Trying to Tank Heroics.

[hiimjoe]

451 iLvl 380k HP

I pull mobs, and the incoming initial damage is often my worst enemy, seeing how i dont have Shuffle up quite yet and cant get into a rotation, and often have to swap around my beginning rotation to stay alive.

Typically i pull with Haze to apply the debuff, then Keg Smash, Jade Wind for stagger, and Keg>Kick>Jab>Tiger (as fillers) and Guard when 3 stax top priority. That is assuming it is an easy pull for me.

Harder ones im forced to forgo an early Shuffle for an early 0stack Guard and try to climb my way up to safety from half health, its scary, and messes with my rotation and my psyche.

AoE pulls, I Haze, Keg Smash, Wind, Crane, Crane, Fire/Kick/Guard depending on my health dropping.


Is there a stat i should srsly reforge to to prevent that early burst? Dont say "read guides" because i have, i understand how to tank, its just hard for me to recover from a rough start, bosses are no problem for me, its all the big trash packs that hammer my butt into oblivion and is concerning me, its bad morale for everyone. HALP ME!


http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Pingai/simple

[fizzbob]

your armory would be a good start

pull, jab, guard then get shuffle up

you'll probably have a spot where shuffle is about to drop, just use elusive brew as a filler there

you're really just the 4th dps in heroics, if you start dropping hard, roll the fuck away and recover

don't forget to wipe your dot when it's up over 75k

[myumsa]

Use Crowd Control on bigger pulls?

[TEHPALLYTANK]

Get a better healer. You can use expel harm out of combat to build chi if you're having an issue with initial chi.

[hiimjoe]

your armory would be a good start

pull, jab, guard then get shuffle up

you'll probably have a spot where shuffle is about to drop, just use elusive brew as a filler there

you're really just the 4th dps in heroics, if you start dropping hard, roll the fuck away and recover

don't forget to wipe your dot when it's up over 75k

yea im pretty good about rolling away, its just super annoying, im used to tanking in Cata as a warrior, and it wasnt ever like monk tanking, im pretty decent as clearing stagger, like i said, its just the initial pull that drops me, but i always held off on guard for the enhanced guard, so maybe thats it, ill try some more tomorrow, and i was also using chi brew, which i just realized might be a big factor since im missing out on 1 chi early on.

[Ergar]

Yeah the initial damage is my worst enemy atm too. What i usually do is roll in and immediatly hit leg sweep so they are stunned for a good time and then i just start doing my rotation.

[hiimjoe]

yea i just didnt want to get in the mindset i needed to blow cooldowns for every pull, my buddy is a healer (i havent played with him) and he says other monks hes healed havent had problems like im having, but it could just be im undergeared, which is possible, but its frustrating for me cause i have no idea whats goin on once my life hits 40% in the first seconds of a fight

[Zues]

Not totally sure how, but our protadin has 140k more hp than you. I think you have 30k more HP than my resto shaman. This is not good :P

[Raidenwins]

Hiimjoe, what I've found to be really effective is picking the furthest enemy in the group and using clash. It usually stuns all or most of the enemies in the group, giving you time to keg smash > RJW / BOK for shuffle. Then you can do a leg sweep which will give you enough time to get a tiger palm buffed guard up. I would avoid using breath of fire as it does nothing for your survivability. Save the Chi for shuffle uptime and purifying.

Also, your stat priority should be Hit(7.5%)= Exp(15%)> haste> crit> mastery> stam. Actually hitting the target is really important for a Brewmaster for building Chi, Gift of the Ox orbs, and Building stacks of Elusive Brew. Brewmasters generally will have lower health than most tanks as it is pretty low priority for them.

[Gallahadd]

Leg Sweep is your best friend ever.

Any pull of 3+ I usually start Keg>Kick>Leg Sweep. The stun is god tier and gives you enough time to get your stacks up for a full guard shortly after they're back and wailing on you.

Also consider picking up the Breath of Fire glyph, it's surprisingly good, even if it only stuns the mobs for one second, that's still ALOT of attacks that wont be landing on you, in an AoE situation.

and your health is fine, I've got 20k LESS than you, and I've succesfully tanked every single heroic with my GF healing on her average geared Resto Drood and have no trouble (except Armsmaster Harlan that dude is a flat out RAPIST).

[Vargarii]

Leg Sweep is your best friend ever.

Any pull of 3+ I usually start Keg>Kick>Leg Sweep. The stun is god tier and gives you enough time to get your stacks up for a full guard shortly after they're back and wailing on you.

Also consider picking up the Breath of Fire glyph, it's surprisingly good, even if it only stuns the mobs for one second, that's still ALOT of attacks that wont be landing on you, in an AoE situation.

and your health is fine, I've got 20k LESS than you, and I've succesfully tanked every single heroic with my GF healing on her average geared Resto Drood and have no trouble (except Armsmaster Harlan that dude is a flat out RAPIST).

I do something similar on big pulls. I pull with toss, move in and keg smash, breath of fire, leg sweep(I save it because overzealous dps will break BoF anyway) jab, bk, then get guard up. I don't face a whole lot of damage with that, and it's pretty smooth. The cc from BoF and sweep go off so quickly, I don't really take any damage even though I didn't get shuffle up quickly.

---------- Post added 2012-10-16 at 04:11 AM ----------

Not totally sure how, but our protadin has 140k more hp than you. I think you have 30k more HP than my resto shaman. This is not good :P

His health is reasonable for the gear area he's in, your comment here is useless.

[arisoh]

I do something similar on big pulls. I pull with toss, move in and keg smash, breath of fire, leg sweep(I save it because overzealous dps will break BoF anyway) jab, bk, then get guard up. I don't face a whole lot of damage with that, and it's pretty smooth. The cc from BoF and sweep go off so quickly, I don't really take any damage even though I didn't get shuffle up quickly.

Forget the BoF. The chi is better spent elsewhere.

Personally, if it's 4+ mobs, I DH, Clash to a caster, KS, BoK, Power Strike Jab for 2 Chi, Guard, Leg Sweep, SCK, KS, BoK, etc etc.

If I know it's going to be a big, rough pull at the start, I'm using Guard w/o TP stacks anyway. It will still buy you time. Or hell, you can always open with a Dampen Harm (never done this personally) before your usual rotation, if you feel that shaky.

[Archimedic]

Not totally sure how, but our protadin has 140k more hp than you. I think you have 30k more HP than my resto shaman. This is not good :P

You're comparing apples and orangutans...Monks don't gear for stamina, it is almost the lowest priority stat.

[ClimacticGaming]

You're comparing apples and orangutans...Monks don't gear for stamina, it is almost the lowest priority stat.

From other threads it has been debated to gear stam first until you reach a 'comfortable' level...meaning the healer can get a 1-2 second window of not really healing you and you're still doing ok. THEN...go for normal stat priorities.

Just saying...

[Arkenaw]

As a healer, I noticed brewmasters take MASSIVE initial damage. It really surprised me the first few times and almost lead to some deaths, but after a while I got used to it and prepared before the pull.

[casually]

run in.. kegsmash.. legsweep.. jab.. tiger palmx3 bof once.. kegsmash again.. BoK.. repeat.

basically this nets u a ton of dps.. RJW is nice but its useless if u dont have shuffle up to SCK freely.

[Vargarii]

Forget the BoF. The chi is better spent elsewhere.

Personally, if it's 4+ mobs, I DH, Clash to a caster, KS, BoK, Power Strike Jab for 2 Chi, Guard, Leg Sweep, SCK, KS, BoK, etc etc.

If I know it's going to be a big, rough pull at the start, I'm using Guard w/o TP stacks anyway. It will still buy you time. Or hell, you can always open with a Dampen Harm (never done this personally) before your usual rotation, if you feel that shaky.

I'll just agree to disagree on that one. I have no issues with chi, damage taken, or anything by using the BoF. Since I run with my own heals and move quickly, I usually get 2 seconds (except for my target since I have to jab) of it on the mobs, and so for the first 7 seconds or so, I'm taking almost no damage, and easily get everything in order before I start taking hits from all the mobs.

---------- Post added 2012-10-16 at 05:52 AM ----------

RJW is nice but its useless if u dont have shuffle up to SCK freely.

This doesn't make sense. RJW applies shuffle, so it would be up to SCK.

[Asmalya]

Learn how to use your charge.
Really. Learn it.
Position yourself so that you charge the target that has the best chance on stunning the whole group.
Its not that hard and it gives you so much breath to get your buffs up.
If you have the aoe stun talented you can add even more seconds of absolut no damage.

[lordjust]

yea im pretty good about rolling away, its just super annoying, im used to tanking in Cata as a warrior, and it wasnt ever like monk tanking, im pretty decent as clearing stagger, like i said, its just the initial pull that drops me, but i always held off on guard for the enhanced guard, so maybe thats it, ill try some more tomorrow, and i was also using chi brew, which i just realized might be a big factor since im missing out on 1 chi early on.

Use guard as early as possible. Even when it's up your tigerpalm stacks will increase the amount of damage it absorbs even if it won't absorb the amount of the enhanced version. Guard and shuffel are your most important skills and both should be on CD. I did the same mistake when tanking because I thought without the extra boost in guard it isn't good enough but that's wrong. When you pull and immediately cast guard it will absorb the initial damage and when you use tigerpalm as a filler your guard will have a little longer uptime. Instead of losing half your health you will lose maybe only a quarter or even less because you gain time to get our shuffel up and use other skills like leg sweep or kite them and so on.

Also you could use CCs before pulling and your healer should keep an eye on debuffs on you and you should have an eye on bleeding effects because in my experience these things are very dangerous for a monk because we have about 100k less life than the other tanks (sitting at 381k unbuffed).

In addition using chi brew (4 chi every 90 seconds) on CD gives less chi than using power strikes (4 chi every 80 seconds). Furthermore you should try to cap your hit and expertise because when you miss with your jab or keg smash you won't get chi. Also I would take chiburst instead of zensphere because it's a stronger healing and will also heal all the melees at the mob and invoke Xuen scales better with AP and is a better DPS CD than rushing jade wind and it will tank one mob for the time it's active (it can't die while active) so less damage for you).

Also I don't know if it's a good idea to use PVP items, no enchants and no professions.

You're comparing apples and orangutans...Monks don't gear for stamina, it is almost the lowest priority stat.

I wouldn't say that. Your healer will thank you when you have some more HP because when you do some mistakes you're squishy and will take a lot of damage. More HP means more time for your healer to react and fortifying brew scales with your HP. Also all guides say for the first tier of raids you should exclusively gem and enchant for stamina so that you're able to take some of the bigger hits.

[casually]

This doesn't make sense. RJW applies shuffle, so it would be up to SCK.

was tired when i wrote that. what i meant to say is if u dont have guard or a decent duration of shuffle up spamming SCK wont be very effective.. its true rjw generates shuffle too but just be careful not to ignore kegsmash as well.