So alliance win the war?

[Deleted]

Yes don't care how you spin it, The Horde loose. The Horde will have to take out their own warchief and probably his top cronies some of The Hordes finest warriors and advisors, and the god damn Alliance is in their capital city and the ensuing battle will wreck it. Yes The Horde loose, the death of your leader (even to the rebels he is still their legitimate warchief, horde players well technically be committing high treason) and having your sworn enemy in your country, in your capital city is infact a military defeat. This is from a Horde fanboi.

[Trassk]

Yes don't care how you spin it, The Horde loose. The Horde will have to take out their own warchief and probably his top cronies some of The Hordes finest warriors and advisors, and the god damn Alliance is in their capital city and the ensuing battle will wreck it. Yes The Horde loose, the death of your leader (even to the rebels he is still their legitimate warchief, horde players well technically be committing high treason) and having your sworn enemy in your country, in your capital city is infact a military defeat. This is from a Horde fanboi.

If your a horde fanboy then you don't understand horde lore for this claim. If you did, you would know that the horde do not work in terms of choosing a leader in the same regards as the alliance do. The one who kills there current warchief is able to make claim to the mantle of warchief, and the horde right away gains a new leader.
So it is far from the horde losing, the horde is winning because it gains a better leader then the current asshat.

[Faroth]

How is this fair? Horde are always losing wars.

I bet when the Alliance was getting kicked and beaten and losing every battle introduced in game you were one saying it was totally balanced and Alliance were whiners, weren't you?

The Horde utterly decimated the Alliance in the First War.
The Alliance narrowly defeated the Horde thanks to essentially an internal civil war amongst the Horde.
The Third War they fought together.
Now the Alliance AND The Horde will lay siege to Orgrimmar to bring down Garrosh.

How is this "the Horde always loses" exactly?

[Rend Blackhand]

They don't 'win' really. Orgrimmar still exists afterwards. However I'm fairly confident that whoever the new Warchief may be, they'll try to end the war with a peace treaty that certainly won't be in the Horde's favour.

[eodusaf]

The Horde utterly decimated the Alliance in the First War.

The Alliance didnt exist in the first war, it was only the kingdom of azeroth (stormwind), no dwarves, gnomes, elves, or other human nations

[Faroth]

I suppose that's true, eodusaf, but if we take that approach, there was no Horde. No trolls, tauren, etc. Just orcs.

I don't think we can just claim the First War "doesn't count" just because it was orcs vs humans.

[Rend Blackhand]

I suppose that's true, eodusaf, but if we take that approach, there was no Horde. No trolls, tauren, etc. Just orcs.

I don't think we can just claim the First War "doesn't count" just because it was orcs vs humans.

The thing is, the Horde did exist. The Orcs have always been the Horde since Warcraft 1 and other races have joined and left since then but the political faction has essentally been the same.

[Sesto]

While they don't really "win the war", hopefully most Alliance players will believe they do so they stop bitching about Blizzard favouring the Horde.

[Deleted]

Yes don't care how you spin it, The Horde loose. The Horde will have to take out their own warchief and probably his top cronies some of The Hordes finest warriors and advisors, and the god damn Alliance is in their capital city and the ensuing battle will wreck it. Yes The Horde loose, the death of your leader (even to the rebels he is still their legitimate warchief, horde players well technically be committing high treason) and having your sworn enemy in your country, in your capital city is infact a military defeat. This is from a Horde fanboi.

Your entire argument is undone with the statement "their own warcheif". He is not my warcheif and for a great deal of dissenters within the Horde, including racial leaders, he is not their warcheif either, not in the sense of what being a warcheif truly means. He does not command respect, he does not command honour, integrity, or compassion. He rules by fear and bloodlust. As such, taking him down will not be a loss to us and instead a victory, except for those who see Garrosh through rose-tinted glasses.

[Faroth]

While they don't really "win the war", hopefully most Alliance players will believe they do so they stop bitching about Blizzard favouring the Horde.

It's never been about Alliance winning, it's been about a complete and utter lack of anything developing the faction whatsoever. Mists of Pandaria has heavily turned the tide and balanced things out.

The only problem I have is that the Horde side is still extremely interesting. This is a problem for me because it means I should...no, I NEED, to level more alts. XD

[Omgakitty]

Alliance always wins because we are always defending our land or getting revenge for some monstrosity the horde has done. We just have something thats more worth fighting for. Blizzard sees that and doesn't want to promote unnessicary violence as the best.

[Deleted]

The thread makes my historian part cry like a little baby...

Yes, the Alliance does win the war, the post-war doesn't have any affect on "winning or losing" a war. Fact, the capital of a faction will be sieged the enemy faction and the current regime will be overthrown (by rebels or not). That's a win in any history book.

[Trassk]

Blizzard has actually done a very brilliant thing here with mists.

They've managed to develop it so the alliance gets to have some sense of victory by the end when they attack orgrimmar.
They've managed to stage the rebellion against Garrosh people have been asking for some time now since he began warchief.
They've managed to do stuff at the start of mists so the blind Garrosh fanboys get to feel like there loser warchief is the boss and feel a deluded sense of pride.
And they've managed to develop all other racial leaders because of how this works.

so mists truly has something for everyone.

[razski]

No one "wins" in wars.

[Faroth]

so mists truly has something for everyone.

Except the gnomes.

(sorry, I couldn't resist) *snicker*

[Scummer]

We cannot say if they actually win the war yet as we're complete informed about the end. I feel what will happen as everybody else has mentioned it will be "The Alliance and Horde have defeated Garrosh and won their War". I don't think we will see anything as blunt as "Alliance beat the Horde and won the War".

[Trassk]

No one "wins" in wars.

You mean except when we beat the nazi's?

[Rend Blackhand]

Except the gnomes.

(sorry, I couldn't resist) *snicker*

And Goblins

[mvaliz]

When Garrosh gets dethroned does this mean the alliance wins?

How is this fair? Horde are always losing wars.

1) Blame Blizzard's piss-poor imagination and designing a 1-dimensional character to be the leader of the Horde.

2) This is not the "Alliance wins" situation as killing/dethroning Garrosh is also a victory for the Horde. The Horde simply wanted to co-exist in their way, and enjoy their lands their way. Garrosh was the one pushing forward with plans to occupy/conquer Kalimdor and to turn the Horde back into a ravenous pack of conquerers instead of honorable proud warriors who fight to protect their lands, to hunt, and to compete with their brothers to be the best... not for conquest or sheer bullying bloodlust.

3) Do you really think this is going to end after MoP? Are they just going to turn off all PVP battlegrounds after MoP? You know DAMN well they're just going to start the cycle all over again over the next few expansions...

[Scummer]

How is this fair? Horde are always losing wars.

The Horde really haven't lost since the Second War. They've gone from strength to strength after Thrall came to power. They stopped recklessly fighting and got it's shit together.

If you want to know the faction that the opposite has happened to then look at the Alliance, we're the faction that have lost the most wars/battles in recent years.
After the Second War the Alliance just began to crumble and lose support amongst it's allied kingdoms as they were either discontent with certain policies such as the Internment Camp Tax or were simply destroyed followed by other unfortunate events eg. Quel'thelas, Stromgarge, Gilneas, Dalaran and most importantly Lordaeron.