Maybe a Shadow Discovery ? ..

[Aica]

The statement that Drye is making is that competition is fiercer at the 25 man level, since he believes that is the raid type where the majority of the best players are deciding to play in.

[Drye]

It's harder to deal damage in 25m because the adds live shorter? you don't really believe that?
Why should there be no competition between players in 10m? You know, there is more than one damage dealer in 10m, too!
And that 25m is the competition in high level is just well known by the 25m raiders who can't see beyond their own nose.
But I will stop posting here. I have had so many 10m vs 25m discussions that I learned one thing: 25m raiders are either to dumb to see that their "arguments" are shit or they just don't want to see the truth.
So just go on living in your own little world, where you can tell yourself that you suck in raiding just because 25m is so much harder...

So salty it makes me laugh, but that isn't at all what I'm saying. For some reason you are incapable of reading and understanding what I say. I'm not arguing which is harder, I'm arguing the mentality and skill level between players as to his rank. Which is what the original topic was created about. I already commented on how and why he is gemed/reforged the way he is.

[Yvaelle]

The statement that Drye is making is that competition is fiercer at the 25 man level, since he believes that is the raid type where the majority of the best players are deciding to play in.

Except Paragon, who are 10m and world first

[Frmercury]

Except Paragon, who are 10m and world first

You mean that historically 25 person raiding guild who switched to doing 10s because they're easier?

Oh yeah, that Paragon.

I see your point now. You are correct. Paragon is the example that proves the assertion.

/hides from 10 v 25 argument

Just a btw there's a great B&C thread going on now about it.

[Yvaelle]

Sorry, B&C? Acronym is slipping my mind.

Paragon went 10m because they didn't have enough good players for 25m and didn't want to become a semi-hardcore guild - they wanted to keep doing world firsts, but could only do it in 10m. Also the cockblock boss of this tier Elegon is apparently easier in 25m than 10m, and the dps requirement for heroic garajal is lower in 25m per player than in 10m (where in 10m, its so tight its apparently more of a block than heroic elegon).

As a general rule, 25m's have historically been harder than 10m's - currently that's not quite the case - and I think it's Blizzard's intention for this tier. On their Asian servers they are planning to try out the WotLK raiding model this tier of 10m and 25m on seperate lockouts, and new higher item levels for a new higher difficulty exclusive to 25m - so there has to be some room to make 25m harder than it is currently if they're going to play with that (though they've talked about it for awhile and there is some speculation they are going to put it off for another tier now).

[Frmercury]

Sorry, B&C? Acronym is slipping my mind.

B!^%# and Complain.

[Arlee]

So let's steer this conversation away from debates about if 25 or 10 mans are better/harder. It's really pretty pointless and just usually leads to a lot of people getting infracted for flaming and trolling and it really isn't the point of this thread anyways

[Frmercury]

Sorry! I blame Yvaelle.

Bad Yvaelle.


Similar to all secondary stat discussions the only real way to get the right answer for YOU is to Sim yourself. Here's a nice how to:
http://howtopriest.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=1760#p13477

[lwalker8]

Similar to all secondary stat discussions the only real way to get the right answer for YOU is to Sim yourself. Here's a nice how to:
http://howtopriest.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=1760#p13477

I think the real point of this thread was that simming yourself is in fact not the surefire way to get the best stats for yourself. It never has been. It's a helpful way for someone to see what a program (programmed by theorycrafters) assumes is the best way for you to gear yourself based on the fight setting you/they input. Don't get me wrong, sims are extremely beneficial, but I think they are taken as fact by too much of the community, when they are nothing of the sort. They are based on a number of things and especially at early points in an expansion, can be flat out wrong.

Real raid testing by thousands of players is the only way to start to understand what works well and doesn't work well.

But to the point made by others, secondary stats are never going to make or break your DPS. Haste breakpoints are certainly important, but whether you are specced heavily into crit or mastery won't make a whole lot of an impact - as they are fairly close.

[Aica]

I think the real point of this thread was that simming yourself is in fact not the surefire way to get the best stats for yourself. It never has been. It's a helpful way for someone to see what a program (programmed by theorycrafters) assumes is the best way for you to gear yourself based on the fight setting you/they input. Don't get me wrong, sims are extremely beneficial, but I think they are taken as fact by too much of the community, when they are nothing of the sort. They are based on a number of things and especially at early points in an expansion, can be flat out wrong.

Real raid testing by thousands of players is the only way to start to understand what works well and doesn't work well.

But to the point made by others, secondary stats are never going to make or break your DPS. Haste breakpoints are certainly important, but whether you are specced heavily into crit or mastery won't make a whole lot of an impact - as they are fairly close.

Sorry, I think the real point of this thread is that ilevel > all when it comes to gearing decisions.

[ircien]

we really need to know another priest from envy FULL MASTERY

---------- Post added 2012-10-28 at 01:42 PM ----------

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...inger/advanced

[Keosen]

Yeah he probably was checking this thread i guess and making some testing.
If he manage to even rank with this amount of haste then haste is useless for Shadowpriests, seriously.
It will be something like iLvl > intellect > Spellpower > hit/spirit -> Mastery -> Crit -> Haste
Where is our Russian friend by the way did their logs went private?

[ircien]

Our friend is the world second best dps on elegon .. in 10 HC .
http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/...legon/10H/dps/

Антэл
Karfagen EU-Пиратская бухта this is a sick bitch

[tiporispit]

Someone being clever and not following website sims to do all the gearing thinking for them. That never happens!

A single log or two doesn't prove anything. Maybe he had a perfect storm of procs. Nothing to see here.

[ircien]

and new logs HC ? luck too ? plz stfu .

[Frmercury]

and new logs HC ? luck too ? plz stfu .

Compelling argument.

[Sipep]

and new logs HC ? luck too ? plz stfu .

Need more information than 1 persons logs. Number 1 elegon is doing haste > crit > mastery. Did 6k more dps, while having 487 ilvl compared to Антэл 493. Based on this small information its Crit > mastery.

[Deleted]

and new logs HC ? luck too ? plz stfu .

None of his first logs were impressive. He got to AoE four times on Feng. He did low damage on Gara'jal given the circumstances.

[khuur]

When he did those fights he was 482ish, not 493 like he is now. He has gotten some more gear since then. Some of his parses are lackluster for even 482. Although, at 474 I'd like that dps ;P

[ThrashMetalFtw]

we really need to know another priest from envy FULL MASTERY

He is trolling and/or testing stuff for fun. Nothing to see here, move along. Haste > Crit > Mastery.