People "quitting" over Cross Realm Zones - who else is laughing?

[Kevyne-Shandris]

They aren't quitting. If they truly wanted to quit, they wouldn't care about whining on a forum, hoping it gets to noticed by Blizzard...

Point is they don't want to quit.

People do leave over things like their sense of community is gone, as what's the point in playing a game that resembles a battleground 24/7?

CRZ came and made it too much of a chore to multibox for me (zone change stuttering that's unplayable). Without that to level multiple toons, it really becomes pointless to play. CRZ ruined leveling 4 toons to 85 in time for MoP, so truly not interested if Blizz isn't interested in keeping betaware off live servers to ruin the fun for players. If that's how customers are treated, it's time for customers to vote with their wallets -- BF3 Premium is looking much better for play value, instead.

[Dazzy]

bitch about zones being dead for years, zones are now alive, time to quit, typical wow player.

Fail logic, as most of the people complaining are ones that play on low pop servers for a reason. I'm not bitching about it because that's pointless, but I have been on a low pop server for 7 years, because that's the way I like it.

If it gets to the point of annoying me I'll go to the lowest pop server there is I guess.

[RickJamesLich]

I think the main issue with the guys that don't like CRZ is they either hate the "world" part of world of warcraft, or they hate the "war" part of world of warcraft. If people don't want to engage in pvp ever, then simply stay in the city and you'll be safe, nobody is forcing you to quest, to be honest, LFD is just as fast and BG's are more fun than either one (I guess except for the guys that don't like pvp lol).

I think the big problem here is that the latest batch of wow players, wrath babies and cata babies don't understand that the game used to be a battle between two factions, at any point in time you could be facing horde or allinace - they are just used to easy epics and being able to teleport anywhere easily, and content being nerfed. Now all of the sudden the see the enemy faction mowing down their buddies, then they jump in and get owned, and they decide since they can't do anything about it, they are just going to pack up and leave.

[Dazzy]

Every direction this game has went since WotLK hit was for the majority. You really don't think the masses wanted their old zones to actually feel alive?

They don't, that's the point. A few whiny posts about wow being dead, and blizzard interpreted that as 'hey we need crz'. 95% of the 'dead' complaints are from pvp servers, so they should just keep crz to those.

[Osmeric]

They don't, that's the point. A few whiny posts about wow being dead, and blizzard interpreted that as 'hey we need crz'. 95% of the 'dead' complaints are from pvp servers, so they should just keep crz to those.

We saw a lot of this kind of talk back in January 2011. It died away after the losses started mounting.

[Waterisbest]

CRZ is the best thing that has happened to this game. The game feels alive now. Don't like the PvP? Join a PvE server. So what if it takes you a few more minutes to farm mats. Big deal. As if you weren't going to afk in the cities right? Learn to adapt. I have been leveling and farming for the past few days, and I have yet to find any problems. Mobs and farming items spawn fast enough. And if there is a horde, I get to fight them.

If you want to quit over CRZ, go ahead, do it right now and don't tell us if you are quitting, we don't care, just like we don't care about anyone else quitting over anything else.

CRZ is awesome! And it's the best thing going into MoP. It's better then entire expansions imo.

[Kevyne-Shandris]

CRZ is the best thing that has happened to this game. The game feels alive now. Don't like the PvP? Join a PvE server. So what if it takes you a few more minutes to farm mats. Big deal.

Sounds like a typical PvPer, who also doesn't want to be bothered to gem and enchant his gear as they can't afford it. They're the type that begs for money to buy mounts as they're too lazy to even farm dungeons for gold. So yeah can see how node timers and keeping mats on realms aren't a concern for the typical PvPer...but don't try to pass off that "I don't care" attitude to a lifeblood of the game. The game is m-u-c-h more than level 85 ganking lowbies.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

People can quit for whatever they want to quit for. It might be a silly reason to quit but it is also pretty silly to worry about what other people are quitting something like a video game.

[Waterisbest]

Sounds like a typical PvPer, who also doesn't want to be bothered to gem and enchant his gear as they can't afford it. They're the type that begs for money to buy mounts as they're too lazy to even farm dungeons for gold. So yeah can see how node timers and keeping mats on realms aren't a concern for the typical PvPer...but don't try to pass off that "I don't care" attitude to a lifeblood of the game. The game is m-u-c-h more than level 85 ganking lowbies.

/slow clap

Thank you for being ignorant. I am an avid PvEer who has cleared everything in TBC and WotLK. I hardly do arena and the real PvP for me is World PvP, bgs are good time pass that's all. The way you describe PvPers only makes me laugh because it's an insult to every PvPer. For this very reason I would like to know how old are you? Yes, I don't care about you finding CRZ a pain because it will take you 5 more minutes to farm. And OH NO SOMEONE GANKED YOU!! How about buck up and gank them back instead of whining and insulting people who have different interest then you, or, have MORE interests then you? Even being a PvEer, world PvP is something I jump on too.

People ganking lowbies? Because it never happened pre CRZ!! All PvP I have been involved in hardly had to do with ganking lowbies. Yes, you get the occasional asshole who thinks ganking lowbies is so cool, but this isn't about ganking lowbies, far from it. It's about going against other like minded players who want to do more then just sit in a city.

The game is much more then farming for nodes and herbs. The world isn't just made for farming or rep grinding. Time for you to realize this.

[MoanaLisa]

Well I'm someone who was playing on a PVP server when 5.0 hit and just recently moved to a PVE server.

For me, the problem with this change is that for the last few years Blizzard basically did everything they could to prevent world PVP. If you wanted world PVP then you were expected to goto zones like Wintergrasp and Tol Barard. Then out of no where they completely change the way world pvp works. Did I initially sign up to potentially PVP at any time? Yes, but I picked realms where population and horde/alliance ratios were to my liking. I wouldn't have rolled on PVP servers if the levels of PVP that we're seeing with CRZ was happening then. You now have 40 man, cross realm raids showing up to do battle with people doing dailies. Thats not world PVP, its slaughter.

It would be nice if Blizzard at least acknowledged that they completely changed the dynamics of how world PVP works. Offer free transfers off the realms for people who aren't interested. I know I still have serveral toons on PVP realms that I don't want on those realms, but are kind of stuck there.

Thanks. By the way, I agree with you in principle that if what I've seen on PVP realms (secondhand) continues on much past launch day, then free transfers from PVP realms to some other realm category are in order. I'm somewhat on the fence about it but find that I have a little more sympathy for the point that Blizzard allowed things to slide along in the manner they did for a long time and then suddenly shifted. I can see the other side as well though and said it: You signed up for it when you created a character there.

But if the change really leaves people thoroughly unhappy with that choice and the unhappiness is traceable to design changes, sure. It's not purely a black-or-white thing. Healthy honorable PVP is one thing. People hanging out near the dark portal looking to murder everyone possible passing by is something else. I know that there are those that think this is what Blizzard supports but I'm not so sure myself. Anyway, enough of my noodling on the subject. Best regards.

[Achyra]

Why do you care why people quit, exactly? Some people quit over CRZ, some people quit because they don't like the direction of their class, and some quit because they don't like the new talent system: People quit for a wide variety of reasons but I have found the only thing that remains consistent no matter what is that there are people so judgmental (and perhaps clinging so desperately to their game) that they must mock others for being unhappy in the game.

And, btw, they post on the forums because they enjoy the game just as much as you and are, I'm sure, sad that the thing they enjoyed and spent so much time and money on is no longer satisfying for them.

~Has quit, has no intention of coming back, mock me if you desire to.

[Deafknight]

PvP'ers dont enchant and gem their gear ? beg money for mounts ?
trolololo.

[Kuja]

I hate this feature as well, but quitting is a bit overkill. Getting rare kills or finding treasure chests is a pain now .__. Even if they reduced the spawn times by half. Though chests remain as rare still afaik.

Also the group ganking is ridiculous now.

[Kevyne-Shandris]

PvP'ers dont enchant and gem their gear ? beg money for mounts ?
trolololo.

Yep. Just check Armory for proof. Just check trade for proof who does the begging the most for gold.

Pure waste to see players in full CP gear missing gems and enchants. They can't even be bothered to just make enough gold for even the best PvP gear. -_-

[zeropeorth]

I've never understood why those who quit any game feel the need to make posts about quitting.

I'm pretty sure Blizz likes to know why 3 million people quit.

I'm pretty sure, that if any other significant amount quits, they'll care why.

I'm pretty sure that missing that half a million a month from the 25% loss in subs hurts a bit.

I'm pretty sure that people communicate in strong words when they are upset.


CRZ is great for pvp realms. Bad for non-bot farmers. Bad for rare campers. Bad for low-end PCs. Bad for questing since you wait 20 minutes to kill 8 tigers, because the zone is wiped clean, so you get to sit around and wait for respawns constantly. It is bad for events like fishing and arena areas that should be server only battles, for achievements and rewards that were based on a per server basis.

Competition is supposed to be between the factions, not within the faction. The respect for others has been waning for years, now you just have your own faction ganking nodes from you, because they are from another server. You have 50 people hovering over spawn points, instead of 5 or 10 from your own realm. You have too saturated questing areas, so it is like playing at launch everywhere, instead of playing with friends and meeting new ones.


If you can't RESPECT that some rolled on low pop servers for a reason, and that their monthly fee is just as valid as yours ... then you are the asshat. Not them. Most people who don't like CRZ say it is fine for those who love it. Let them have it. Don't force people who have been playing for years and LIKED IT the way it was, to now be forced to deal with shit they intentionally avoided.

Just because YOU think MMO means crowded zones and no resources to gather, and no chance for people to get 'rare' mobs/pets ... doesn't mean that is the sole definition of MMO.

The MMO comes for some, with 10/25 player raids. 5 player instances. Playing with multiple friends, but not strangers.

The 'this is not Skyrim' argument is bullshit, since it is a single player game. If it was multiplayer, then yes, my wife and I would be playing that, but since it wasn't, we don't. We want to play together with friends in a large universe.

Name ONE game, that is like WoW (fantasy universe, similar combat, crafting, gathering, experience) that you can play with 1-24+ of your friends, that isn't considered an MMO?

MMO isn't limited to circle jerking with 1000 players at once. It is about MULTIPLAYER online play in a MASSIVE universe ... at least for some. The advantage is others playing with their friends, in a large community, create a healthy economy, so you can play with YOUR friends, and still use things like the AH or trade, and deal with other players. This is a SERVER community thing. Something that CRZ cannot help with at all.

Narrow minded people can't see past their own thoughts.

Hell, I hope everyone that claims they are going to quit, do, and I hope it is millions, that way people who can't respect others can shut the fark up and realize those people deserve what they like too.



Here is a simple solution. Make the first instance of a server's zone, built for those who wish to 'opt-out' of CRZ. You will NEVER find anyone from any other server on it. If you cross realm group, you get fed into a second instance of the zone, even if you are opted out of CRZ.

Shutting the fishing tourney down, when they say shutting crz down per realm and zone is easy, was a bullshit move. Why not just shut down CRZ for the STV zones during the hours the event runs on that day? Also Dalaran. Make it so if you switch to another server's instance in a different time zone, that you lose the shark, so you can't turn it in ... the item is only valid in the time zone/realm it was fished in.

You know, I may not think driving a diesel is enjoyable, but I can respect others desires and wants. What people who don't understand are basically saying ... 'I love this, and even though you don't like it, it shall be thrust upon you!!!' How selfish.

It is being forced upon people, sorta like a prostate exam.

I love that it makes zones more alive. It is amazing for pvp realms bringing back more pvp in the world. But those who see those positives, put blinders on to all else. That is pure selfishness and lack of respect. And it is bullshit.

I LOL at people who can't understand this, because in real life, outside the game, that kind of narrow mindedness will get you a swift ass kicking ... or better, a long line of unsuccessful progress in life. In the end, that attitude in life pays you back 10 fold. Get out what you put in ... you are sour, and until you can try to see things from others perspective, you'll only find other selfish people to befriend you ... and they are all fair-weather friends.


Enjoy it. Pissing off the community like that, and telling them to stuff it, won't end well.


I am sure Blizzard will fix it all. That doesn't make the concerns those people have any less valid, even if they didn't express themselves very well. But consumers do have the right to vote with their wallet. It is the ONLY way a company listens ... when a lot of people decide to not do business with them any longer and state the reasons why.

There is a lot of competition out there now. Rift is doing awesome, constant updates, free xpac with year sub, great customer service, intense raiding environment. SW going free to play (EA ruined a great IP) with some of the best story telling during questing ever, awesome voice acting, nice environments. Tera, active combat, not 'target' system, you have to aim your attacks, spells, heals at its target, beautiful world. They each have their pros and cons ... just like WoW. They are no longer the only kid on the block, just the fattest and richest. They will kill themselves if they aren't careful, no other game will do it to them.

We don't need more shit making people leave right now. You can't have too much sub drop, or investors start selling stock, and the foundation gets cracked a bit. If I find shit that pisses me off enough to not buy MoP or play the game, I have every right ... I'd also have every right to express it. The community isn't there just to 'yes, man' ... they are allowed to complain. They are allowed to say why they are leaving. We aren't talking about 1% ... we are talking a loss already of 25%, and I'm sorry, but 3 million people shouldn't just STFU and go. They need to say WHY they leave ... because honestly, that is a serious issue. Silencing them won't solve anything. Ignoring problems doesn't make them go away. Treating people like their opinions are less valid is never a good way to go about customer service, nor is it being a good community member.

Even if you don't agree, try to see their points, help them express them and validate them, fight for them. Find solutions that works for both sides of the issue. It is called compromise. Which is most of what the people who hate crz are asking for; but since they are getting told (at first) nothing, and then, 'this might not be the game for you' ... well, what would you do, if you were ignored, then told stfu, and you are paying for an optional service for entertainment? Probably spend your money elsewhere, and give them a piece of your mind why.



For me, THIS won't be the reason I quit wow. My wife and I are discussing whether we will upgrade or not. We still have a month or so left on our AP. We both feel that the game has taken directions neither of us like. She started in vanilla, I in BC. The thing that bothers us the most, is the pricks you run into constantly, that wasn't so prevalent in the past. The selfishness and greed. The unwillingness to be a positive member of the community. Trolling newbies who really just need some good advice. Spending 5 mins with them, instead of being a dick and telling them they should study a bunch of sites not part of the blizzard family of sites to spend hours (remember, newbies) studying their class, in a game that is supposedly MMO (oh wait, it is only MMO for ganking, and being rude, amirite?).

We've also met some really nice people since CRZ. It is nice. But you also see 50 people camping rare spawns and killing them so hunters can't tame them, you know, the ones that just drop a tear, griefing, killing quest npcs for lols, ganking lowbies ... all the scum of the earth feels more magnified, and doesn't seem to balance out the nice people you meet.


I respect anyone who loves CRZ, and anyone who hates it and is quitting over it. Both are valid arguments and feelings. Any one particular opinion doesn't matter, but you can't ignore trends in how a lot of those feelings start to add up to more than the individual feelings. And it seems pretty split atm.

Would you rather lose another 1 million to this? or have it redesigned to make both sides happy and keep that 150 million revenue a month, just from letting them continue to play the game they enjoy? Why do they have to enjoy it the exact same way you do, or I do? They aren't asking you to enjoy it the way they do.

It is more than resistance to change ... it is that some people enjoyed it greatly the way it was. They rolled specifically on the servers they did. That is what was great about them NOT merging. It allowed people to choose high pop/full servers, medium servers, low pop servers. They had the choice when they created a toon. They had a choice to re-roll or transfer if they didn't like it (1-85 was quick, and the model for gearing up to current content, not as painful as in the past).

The option was always there, in an MMO, for you to make friends, and create alts together, and the world would never be empty, because you played with others to begin with.


But arguing with some people is like talking to a brick wall. They can't see anything. They can't hear you. They don't care. It is what it is, and that is that.

[Synros]

has blizz every done anything you agree with?

yes. The lore throughout Wrath. The world redesign in Cata. BG/Arenas. Not making the Emerald Dream into an Xpac. etc. Just because I disagreed with a couple things, doesn't mean I hate the whole game. If you claim to agree with everything Blizzard does, you are lying to yourself.

---------- Post added 2012-09-22 at 03:19 PM ----------

oh fucking hell, quite your whining. i took my dk back out to refarm mag'har rep (blizz can kiss my ass btw), and yes I said refarm mag'har rep... anyways at about i'd say 12 pm or so, and ally had complete control. i was taken down 3 times before i made it to the portal.

yes i'm one of those kil'jadean jackoffs too.

also, why do people keep using this as an excuse to bitch and complain. this shit is only happening because there is absolutely nothing else to do. most guilds have already cleared DS for the last week of the expansion, and there is no arena.

i think i'd rather have a little fun, than sit in org/sw all damn night.

oh and i see you're one of those lfg complainers too boot. ... sigh

"i think i'd rather have a little fun, than sit in org/sw all damn night.

oh and i see you're one of those lfg complainers too boot. ... sigh "

First off, you are retarded. You say I complain about a feature that all you have to do is sit in SW/Org and get an auto group, but you'd rather be out of those cities killing shit. Do you see the contradiction there?

I don't know whether to facepalm or what. Calling me a complainer when people use and abuse a feature to the point the server crashes (more then 5 times, affecting everyones gameplay), doesn't make any logical sense. I doubt if your server was crashing, you'd just be sitting there saying "I'm cool with this."

" i took my dk back out to refarm mag'har rep (blizz can kiss my ass btw), and yes I said refarm mag'har rep... "

^And wtf is this?!

[SamR]

So, yeah, thousands of replies on the official forum are still just the vocal minority and their opinions mean nothing. You sounded just like our Secretary of Education here in Hong Kong.

There have been way more complaints about LFR on every single WoW-related forum than CRZ. And yet nobody in their right mind believes they'll ever remove LFR seeing as it's one of the most popular and often used features in the game.

So what does that tell you about complainers on forums and how much they represent the playerbase?

---------- Post added 2012-09-22 at 03:25 PM ----------

Yes, people on beta PVE were being force flagged.

And in TBC beta, Druids could instant flight form in combat.

Why are you arguing about beta when CRZ is currently on live?

Once again, I'm on a PvE server and I've never been flagged against my will in a CRZ zone.

Are you actually complaining that PvE players are being force flagged, or are you dragging out an old fixed bug because you have nothing else to argue?

---------- Post added 2012-09-22 at 03:29 PM ----------

I'm pretty sure Blizz likes to know why 3 million people quit.

Oh Blizzard knows. They have all the exit interviews.

If you read the forums, you would think that most people left WoW because it's becoming too casual and they hate LFD and LFR.

Interestingly, Blizzard gave us new nerfed Twilight heroics, has designed MoP to be even casual friendly and has no intention of removing LFD or LFR. Sounds to me that WoW becoming too casual and easy wasn't why people were leaving. At least that's not what was being conveyed through the exit surveys.

So I guess the forums often give you a false impression of why people leave.

[Kuja]

Cross realm gank fest at Dark Portal. This is how it has been looking for 22 hours in a day, every day since the patch.

90% of the skeletons belong to Alliance players.

Most of the horde I inspected have latest PVP gear on.

Personally I see no PVP in this. It's just griefing. :c Take the portal to Blasted Lands. Arrive dead, especially if you are level 58 like supposed.

[rebecca191]

Thanks. By the way, I agree with you in principle that if what I've seen on PVP realms (secondhand) continues on much past launch day, then free transfers from PVP realms to some other realm category are in order. I'm somewhat on the fence about it but find that I have a little more sympathy for the point that Blizzard allowed things to slide along in the manner they did for a long time and then suddenly shifted. I can see the other side as well though and said it: You signed up for it when you created a character there.

But if the change really leaves people thoroughly unhappy with that choice and the unhappiness is traceable to design changes, sure. It's not purely a black-or-white thing. Healthy honorable PVP is one thing. People hanging out near the dark portal looking to murder everyone possible passing by is something else. I know that there are those that think this is what Blizzard supports but I'm not so sure myself. Anyway, enough of my noodling on the subject. Best regards.

This. I joined a guild on a PvP server to kill heroic Lich King after my PvE server guild died because they were the closest option in terms of progression, faction, raid times, etc. The amount of world PvP the 2 and a half years before I quit was tolerable. The handful of times I was killed usually involved broken mechanics (such as Tol Barad guards not aggroing by the portal). I saw this coming with the no flying while leveling, CRZ, weakened guards, etc. Except now that Cata has killed so many 25m guilds there are no longer many options for 25m raiders on PvE servers in the top couple %. Maybe Horde has more choices, I didn't look at Horde because I won't play Horde, but when I looked while deciding whether to play MoP, if I didn't want to take a drop in ranking by well over 50+ guilds, or raid at 3am, then I had exactly 2 potential guilds, and who knows if either is still raiding anymore since that was 2 or 3 months ago. I was already not excited about many things about MoP, so that certainly contributed to my decision to quit - I knew I would no longer be able to tolerate playing on a PvP server.

[Porimlys]

Does seem pretty melodramatic, even if a lot of the concerns are valid.