use of Reddit, but it makes sense to do so, considering you can't access the forums when hacked.

I'm beginning to seriously question your motives. I've said nothing about Authenticators thus far, yet you proceed to quote me, and force information on why they're flawed down my throat, as if I implied that they were perfect (again, I said nothing of them). Then you claim that NC Soft/Arenanet has adequate customer support... because you can contact them on reddit...

Why would I not just call them, if my account was compromised?

[DrakeWurrum]

The very next ">" was this: "> submitting a ticket returns an automated message telling you your ticket hasn't been submitted."

Very much disbelieving this. Because I put in a support ticket on August 30th for a small problem, and the ticket went through perfectly fine, and had absolutely nothing to do with NCSoft support. Yes, it's still open, but it's essentially a "non-issue" that I can be plenty patient waiting for, while they handle real problems, like account compromises.

---------- Post added 2012-09-12 at 05:02 PM ----------

i've said nothing about Authenticators thus far

You... do know what a random aside is, right?

[Deleted]

and then again i was considering to start GW2 but thanks to story's like this i won't buy it.
i hate bad customer support and since the GW 2 accounts seem so easy to be hacked why would i even spend money on a game that can get compromised so easy?

[DrakeWurrum]

and then again i was considering to start GW2 but thanks to story's like this i won't buy it.
i hate bad customer support and since the GW 2 accounts seem so easy to be hacked why would i even spend money on a game that can get compromised so easy?

You shouldn't listen to the vocal minority, which is exactly what a public forum board is composed of. Most people are not having these issues with ANet support. It's a little slow and back-logged, but they're working on improving that.

[Shadylol]

Very much disbelieving this. Because I put in a support ticket on August 30th for a small problem, and the ticket went through perfectly fine, and had absolutely nothing to do with NCSoft support. Yes, it's still open, but it's essentially a "non-issue" that I can be plenty patient waiting for, while they handle real problems, like account compromises.

---------- Post added 2012-09-12 at 05:02 PM ----------


You... do know what a random aside is, right?

You've clearly either not made a support ticket in GW2, or they've changed their process in the past few days. Either way, submitting a report tells you that they can't respond do you directly, but they'll investigate the bug (or whatever you reported), and all support has more than "absolutely nothing" to do with NCSoft support, since it's... dealt with... by... NCSOft suport... ...

...

[Deleted]

Very much disbelieving this. Because I put in a support ticket on August 30th for a small problem, and the ticket went through perfectly fine, and had absolutely nothing to do with NCSoft support.

---------- Post added 2012-09-12 at 05:02 PM ----------


You... do know what a random aside is, right?

30th August...

2 days ago, September 10th, the 11k~ account hacks were caused.

I don't see how it's comparable? This was the full email I received:

Response
Hello,

Thank you for contacting NCsoft! We have been receiving an overwhelming response to Guild Wars 2 and we are doing our very best to answer questions as quickly as possible. You are receiving this automated message based on information provided in your original submission that indicates that we may be able to answer your question with the information provided below. As a result of this we are no longer accepting new tickets. Thank you for your patience.

Reset Password & E-mail Authentication
If you were previously experiencing an issue resetting your password or authenticating your email address, please follow the directions below.

1. Go to https://account.guildwars2.com/recovery
2. In the Email / Account Name field, enter the email address used for your Guild Wars 2 account.
3. In the Serial Code field, enter the serial code you registered to the account.
4. In the Character Name field, enter the name of an existing character on your account.
5. Click Verify.
Be sure to set your account password to a strong, unique password that you've never used anywhere else!

Additional information regarding the Guild Wars Account E-mail Authentication System can be found here: http://en.support.guildwars2.com/app...tail/a_id/9192


Spam / Phishing Attempts
If you were notified of an email change request or confirmation, please try logging into the Guild Wars 2 forums (https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum) to confirm that your account name has not been changed.

If you do not have a Guild Wars account, please disregard the email. We also suggest that you secure the email account by changing the password, in addition to, the passwords of any other accounts that may be associated to the email that received this message from our account system.


Please do not create a new ticket for this issue as it will cause delays. However, replying to this email will allow us to assist you based on when you first contacted us regarding the issue. Please provide the following information if you have not already done so:
If your Guild Wars 2 account name has been changed, provide the account name (your secure email address) you want it changed back to.
What is your complete Guild Wars 2 Display Name (if you have it)?
What is your 25-digit Guild Wars 2 Serial Code?

If your issue is resolved and you no longer need assistance, please do the following:

1. Log in to your support account by clicking the My Stuff tab above.
If you do not recall your login information, use the Forgot your support login or password? link.
2. Click the Questions button or link.
3. Find the 12-digit reference number matching the one on the support request you wish to close.
4. Click the subject line to the right of that reference number.
5. Under Do you want a response?, select No, I don't need this question answered now.
6. Click Submit.

Your support request will be moved to Closed status.

NOTE: Anything typed in the Add additional information to your question box will not be seen by our support staff if the No, I don't need this question answered now option is selected.

The bolded parts. My ticket got immediately moved to closed, with the links provided returning errors and telling me to fill in yet more tickets. Not to mention nothing in the email actually *helps* me directly.

[Shadylol]

and then again i was considering to start GW2 but thanks to story's like this i won't buy it.
i hate bad customer support and since the GW 2 accounts seem so easy to be hacked why would i even spend money on a game that can get compromised so easy?

Well, it's no easier for a Guild Wars 2 account to be compromised than a WoW account, SWTOR account... most MMO accounts. MMO Developers in general don't have a good sense of account security. I've said this before, but Valve does a really good job, and I wish more companies would follow their example

[DrakeWurrum]

Judging from some of the posts on the official forums about account compromise tickets that are being resolved, I'm not far off the mark that many of the new CS employees they're having to hire to handle this increased workload... are extremely inexperienced.

Can't really fault Arena Net for having employees that are human.

---------- Post added 2012-09-12 at 05:09 PM ----------

The bolded parts. My ticket got immediately moved to closed, with the links provided returning errors and telling me to fill in yet more tickets.

You're missing what I'm trying to ask, so I'm going to be blunt. Which web site did you open the support ticket from?

Here?

Or here?

Because the first choice is wrong.

[Deleted]

Judging from some of the posts on the official forums about account compromise tickets that are being resolved, I'm not far off the mark that many of the new CS employees they're having to hire to handle this increased workload... are extremely inexperienced.

Can't really fault Arena Net for having employees that are human.

WOAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH

So if my boss, who's a headteacher, employs a new teacher who is completely inexperienced, out of their depth, and above all terrible at providing inspiration it is okay because "they are human?" I'm sorry, if you're having issue employing people with the experience needed for CS: offer refunds, it is not the player's fault that a business isn't ran properly.

[DrakeWurrum]

WOAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH

So if my boss, who's a headteacher, employs a new teacher who is completely inexperienced, out of their depth, and above all terrible at providing inspiration it is okay because "they are human?" I'm sorry, if you're having issue employing people with the experience needed for CS: offer refunds, it is not the player's fault that a business isn't ran properly.

No, I'm not saying it's okay, I'm saying to be patient, because they're doing the best they possibly can. They're having to train new employees while, at the same time, handling these requests. These new employees are going to be making mistakes, and there's nothing that anybody can do about it. Keep in mind that account compromise things are NOT simple fixes, it requires them to look through hundreds if not thousands of lines of logs to try to figure out what exactly happened to the account, so that they can figure out what characters/items/gold needs to be restored.

I doubt you have any experience working for an MMORPG company's CS department. Hell, considering what people think of NCSoft support, I also wouldn't be willing to hire people who claim they DO have experience in such work.

[Deleted]

No, I'm not saying it's okay, I'm saying to be patient, because they're doing the best they possibly can. They're having to train new employees while, at the same time, handling these requests. These new employees are going to be making mistakes, and there's nothing that anybody can do about it.

I used the GW2 support link fyi. I provided, as I said in my OP, pretty much my entire identity: passport evidence, serial number, card number I bought the game with etc.

Put in a support ticket and see the response you get, since the 30th August a lot has changed - for the worse.

[DrakeWurrum]

I used the GW2 support link fyi. I provided, as I said in my OP, pretty much my entire identity: passport evidence, serial number, card number I bought the game with etc.

Put in a support ticket and see the response you get, since the 30th August a lot has changed - for the worse.

That just sounds odd. I wonder if what they're doing to "increase" the size of their support team is borrowing, either temporarily or permanently, support people from NCSoft.

[Deleted]

Or perhaps they're completely incompetent and, as with my example, out of their depth when it comes to CS?