For people who did 10man MSV: Harder or easier than T11?

[Farabee]

Just wondering how it compares to T11 at the start of Cata which was quite hard with blues, even on normal mode. It's obvious from the amount of guilds stuck on the first boss that this tier is no joke.

Not going to lie, I don't really have high hopes for my raid group clearing more than 2 or perhaps 3 bosses the first week with all the reports of difficulty coming in. We certainly don't have enough gear for Elegon. My question is how hard are we going to get blocked on the first 4.

[Deleted]

Never been there, just making a guess from rough numbers. Plus, it's not even 1 day MV is open so it's just a useless guess tbh.

To me, the real deal is Feng, followed by Gara'jal. Elegon will be a pain, but at the moment the minority of the guilds that downed at least Stone Guard are stucked on him.

[Deleted]

easier

seriously its faceroll

Don't troll with misinformation

[Porcell]

easier

seriously its faceroll

Why did you post this? Do you even play this game anymore? All I see from you is GW2 posts.

I can't speak to 10 man difficulty. 25 man in T11 we got 2 bosses the first week, 3 more new ones the second week, and then 4 more new ones the following week. So far we killed the Stone Guard in 4 pulls last night, and then wiped 14 times on Feng. We'll see how Feng goes again tonight.

So far, it's challenging enough. I would certainly not call it faceroll. Heroic 5 mans are faceroll.

[halfawake]

It was a long time ago so it's hard to remember, and now I'm healing instead of dpsing but it seems pretty comparable. Got two down and should have gotten third down if we hadn't ran out of time but it seems very well tuned imo.

[Aerai]

Stone Guard was confusing at first for tanks as their is a LOT of swapping. Feng is managing raid cool downs. Gara'Jal as a tank I really have little idea of wtf is going on for most of that fight. Spirit Kings were really easy as long as your raid dodges everything.

We haven't beat Elegon but he has a mean DPS requirement to beat enrage. So does Gara'Jal to an extent as you can't 3 heal it.

Overall I find them much more mechanically complicated than T11 but difficulty wise very similar.

[Wildmoon]

I remember Blizz stated themself that they intentionally made this tier to be around the same difficulty of T11 because they have LFR for casual already.

[Confirm Deny]

Going off a friend who went 4/6: Little lower tuning than Tier 11, but the mechanics are more than decent for an "entry" tier. Not quite the same /FacepalmAtDeadWeightInterrupts mechanics, or something. He was surprised the yesterday's/day before's interview singled out Spirit Kings. Maybe that was supposed to be heroic.

Personally, even if I loved Tier 11 I was surprised as hell when they apparently decided to let even normal modes be somewhat challenging again because they planned on people using LFR.
All eyes on Blizzard, I guess. Seems like it could bite them in the ass again; though I don't really want to talk down on people who may only have time for LFR in the first place.

[Farabee]

I kind of think it will bite them in the ass. LFR is really unrewarding with the new loot setup, even assuming you blow your charms for extra rolls. Normal is your only real shot at decent loot that you have a snowball's chance in hell at winning.

That said, good to hear it's about the same as T11. Which means, challenging but not assrape-hard.

[Daverid]

Going off a friend who went 4/6: Little lower tuning than Tier 11, but the mechanics are more than decent for an "entry" tier. Not quite the same /FacepalmAtDeadWeightInterrupts mechanics, or something. He was surprised the yesterday's/day before's interview singled out Spirit Kings. Maybe that was supposed to be heroic.

As someone who cleared 3/6 tonight in our 3 hour raid time slot, I'd say I agree 100% with this. They are definitely easier than T11 Normals, but it's honestly not by much and there's some hella crazy fights (Both in respect to Damage/Healing required AND Cool mechanics), I enjoyed every encounter immensely and Stone Guard took a good couple of wipes to get my head around the tank swapping and what times.

However the real challenge will be when we get to Heroics. T11 Heroic was extremely long, challenging and unforgiving. I did it in 25man, so naturally it would have been easier (Some of the fights but probably a majority) in 10man and based off these Normals I'm expecting some extremely 'Clusterfucky' and very intense Hard Modes. Which I certainly look forward to.

[the operator]

3/6 IN 5 HRS. its way easier than t11 normal

[Deleted]

However the real challenge will be when we get to Heroics. T11 Heroic was extremely long, challenging and unforgiving. I did it in 25man, so naturally it would have been easier (Some of the fights but probably a majority) in 10man and based off these Normals I'm expecting some extremely 'Clusterfucky' and very intense Hard Modes. Which I certainly look forward to.

Well... no.

[a21fa7c67f26f6d49a20c2c51]

I find it a bit tough to tal about the normal modes: when we hit 85 in Cata the first thing we did was try and raid - our item level wasn't even high enough to queue for heroic dungeons (and if you're going to fly out and zone in you might as well do it for raid content right?) Up to eigleon it seems like the content is mechanically fairly simple - there's a fair bit of room for error which is something I didn't feel like we had in the first few weeks of T11 normal modes.

I'm sure we'll see a normal mode nerf soon (Eiglon certainly, the others are likely) because this stuff is similar to—though a bit easier than—the first few weeks of cataclysm. Overall I think it's in a pretty good state for at least the first few bosses. The future raids are supposed to be tuned a bit tighter but we'll also have a month worth of raid gear so that'll mitigate the difference somewhat.

I suspect heroic modes won't be that big of a step up (think dragonsoul, not things like council bosses/al'akir in tier 11) but we'll see - there's a lot of time to kill between now and then and I'm going to hold off judgement until the real raids open up.

[Daverid]

Well... no.

Great Response! I'm loving the discussion power such a reply creates.

[Aerai]

Elegon is far more unforgiving for a normal than anything I did in T11.

[LuminousAether]

As someone who cleared 3/6 tonight in our 3 hour raid time slot, I'd say I agree 100% with this. They are definitely easier than T11 Normals, but it's honestly not by much and there's some hella crazy fights (Both in respect to Damage/Healing required AND Cool mechanics), I enjoyed every encounter immensely and Stone Guard took a good couple of wipes to get my head around the tank swapping and what times.

However the real challenge will be when we get to Heroics. T11 Heroic was extremely long, challenging and unforgiving. I did it in 25man, so naturally it would have been easier (Some of the fights but probably a majority) in 10man and based off these Normals I'm expecting some extremely 'Clusterfucky' and very intense Hard Modes. Which I certainly look forward to.

25 man T11 was easier than 10 man T11. MUCH easier. Every single fight.

---------- Post added 2012-10-03 at 08:16 PM ----------

Great Response! I'm loving the discussion power such a reply creates.

I'm pretty sure he was replying about the relative difficulty of 10 and 25. You were completely wrong about 10 man being easier, it was dramatically more challenging. Much less room for error, much stricter group compositions, etc.

[lwalker8]

Cata bosses were killed the same day as release. There was a full week to gear in full heroics/pre-raid epics. Craftable epics were available, VP gear was available, everyone who beat more than one boss was in min 463 ilvl - Brewfest trinkets.

Gear aside, these bosses are tuned tighter than T11 was. People just have selective memories.

[Zues]

Stone Guard was confusing at first for tanks as their is a LOT of swapping. Feng is managing raid cool downs. Gara'Jal as a tank I really have little idea of wtf is going on for most of that fight. Spirit Kings were really easy as long as your raid dodges everything.

We haven't beat Elegon but he has a mean DPS requirement to beat enrage. So does Gara'Jal to an extent as you can't 3 heal it.

Overall I find them much more mechanically complicated than T11 but difficulty wise very similar.

What? We 3 healed it just fine. Hit enrage and killed him 15 seconds into it, but all he does is a bit more damage.

[Radalek]

First 4 bosses are on T11 level, maybe a bit easier, although Spirit Kings have serious hard mode potential. But like poster above said Elegon is harder than any normal T11 fight and it's not even close.

---------- Post added 2012-10-03 at 09:45 PM ----------

25 man T11 was easier than 10 man T11. MUCH easier. Every single fight.

---------- Post added 2012-10-03 at 08:16 PM ----------



I'm pretty sure he was replying about the relative difficulty of 10 and 25. You were completely wrong about 10 man being easier, it was dramatically more challenging. Much less room for error, much stricter group compositions, etc.

This is absolutely not true. I did T11 on heroic, both 10 and 25. Started of with 10 when FEW fights were vastly overtuned and basically bugged. Namely Maloriak, Magmaw, Valiona. It lasted few weeks and then they fixed it and after fix those fights were a joke on 10 man. Rest of the fights were more or less the same for both sizes with exception of Al'akir hc, Nef hc and mostly Council hc which were far far harder on 25. If you repeat again that "every single T11 fight" was easier on 25 to people who did Council 25 HC they will laugh at you.

[Raxxed]

Dramatically easier than T11 until Elegon.

We lolmoded the raid and got oceanic 1st Garajal/Spirit kings - then got cockblocked where the other 2500 people are - Elegon.

Raid ended, log back on in the morning and see the only 2 new US guilds to down Elegon were from Oceanic realms.. bastards.

Altering up the strat tonight with a largely different makeup. I expect to have it down in under an hour.

Elegons dps check is brutal.
There was nothing that intensive in T11