When does Fury > Arms?

[CptEgo]

I loved Arms for 5 years, but since they removed the timer on Slam, it feels shitty. If I wanted to play whack-a-mole, I would've gone Retribution.

[Accaris]

I loved Arms for 5 years, but since they removed the timer on Slam, it feels shitty. If I wanted to play whack-a-mole, I would've gone Retribution.

Slam's not even on my bar. When would I have time to use it over Heroic Strike?

[Fiercon]

Everytime you use heroic strike without TfB-proccs over slam you are essentially using the wrong skill. There are only 2 circumstances that warrant HS usage over Slam:

1. You have more than 2 TfB proccs rolling
2. You have more than 80-90 rage and need to burn it

Nr. 2 does happen fairly frequently, when you get several OP proccs or can procc-refresh CS. This in combination with your other skills like Cries, Dragonroar or one-more-OP (tm) can leave you with a lot of rage and no GCD to spend a slam on. But it's far away from all-the-time. So yeah, get that slam on your bar and fill some GCDs with something that actually hits reliably hard.

[Tart]

If you have 462 itemlevel with 15% crit something is very wrong.
I'm rocking 21.05% crit at same ilvl and fury feels very good

Can i see you armory please mate to see what you have done different to me? Im 460 il with 15.03% crit and after capping hit and expertise there is no way i can make up another 5% crit to yours.

Here is mine btw, any help to get it higher would be greatful. http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...antrums/simple

[Tearyn]

21% crit at 460 does seem a little unlikely, im only missing 2 axes from jade temple to replace my 2 swords from brewery, wrists from one of the scarlet instances that have hit / crit, and 2 of the ring from the last boss in Mogu'shan and I'm left without upgrades, and im only barley above 20%.

[Darkfriend]

You both realize there isn't a required "crit" cap to play Fury, Correct? There is no "better gear = go fury" either.
You'll pretty much have the same exact crit rating as you would Arms as long as you properly reforge your gear. (It's cheap, should be no excuses for this even on green pieces.)

And not to mention Arms is just as reliant on Crit as Fury. You either need MS/CS crits to help sustain using Slam, or you need lucky Overpower procs to fill GCDs. I leveled, geared up, and still do heroics as Fury. I've dropped my Arms OS entirely at the drop of 5.0.4 to pick up a Tank spec to queue for dungeons faster.

If you're having problems with not filling gcds because of Rage Issues.
1. Use (Hit or Exp) Gems in shitty non pre raid BiS pieces, and use elixirs, alchemists have to make that crap to level and are trying to get rid of it.
2. Stop pressing Heroic Strike as much.
3. Stop pressing Berserker Rage on cooldown, it's more powerful when it activates a raging blow charge.


If you want to do any serious raiding, yes you will be required to go Fury for just about every non-cleave fight, and from the latest balancing notes, it looks like the gap from Arms to Fury is only going to grow larger from it's already sizable gap.

You're wrong when you say arms is "just as" reliant on crits as fury. That would imply they have similar stat weights- which they don't. Crit is around .3 points of str for me as arms. Its over 1 point of str as fury. It scales better with fury due to RB and mastery as well.


Also, from my testing in 5mans, from simcraft numbers, and from what landsoul said a few weeks ago, arms was better by a large margin. But since the SS nerfs and other changes, I'm no longer quite sure what is best- I'll sim everything later tonight.

[Tart]

21% crit at 460 does seem a little unlikely, im only missing 2 axes from jade temple to replace my 2 swords from brewery, wrists from one of the scarlet instances that have hit / crit, and 2 of the ring from the last boss in Mogu'shan and I'm left without upgrades, and im only barley above 20%.

Are you hit and exp capped mate? I cant get anywhere near 20% crit without neglecting hit and exp rating.

[Darkfriend]

Are you hit and exp capped mate? I cant get anywhere near 20% crit without neglecting hit and exp rating.

This. With 458 ilvl (fury not arms, no buffs) I have 15.5% crit, hit and exp capped.

[Deleted]

You are gemming pure strength though, Darkfriend. (apart from 1 uncommon Opal).

[Tearyn]

Are you hit and exp capped mate? I cant get anywhere near 20% crit without neglecting hit and exp rating.

Armory link in sig

[BowwJob]

Are you hit and exp capped mate? I cant get anywhere near 20% crit without neglecting hit and exp rating.

Here is what u are missing from Tearyn.

1: 1% from his race Worgen
2: blacksmith bracer and glove sockets. 640 crit rating
3: Belt socket 320 Crit rating
4: 2 Strn gems and 1 strn/crit gem should be converted to their orange counter-part Crit/Exp.

just these changes here is 1280(2%) Crit rating not factoring in possible gains from reforging.

With just a quick glance at reforging u can get more crit with a crit/exp gem and reforging both rings to crit(+245Crit). also on your pants with the extra expertise u wont need to reforge the hit and could maybe get more crit else where. Ty also has a cloak with Full Crit.

[Tart]

Here is what u are missing from Tearyn.

1: 1% from his race Worgen
2: blacksmith bracer and glove sockets. 640 crit rating
3: Belt socket 320 Crit rating
4: 2 Strn gems and 1 strn/crit gem should be converted to their orange counter-part Crit/Exp.

just these changes here is 1280(2%) Crit rating not factoring in possible gains from reforging.

With just a quick glance at reforging u can get more crit with a crit/exp gem and reforging both rings to crit(+245Crit). also on your pants with the extra expertise u wont need to reforge the hit and could maybe get more crit else where. Ty also has a cloak with Full Crit.

Bloody hell now that you have told me its so obvious. Thanks alot for the help mate lol

[CptEgo]

Slam's not even on my bar. When would I have time to use it over Heroic Strike?

Then you're doing it wrong. Heroic Strike Strike should only be used when Taste for Blood reaches 3-4 stacks. All other times, Slam is your main Rage dumper. It does way more damage.

Quote from Icyveins.com;
"Use Heroic Strike when you have stacks of Taste for Blood or when you are unable to avoid being at maximum rage (using Slam as your main rage-dump is crucial; only use Heroic Strike when you cannot dump rage fast enough with Slam)."

[Fiercon]

Then you're doing it wrong. Heroic Strike Strike should only be used when Taste for Blood reaches 3-4 stacks. All other times, Slam is your main Rage dumper. It does way more damage.

Quote from Icyveins.com;
"Use Heroic Strike when you have stacks of Taste for Blood or when you are unable to avoid being at maximum rage (using Slam as your main rage-dump is crucial; only use Heroic Strike when you cannot dump rage fast enough with Slam)."

Don't underestimate the fact, that HS does NOT consume a GCD, while Slam does! In most cases it isn't a choice of "What button to hit while nothing to do" but more like "OMG OMG so much up, at 100(120)rage and no GCDs left". That's when you definitely will use a HS. It's better to dump your rage from 100 without spending a GCD that's better filled with your next (free) MS, CS or OP.

[Deleted]

So, is it acceptable to raid in Fury this patch or is Arms still way to go? (sorry, I've been away from game for 4 months. I did like playing Arms in patch 4.3, because it was a nice change of heart, however I still like Fury more than Arms).

[Succath]

I`m playing Arms atm cause it was easier with hit cap and such. and i`m pulling decent numbers in dungeons so far. i do feel however that SMF is stronger tehn TG at this time. but i might be wrong.

However to come back to your question i think they are more or less on par at this time. and dont foget that warriors always scale better later on in expansions due to the lack of good gear in the beginning. especially Fury.