[Megathread] Star Citizen

[thyNoobthyPrey]

Who here is bashing other than a couple of people?

Hate to tell you but bashing the game is just as bad as blindly defending a game. Critique is needed. Don't pretend that some of the critique presented in this forum is "bashing" because that's just grasping at straws.

So both sides are rancid. People bashing a game without fair critique are just as bad as those defending awful practices put into the game and like the game is the greatest gift to mankind.

Right now those people are acting like this game is already out when it's just a really early Alpha build. Praising it and acting like it's Game of the Year 2017 although ironically the game isn't fully out yet so it couldn't even get that award.

They are defending it because you have to admit, there have been some detractors that don't exactly have benign intentions for the project and rub their hands together in glee at thought of the project failing. So when it looks like people are just looking for any old excuse to bash the game, since alot of their original claims have been proven to be nonsense, you're going to get thrown into that camp by default. It's probably best to see how the game turns out or at least wait until closer to release if you haven't already thrown your hat into the ring by buying into the project yourself. You have to see how their monitization model fits within the context of the game before judging it, and like other posters have mentioned, the huge scope of Star Citizen puts it in a different category than say Overwatch or Battlefront II. Personally I think at CIG should adopt a subscription and currency token model like WoW for the MMO side of things and not try to rely on microtransactions to support the game but we will have to wait and see.

[thyNoobthyPrey]

And no it should really not go for a sub model. A modern sub game is a recipe for failure. Name me 2 big games outside of WoW and FF14 that use a sub by default.

Big games is the keyword, a game can only succeed with a subscription model if it reaches critical mass, and I do believe Star Citizen has a good shot at reaching that point. There are other benefits to having a subscription model like keeping out the riff-raff, multiplayer community based games that are too affordable for everyone really do have extremely toxic communities.

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I disagree.

The game has been delayed consistently, managed poorly, the guy incharge hasn't got the best track record other than 1 good game among other things.

Considering the pedigree of the developers working on the game, if the game is taking this long to make then that's how long it needs, it was going to take that long anyway. I will say that I don't like how they promised release dates that were then delayed, I think they shouldn't have given dates at all except for within a much smaller time frame, but then again announcing release dates is a good way to get the attention of the media.

'1 good game among other things' isn't really fair way to describe the achievements of Chris Roberts, more like 22 releases including expansions, with a lot more than 1 good game in there that's for sure. Not to mention the ten movies that were released that he produced. Talk about misrepresenting someone, jesus.

[thyNoobthyPrey]

And no it should really not go for a sub model. A modern sub game is a recipe for failure. Name me 2 big games outside of WoW and FF14 that use a sub by default.

Big games is the keyword, a game can only succeed with a subscription model if it reaches critical mass, and I do believe Star Citizen has a good shot at reaching that point. There are other benefits to having a subscription model like keeping out the riff-raff, multiplayer community based games that are too affordable for everyone really do have extremely toxic communities.

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I disagree.

The game has been delayed consistently, managed poorly, the guy incharge hasn't got the best track record other than 1 good game among other things.

I agree that they should have handled the release date annoucement thing a bit better, a lot better actually, they should never have given any release dates until it was obvious they would have something to release.

Now, considering the pedigree of the developers working on the game, Star Citizen is simply taking as long as it needs to get where it wants to be, nothing is going to speed up development when you already have some of the best guys in the business working on your game. And as for Chris Roberts who has 22 video game release under his belt with more than one good game in there, that's for sure. Not to mention the ten movies he's produced. I think you're misrepresenting him unfairly to be honest.

[Kazgrel]

I've a coworker who's obsessed with this game, but soon as the convo brings up things like his organization purchasing ships to the tune of several hundred USD, my face contorts into a meme-like "dafuq?" expression. Given what I know of the game from him, I've taken to the moniker Scam Citizen. I think it's fair, honestly; the game isn't even a live release (still an "alpha") yet sporting all sorts of "preorder bonuses" that are no more than cash shop items for a game that isn't even officially released.

While I think my opinion of the game is a little unfair due to the info I have being through someone else (although said someone else is very much a fanboy of the game), it is what it is, and until the game is an actual release in 2037, I'll remain very skeptical, and they (the devs) will remain far from my wallet.

[thyNoobthyPrey]

I disagree.

The game has been delayed consistently, managed poorly and the guy incharge hasn't got the best track record other than 1 good game among other things.

The game is open to fair criticism. Throwing microtransactions in during the Alpha phase is greedy and cash grabby.

And no it should really not go for a sub model. A modern sub game is a recipe for failure. Name me 2 big games outside of WoW and FF14 that use a sub by default.

The sub model works when a game reaches critical mass in popularity like the two you mentioned. I think Star Citizen certainly has potentional to be critically successfully.

As for Chris Roberts track record.... 22 video game releases not including Star Citizen and producer of ten movies that have cast people like Nicolas Cage and Morgan Freeman. Yeah terrible track record, what an absolute failure. Hope you're going to share your brilliant achievements if you think that isn't the best track record as you say.

[Jastall]

I mean, they are selling, ships, weapons, components, in-game currency… what do they consider “pay to win” then?

Hey now, you might able to get these same ships four years from now, when the game releases, after 50 hours of grinding, so clearly the fact that you can just open your wallet and get it for 200$ right now means it is not pay to win!




/s.

[masterhorus8]

Fuck...

I'm really not happy about this at all.

CIG is selling land claims/plots.

:\

[Miyani]

Anyway, I highly doubt that SC would survive long as p2p game, MMORPG is a far more popular genre and besides WoW & FF14 that have insanely large and loyal fan-bases they have all been forced to drop it, even Star Wars that is based in one of the most popular franchises ever.

Slight correction as an FF14 player, it is still a subbed game and not free to play.

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[masterhorus8]

So it seems that it's not quite what it seems right off the bat, but still not happy about it.
These licences seem to be something that you buy right now that will let you claim the land on release, fly out to it and pick your own spot. Not necessarily selling a specific plot of land right now and it is yours on release.

[Miyani]

Would be awefully nice if people watched the actual video about the land claim before dismissing everything and making negative comments on it without knowing jack shit about it.

[masterhorus8]

Would be awefully nice if people watched the actual video about the land claim before dismissing everything and making negative comments on it without knowing jack shit about it.

So, in the end, all this is doing is letting people start with these claims tickets instead of having to go to a specific NPC to then spend in-game money on one.

This seems to be an easy way to effectively bypass the in-game currency limit that @Myobi was mentioning with the Voyager Direct. It could have been done previously with the ships (not easily liquidatable) or weapons (not really meaningful because they're standard stock weapons), but these land plots seems pretty easy to deal with (relatively).

EDIT: Also, regarding watching the actual video bit, first impressions are important. Without reading into it too heavily, it sure as hell looks like CIG is flat out selling the land, as opposed to the nuances around it all. There is too much information about this game.

[JCD000]

SC fanboy here, just my 2 cents, not that it matters much but...

I don't really like crowdfunding but this is one of the biggest ever and it's a video game set in space, which I like so I thought why not. I've also always wanted a well made open world sci-fi MMOFPS since speculation on what Titan was back in the day. Destiny feels too much like Halo which I'm not too fond of and it's not open world (supposedly Bungie wanted it to be more ambitious like SC but publisher deadlines killed that). I also really like Cryengine so this puts it above the other space games with planet landings for me.

As for the criticism on this site, I'm not really surprised considering the ToA thread on here which probably negatively influences the opinion of some on crowdfunding, and probably other experiences like Mighty No. 9 (and also the fact that there's an opinion for everything and lots of thrashing on this site); in fact I heard about NMS first, while it was in dev, so when I heard SC was a crowdfunded game I initially didn't want anything to do with it. I got bored one day and by luck looked it up on a free fly weekend, it was definitely an alpha game but I could immediately see the potential. Will it live up to all the things they've said maybe not, but in the last two years you can definitely see an actual direction for what they are making the game into. Might still take a while but if there has to be one game that takes the time without publisher oversight then I want this to be it.

It's been 5 years in dev but they started from scratch in a basement and grew to a team of 350+ with 5 studios across the world, with original Cryengine devs, the guy who designed the Ironman 3 suits, and a bunch others. A video game definitely will be made. Even on this site people complain all the time about publishers and games like ME:A, which started dev around the same time and seemed unfinished.

As for the ship sales, whatever. The game wouldn't be made at all without them, and those who spend that money can do whatever they want. I've spent $500 in small purchases here and there.

[Miyani]

So, in the end, all this is doing is letting people start with these claims tickets instead of having to go to a specific NPC to then spend in-game money on one.

This seems to be an easy way to effectively bypass the in-game currency limit that @Myobi was mentioning with the Voyager Direct. It could have been done previously with the ships (not easily liquidatable) or weapons (not really meaningful because they're standard stock weapons), but these land plots seems pretty easy to deal with (relatively).

EDIT: Also, regarding watching the actual video bit, first impressions are important. Without reading into it too heavily, it sure as hell looks like CIG is flat out selling the land, as opposed to the nuances around it all. There is too much information about this game.

Simple answer right now is who knows, nothing is currently set in stone. In the end it is only worth as much as someone else is willing to pay. With the sheer volume of land on a planet and the amount of moons/planets/asteroids they will add in game, people may not even want to ever pay someone for the land and so they would make no money from it what so ever. 30:25mins in Lando even says if all current 1.9 million citizens got a claim license today they would all fit on a single planet with half the planet still to spare.

[masterhorus8]

Oh boy… what exactly are players able to do with them?

Full Q&A is here.

What is a claim license?
A claim license entitles the holder to claim ownership of a small section of land on a planet, moon, or asteroid controlled by the UEE.

What is a claim beacon?
A claim beacon is a staff-shaped piece of hardware used in conjunction with a claim license to procure a section of land. Upon insertion into the ground the beacon will activate and a small memory module near the tip will be encoded with the precise coordinates of the area. The module can then be detached and taken to a UEE Planetary Development office in order to execute a claim license on the designated property, assuming the property hasn’t already been purchased by another. Beacons also serve as remote monitoring stations, capable of transmitting real-time weather information and motion detection alerts to the owner, with the latter particularly useful in helping to determine if someone may be seeking to exploit your property without your permission.

Does a claim license grant give me a specific parcel of land?
No. A claim license enables you to choose the location of your parcel from billions of square kilometers of public land designated for private ownership specifically within UEE space.

How do I earn a claim license in the ‘Verse?
Claim licenses can be purchased directly from the UEE or second-hand from another player.

What can I do with my claim license?
Once a suitable section of land has been identified, a claim license may be executed at any UEE land management office in order to transfer ownership of the land from the UEE to the license holder.

These were the more important bits. The second to last part in the quote above being relevant to our previous discussion.

[Miyani]

roflmao, CogsNCocks, you need a new hobby mate.




Erm… I know, that’s exactly what I said:

"besides WoW & FF14"




Oh boy… what exactly are players able to do with them?

My bad guess i miss read with my dyslexia.

Watch the ATV it tells you what you can do with the land claims and how they work.


On another note, the mustangs were always my least favourite looking ships in game but damn the rework looks nice >< much nicer than the old model.

Also so much land available everyone can have a land claim and would still have a stupid amount available for people that join the game at a later date, not that the claim will even be available to use till it goes live. Now as a person who owns a house in ff14 i can tell you about a game that does a really shitty job at personal housing/property. They added just enough houses that not even 10% of the player base can have one, i had to transfer to a brand new server just to grab one when there was one available. On that game it caused such a shit storm that next upcoming patch they are having to add in more properties and come up with a solution to housing after majorly angering the player base.
All because square enix wanted to purposely make housing a hard to acquire/limited resource in game for unkown reason.

[masterhorus8]

2 x 8x8
or
4 x 4x4?

I think im going with 4x4 so i ll have small bases reverywhere on the verse and stock my ships there idk.

The 8x8 is 4x as much land as the 4x4, while only costing 2x as much.

[Miyani]

What is a claim license?
A claim license entitles the holder to claim ownership of a small section of land on a planet, moon, or asteroid controlled by the UEE.

What is a claim beacon?
A claim beacon is a staff-shaped piece of hardware used in conjunction with a claim license to procure a section of land. Upon insertion into the ground the beacon will activate and a small memory module near the tip will be encoded with the precise coordinates of the area. The module can then be detached and taken to a UEE Planetary Development office in order to execute a claim license on the designated property, assuming the property hasn’t already been purchased by another. Beacons also serve as remote monitoring stations, capable of transmitting real-time weather information and motion detection alerts to the owner, with the latter particularly useful in helping to determine if someone may be seeking to exploit your property without your permission.

Will I have an advantage over other players if I buy a claim license now?
No. Licenses can be bought for UEC in game and no one will be able to claim land before the mechanic is available in game for all. People that own claim licenses now, during the anniversary sale to support development, and people that earn the money in-game to buy one will be on equal footing assuming they have enough UEC, especially as there will be millions of locations for people to explore and claim within the Universe over the life time of the game.


Will players claiming the “best” plots of land on day one be an issue?
No. Due to the billions of square kilometres of available land over many planets and moons and of course as new Star Systems are introduced and explored, all players will have the ability to find and claim new “hot spots” throughout the lifetime of the game. Also, every player can have their own reason for what could be the ‘best’ piece of land, while some may judge a plot of land based on the type and quantity of natural resources that it contains, others might be looking for proximity to trade routes, and others could simply look for a quiet spot with a beautiful vista. This – combined with the fact that there’s an enormous amount of real estate available – means that prospecting and the purchase of land are two pieces of a supply-and-demand equation governing how rapidly land of a distinct perceived value will come on the market.

If someone destroys my beacon what happens to my claim on the land?
The destruction of a beacon is a criminal offense but has no impact on who holds legal title to the land. Because they provide a basic level of remote monitoring capability, though, owners may wish to replace any units that are rendered inoperative.

What differentiates the two types of Claim Licenses?
Claim licenses are available in two different sizes – Lots and Estates. A Lot equates to a patch of land roughly 4 Km x 4 Km in size, whereas an Estate is four times larger – 8 Km x 8 Km.

Does a claim license grant give me a specific parcel of land?
No. A claim license enables you to choose the location of your parcel from billions of square kilometers of public land designated for private ownership specifically within UEE space.

How do I scout for land?
Scouting for land is often a multi-step process, with the type and amount of analysis done usually dependent upon the intended purpose. One of the key factors considered is typically location, with different players weighting things like the proximity to other mining deposits, commercial production facilities, and retail outlets based upon their ultimate objective. The grade of the terrain should be considered, as the construction of an outpost requires a fairly even surface. Weather can have a dramatic impact on the commercial viability of an area of land, as frequent sandstorms, electrical storms, high winds, snow, and other environmental factors can significantly impede the potential of an area. Security is a common consideration, as piracy and theft are always a financial drag on those seeking to earn a lawful living. For most, though, the primary determinant as to the value of a parcel of land is what it contains above and below the surface. Obtaining an accurate assessment to this effect may require a considerable investment in terms of both time and money, and may involve taking core samples and having them analyzed, performing seismographic surveys, and other such scientific and engineering challenges.

Can I plant my beacon anywhere, or am I limited to specific areas?
Most of the real estate on planets, moons, and asteroids in UEE space that isn’t in active use or privately owned may be purchased. Some areas, however, have been designated as national parks, wildlife refuges, and nature preserves, and may not be claimed or legally exploited.

How do I earn a claim license in the ‘Verse?
Claim licenses can be purchased directly from the UEE or second-hand from another player.

What can I do with my claim license?
Once a suitable section of land has been identified, a claim license may be executed at any UEE land management office in order to transfer ownership of the land from the UEE to the license holder.

How do I place an outpost?
In order to place an outpost one must first be constructed. This is done within the workshop of a Pioneer and then placed directly onto the designated surface area. The complexity of the outpost will dictate the type and quantity of materials required, as well as the time to complete.

What options do I have for outpost layouts?
Outposts may consist of a number of different interconnected modules, each of which has a particular purpose. The owner may grant permission to access the available facilities to any individual or organization they wish. The habitation module enables authorized users to respawn at that location. The armory is a small arms storage locker, intended to ensure that any defenders of the establishment have sufficient firepower on hand to repel intruders. The refining module allows ore to be deposited for separation into its component elements and later retrieved, such that the required storage space will have been greatly reduced and the profit margin enhanced. The hydroponics module fosters the growth of various types of organic materials for periodic harvesting. Additional storage modules increase the quantity of raw ore, refined materials, organic products, and supplies that may be held at the outpost at a given time. Finally, the medical module provides basic medical services and equipment, and is sufficient to cure most diseases and patch most injuries.

Does every player need a claim license?
No. Land claims are only of benefit to those players who want UEE protection when constructing their own outpost, extracting value from an area’s natural resources, or financially speculate in the real estate market. If players decide to do this on unclaimed land then they do so without any rights to the land and any protection which comes with those rights.

Can I mine or otherwise exploit someone else’s land without permission?
Yes, although doing so is a serious crime and UEE security will respond if you are sighted. There’s a lot of real estate within a solar system and limited patrols, though, so property owners worried about the theft of their assets will often want to supplement public security forces with enhanced monitoring hardware and automated defense drones, hire their own dedicated mercenaries, or potentially join or negotiate a defense contract with a large organization.

Do I need to file a claim to build a base or mine?
No, you can freely build or mine planets and moons outside UEE controlled space but you’re on your own as far as security goes. It’s worth noting, too, that one of the largest deterrents to others moving in on a valuable section of land you’re working – or taking liberties with an outpost you’ve constructed – is the fact that within UEE space such actions are criminal and will have significant consequences for the infringers. These protections, of course, don’t exist beyond the borders.

Why is the UEE selling claim licenses?
The UEE sells claim licenses for the same reasons as any government – to raise revenue to fund public benefit programs, to liberalize its economy, to spur growth and tax revenue, and to fund the military campaign against the Vanduul.

[masterhorus8]

-snip-

On top of this, there is a limit of 10 claims that you can buy right now.

[Miyani]

Personally i wont go for one anyways since you still need to hire a pioneer, either player or npc to come build the base once you have the land. So kinda useless having the land on day one as you wont be able to do anything with it until you have saved up the money and enough resources to build on it.

If i was to get land then hmm... i think an asteroid sounds the most fun for a space game. One bordering right on the edge of UEE space to allow for travelling into unsecured space but giving you an option to quickly return to a safe port if you get into trouble without having to fly far further to a planet/moon/station.

[Majestic12]

At this point I'm starting to wonder if there's anything that CIG won't have sold that will be available in the game. They just keep expanding the store, all the time moving on to things that don't yet exist.