does this game have to be made even simpler for dps?

[Maelle]

To be fair there are a lot of very crappy tanks and healers in lfg too.

[Unholyground]

just did a normal shado-pan monastery last fight dps was, we all level 87 about so I didn't outgear anyone or anything.

me - 24.5k dps - 56% damage done
tank - -10k dps -
elemental shaman - 4.5k dps
destruction warlock -2.8k dps

as you can imagine it took ages, luckily we had a monk healer but was basically ooming big time

obviously people are leveling up but somehow still don't grasp how to do damage or anything, does more need to be explained by blizzard for noobs to wow?

I didn't say anything because I don't think it's up to me to tell people how to play their class but they can look forward to alot of /party kicks in future if they don't improve.

other people aren't as patient.

Don't feel bad, I might sound like a dick in this next sentence but, if someone is not performing to my standards in a dungeon I kick them and generally I am running with at least 2 friends so we always have our way with votes. We give warnings first telling them to stop riding off of our group and then if they don't bye bye. I am usually the tank and I am always doing about 25-50% of the damage depending on how much the other dps and whoever else is doing.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

It isn't? What is decent then? 50k? You count only AoE I guess.

Try playing a shadow priest and AoE in heroics. We are supposed to multidot but when mobs die in 10-15 seconds it's not really a good option to multidot. Even in ilvl 473 you can barely do 50k dps with mind sear on 5+ mobs.

People complaining about a level 90 doing 30k dps in a heroic clearly have no clue what they are talking about.

If you think 30k dps(single-target) is decent from anything other than a tank or healer at 90 you clearly don't know what decent dps is. I hate low dps in randoms because I want my vp without spending 30 minutes clearing Temple of the Jade Serpent. I'm not asking for everyone to pull 60k+, just some thing decent along the lines of 40k-50k. To me the low dps are the same as tanks who wait a full 60 seconds between pulls, they are there wasting my time. I respect people enough to not try and waste their time, however if they don't respect my time then I will treat them in a manner that is less than ideal because I have little tolerance for such behavior.

I find someone actively trying to harass me far less annoying than someone who just doesn't care enough to try. The former you can report and never deal with again, the latter you run into far more often.

[melodramocracy]

If you think 30k dps(single-target) is decent from anything other than a tank or healer at 90 you clearly don't know what decent dps is. I hate low dps in randoms because I want my vp without spending 30 minutes clearing Temple of the Jade Serpent.

Dear Blizzard, I know I complained about Cata 5 mans being hard, and you listened. But while these MoP dungeons are pants on head, they still take too long. I hate having to play with other folks, can you just send me vp in the mail?

[Fluttershy]

Back in the old days

>cast one spell every 3 seconds
>maybe a cooldown or 2

>rotate 2 dots then nuke
>no cooldown

>use your melee ability every 3-4 seconds



Nowadays

>rotate 7 short cooldown abilities with 3 main dps cooldowns

>do a 2 skill rotation wiht 500 procs popping up you have to press while having five 1 minute cooldowns

>cast 5 dots all with .3 second cast times while mashing your 1 second nuke




It's getting increasingly stupid blizzard is just adding 2 buttons to press and 25% less downtime for every expansion. BC-wotlk dpsing was probably it's best, cata went full ADHD, pandaria even worse.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

Dear Blizzard, I know I complained about Cata 5 mans being hard, and you listened. But while these MoP dungeons are pants on head, they still take too long. I hate having to play with other folks, can you just send me vp in the mail?

Way to take two sentences completely out of context.

[Idoru]

I'm not asking for everyone to pull 60k+, just some thing decent along the lines of 40k-50k.

Fine, since you are "asking" you must obviously have an answer for me. When the DPS spreadsheet shows 25K DPS (single target, fully buffed, optimal fight) for me, how the eff do you want me to do 40-50K ?

Please, enlighten me.

[Otimus]

It does not need to be simpler. What blizzard needs is a guide for when new players hit 90 to inform them of things like hit and expertise caps and macros. The majority of players don't use the forums or have never raided and therefore not aware of these things. You can always tell when a player knows his stat info or not pretty much immediately. I met a guy(a rogue) the other day who did not even know what reforging was. Which is blizzards fault. It's not like in game they mention anything like what the concept of stat weights are or that there even is a transmog/reforge guy and the purpose of it for new people that hit 90. They leave it to the players to totally figure out everything regarding stats themselves or rely on other players, and many get left behind. Leaving some stuff to the players is good, but necessary things to DPS like hit/expertise caps, the player should be informed of in game.

Exactly this. Almost no advanced mechanics in the game are explained at all, AT ALL. So anyone, except the hardcore, know a single damned thing about it. That's just sloppy, poor, archaic design. The whole thing with people not knowing what reforging is, is disturbingly common, and Blizzard probably doesn't even see it as an issue.

[DieFichte]

Fine, since you are "asking" you must obviously have an answer for me. When the DPS spreadsheet shows 25K DPS (single target, fully buffed, optimal fight) for me, how the eff do you want me to do 40-50K ?

Please, enlighten me.

Don't be so insulting, you shouldn't be running 5m heroics in gear lower than 475 ilevel, go do raids, so you are prepared for 5m heroics!

[Draahl]

It is also highly dependant on the class tbh. My ww monk with 480 ilvl does about 70-80k dps, while my DK with 450 ilvl does 80-100k dps(both single target ofc). Ofcourse some players are really bad but its alot about what type of class you are and how the fight are for you.

[Deleted]

That's why you que up with friends / guildies :P

[Danifilth]

Rather have blizzard make it easy than hard tired of grouping up with people in raids not able to do more than 80k dps. Its too complicated for a lot of users not just dps also the tanks and healers keeps getting worst when blizzard keeps changing things up on every patch

[Vayshan]

Yes, let's assume that all DPS are terrible at the game.

/roll eyes.

Did you read the first post? Yes, 2.8k and 4.5k dps is pretty terrible, it's even beyond noob.

---------- Post added 2012-11-03 at 12:38 PM ----------

Fine, since you are "asking" you must obviously have an answer for me. When the DPS spreadsheet shows 25K DPS (single target, fully buffed, optimal fight) for me, how the eff do you want me to do 40-50K ?

Please, enlighten me.

It's called doing research into your class and spec. In short, it honestly comes down to L2P. Or gear better if that's too low. Just because you can cue for heroics, doesn't mean you should if you can't pull the necessary weight it requires.

[Otimus]

Did you read the first post? Yes, 2.8k and 4.5k dps is pretty terrible, it's even beyond noob.

---------- Post added 2012-11-03 at 12:38 PM ----------

It's called doing research into your class and spec. In short, it honestly comes down to L2P. Or gear better if that's too low. Just because you can cue for heroics, doesn't mean you should if you can't pull the necessary weight it requires.

I'd argue that Blizzard does fuck all to try to help anyone learn anything. 7 years, and the best we have now is a tab in your skill list. That's all. Leveling no longer requires you to use your full abilities, and hasn't for years and years and years.

Seriously, what the hell do people expect to happen? Magic? Why is everyone afraid to blame Blizzard for doing a poor job on teaching people anything at all?

[Idoru]

It's called doing research into your class and spec. In short, it honestly comes down to L2P.

That's really cute. Do you know what "DPS spreadsheet" means ?
How can I beat the optimal DPS calculation, based on my actual gear, by "learning to play" ?

Or gear better if that's too low. Just because you can cue for heroics, doesn't mean you should if you can't pull the necessary weight it requires.

I got bitched at in a scenario.

[rt7]

damn this thread still going, must have rustled some jimmies

true I realize they must have not been pressing the button which was why it was that bad, but even on previous fights like sha of fear they were doing about 10-13k which is still pretty below average for being 87 and having 410+ ilvl.

still do any LFR and you'll see on every fight about 1/3 the dps still pulling 25kish or even below, this is with 460+ ilvl at lvl 90, so there is still obviously alot of people not having much clue on optimizing rotations.

maybe that's why not many people do regular raids they would hit enrage timers.

[Otimus]

damn this thread still going, must have rustled some jimmies

true I realize they must have not been pressing the button which was why it was that bad, but even on previous fights like sha of fear they were doing about 10-13k which is still pretty below average for being 87 and having 410+ ilvl.

still do any LFR and you'll see on every fight about 1/3 the dps still pulling 25kish or even below, this is with 460+ ilvl at lvl 90, so there is still obviously alot of people not having much clue on optimizing rotations.

maybe that's why not many people do regular raids they would hit enrage timers.

Most people don't do regular raids because you can't queue for them.

[Pickwickman]

Did you read the first post? Yes, 2.8k and 4.5k dps is pretty terrible, it's even beyond noob.

---------- Post added 2012-11-03 at 12:38 PM ----------

It's called doing research into your class and spec. In short, it honestly comes down to L2P. Or gear better if that's too low. Just because you can cue for heroics, doesn't mean you should if you can't pull the necessary weight it requires.

You think 50-60k dps is the norm for most single target classes? You really fucking overestimate the skill / gear of the average LFG'er.

Also, you're really ignorant if you seriously think that if a Spreadsheet tells you the max you can do is 25k dps that by l2p you can do 50k.



EDIT: I still don't understand all this ruckus about what the OP suggested. I still stand by my point that the OP went in as Tank, taking most of the leadership role unto himself, and now is complaining that people did fuck all damage on the last boss in Shado-Pan Monastery. I don't see an overall damage log from the entire instance, so I really am under the impression it's just 3 DPS, freshly dinged 87, never even seen the "ExtraActionButton1" mechanic in their lives, and then are doing that low DPS.

So, OP, stop being a Negative Nancy and educate the masses. Stop destroying what little community we have left.

Sincerely, your friendly neighbourhood LFR/LFD leader and Raidleader.

[Shiny212]

what the hell was the tank doing? he should crush everyone at that point

[Kevyne-Shandris]

Most people don't do regular raids because you can't queue for them.

Sum of it.

If they had normal/heroic raids LFR style, I'll be more inclined to heal.

Anything to get away from a typical raid on Shandris. It's bad. It's t-h-a-t bad.