Help with 10M Elegon Normal

[cadmia]

Hello -

I was hoping I could get some insight / help on our 10 man's progression on normal Elegon. We spent the entire evening wiping against him this evening. We have a 2 tank, 2 healer set up, with the Disc. Priest primarily responsible for the tanks and the Shaman (me) responsible for the raid.

We do continue to have deaths to silly things, like the floor falling out, but we also had some very heart breaking sub 10% wipes. Is there something fundamental we should be doing differently or is it just a matter of fine tuning and having everyone up their game?

It won't let me post the logs directly, but you can find our most recent logs at:
US Misha -> Oppression -> 11/11
WoL -> /reports/o8fhl480yb4vftps/

Thank you for any help!

[Deleted]

To start with you shouldent have any wipes becuse ppl are falling trough the floor. Can´t realy say much more seens your post dosent say much about your strategi. Your setup is fine thats it.

[Forumchibi]

I was going to say the same as Zyken. If ANYONE is still falling through the floor after realizing how the sparks and pillars work, that's very bad.

I'm short on time right now so I can't read the reports, but are you getting to a 10 stack by the last phase? You should be killing 4 waves of sparks each time they appear, with the 5th stack occuring as soon as the phase begins. Also make sure you take care of the adds that spawn during the pillar phase as fast as possible with any snares and slows (roots can be used to, but must be done cautiously to avoid them being rooted next to a player and automatically pounding on them). During the last phase, all raid members should be stacked in the middle using healthstones, potions, and any damage reduction cooldowns possible to reduce the burden on the healers.

You sound like you're doing well if you're getting to 10% though. Are you dying to damage or to the enrage timer?

[draykorinee]

Doesnt look like healing is the issue,, its identical to our kill, but you're 70kdps lower than our kill. reason being you're not killing enough orbs you need 10 stacks to do it imo, we tried with 3/3 and it doesnt work. Not enough time to analyse anymore but thats the reason hes not dieing imo.

[Xami]

DPS is kinda low (especially the bottom half) but you're clearing the 2x phase 1 with 2 and 3 protectors respectively, so theoretically you have sufficient DPS.

The problem is you're only killing 3/3 charges which isn't enough to get through the last phase. Try to come up with whatever necessary to kill 4/4 charges. Melee usually have this easier so have them help those with difficulties (DoT classes especially).

[Zoraxe]

Basically what everyone else is saying, dont die to stupid stuff and kill 4/4. Our first kill as a guild was 4/4 and we beat enrage by ~10 seconds, however now we still do 4/4 and finish with almost 2 mins to spare so gear is probly a small factor to

[herpecin]

with 2 healers you need to do 4-5 sparks in order to be able to kill him in P3, if you can only mange 3 then its best to go 3 healers otherwise you will keep getting 10% wipes.

[Deja Thoris]

with 2 healers you need to do 4-5 sparks in order to be able to kill him in P3, if you can only mange 3 then its best to go 3 healers otherwise you will keep getting 10% wipes.

Ignore this, you'll wipe to enrage with 3 healers.

Theres 100 threads on elegon, I'm not going to regurgitate what they say but I'd encourage you to page through them, the message for this boss stays the same.

[Destroman100]

We did it with 2 healer setup (2 x shamans) we killed 3/3 and beat enrage by 2mins. Its really simple fight , clear stacks before big add dies and watch boss HP stop dps if needed to avoid getting big add in spark phase, what you can do is kill 3 sparks and then nuke just boss till next wave of sparks hits , should chow off about 5% in the 2nd cycle other wise if you try kill 4 and fail you loose alot of dmg that could've been done on boss last bit is just stack up and burn him down but tanks stil need to reset stacks. Simple as that

[SilverSnake]

Don't stare yourself blind on killing x/y sparks. It can be done with 3/3 and it can be done with 5/5. What you want to do is figure out how many sparks you can kill consistently, no matter if it's 3 or 5. If you know, for sure, that you can always kill 3 sparks each wave, then focus on killing 3 and then completely ignore the 4th wave and nuke the boss instead. This will be key in the second spark round as it will eat away a good deal of health from the boss for the final burn.

Are you hitting enrage or do you fail in the last phase due to lack of healing? Are you hugging up for AoE healing? Have tanks reset their stacks if you can't keep them up.

[Zens]

Our guild killed it with only slightly more dps than you (20k-40k, below 700k) and a melee heavy setup. The main difference to survive the little bit longer at the end I saw from comparing the logs was. Our enh. Shaman throwing healing rain (once only) and healing stream totem and a Tranquility via symbiosis to our shadow. Anyway you have actually a bit more healing, so you better save the time of Tranquility for dps, but the second shaman you have will not loose a lot of dps and it may give the extra heal needed (if not enough go for tranquilities and see what happens, you have two druid and one shadow = 3 tranquilities, well the one from the tank might be difficult to use....). But I have to add, I myself do not raid right now, so it is pure log reading.

[reflection]

Elegon is definitely the hardest boss in MSV. It was the fight we spent by far the most time on in MSV. It has to be this "perfect" try where everything works as intended. As mentioned above you should decide on a definite number of sparks you kill for sure. After they are dead ignore the last wave and go for the boss. We had 2 Healers and did 4/4 (don't mix up the sparks with the stacks - each spawning spark creates one stack - so if you kill 4 sparks you have 5 stacks).

[Tomathon23]

you should definitely be killing 4 sets of sparks every time. On top of that all your best attempts you're walking into p3 with at best 9 people. Areas for improvement I'd say tell severine to stop eating the damn cascades, no one should eat any of those ever. When you have healers healing people stupidly standing in cascades it just makes more aggro for them which causes them to get beat to death by sparks. I'd say probably what you want to do is when you're heading into p3 and all the pylons are down but the floor isn't back up go ahead and pop hero then to get a leg up on dpsing the sparks and heals (if you go 4/4 on sparks and go into p3 with 10 people alive you're gold you don't need that whole hero time on the boss) for a clean transition.

[cadmia]

Thank you for the replies so far.

We've generally been clearing 3/3 waves with the time of the 4th wave being devoted to the boss. Later in the evening, we attempted to squeeze out a 4th, but that seemed to set us back for whatever reason.

We aren't quite making it to enrage cleanly - Our good attempts last longer than 9 minutes, but as some of you have noted, we didn't have a single "clean" attempt with everyone up at the beginning of the final phase. I don't think we're being as sophisticated about our CD usage as we could be in the final stage either - I think everyone is so busy trying to stabilize / stay alive, that we are popping everything too quickly and losing any staying power we have.

Thank you again for your feedback - Just wanted to make sure we weren't missing anything major. It sounds like it's just more cleanup / fine tuning, but we're on generally the right track.

[Tomathon23]

how do you handle positioning on the pylon phase? We seem to do it fairly different than most guilds but its worked well for us and a lot of casual guilds on our server that I've helped down this fight where most guilds seem to do 3 dps/1 tank/1 healer per "side". What we do is 3 dps in between pylons 2 and 3 on each side (2nd and 3rd to the left/right) while tanks and healers stack on the consoles and we just don't have dps touch the adds or do self healing so all the adds will go straight to where the healers are where the tanks are ready to pick them up. This could clean up your transition into p3 a bit, as well as making sure people are popping personal defensive CDs like astral shift.

[zuke8675309]

Your warrior and boomkin are pretty low on the dps chart. With the gear they have, I'd expect both of them to be much higher - in the 100k or better range.

It also looks like you frequently have one or two people die because Cosmic Sparks wreck them. If that's the case, I'm guessing you never get into the burn phase cleanly and healers can't catch up. We had this same problem and what fixed it for us was putting no dps on the sparks until the tanks could get them rounded up. Our warrior dropped Mocking Banner and face tanked them while everyone then aoe'd. There are several different ways to accomplish this even without a warrior but the underlying principle is the same - reduce the number of people taking it to the face from Cosmic Sparks so that half the raid isn't at low health when the burn phase starts. If you can get into the burn phase cleanly, your healers can get their cooldowns running and should be fine keeping everyone up. I think you run the same healers as we do (disc/rsham) and once we cleaned up Cosmic Sparks all of a sudden our healers said - hey this is no sweat.

[shamestia]

Seriously if people are still falling through the floor you should really be looking at th direction of replacing those players because if they are having trouble with such a simple mechanic there in lies the problem.

You need to kill at least 4/4 sparks everytime if you wanna heal through in the last phase. Ideally you wanna be around 30% going into the burn phase. Is it 100% needed to kill 4/4, no, but you really need to. After the 4th burn the boss as long as possible before the pillars come up after the 5th spark, but with minima gear right now, 4 sparks is what you need to achieve.

No one needs to be dpsing any of the Cosmic sparks, have one tank on each side to gather them up. Meet at the console when platform comes up drag them on, everyone walk on aoe them down.

Use cool downs legitimately going into the burn phase. Burn 2 to stabilize everyone at the start, pop hero immediately once all stacked up. I hope you guys are stackin behind the boss and not clearing your stacks for the burn phase, it's much easier. Rotate cooldowns to heal through the burn phase, I mean EVERYONE'S cooldowns. If DPS/TANKS aren't specced into raid wide cooldowns they need to be to help ease the healing in the burn phase.

---------- Post added 2012-11-12 at 10:47 AM ----------

you should definitely be killing 4 sets of sparks every time. On top of that all your best attempts you're walking into p3 with at best 9 people. Areas for improvement I'd say tell severine to stop eating the damn cascades, no one should eat any of those ever. When you have healers healing people stupidly standing in cascades it just makes more aggro for them which causes them to get beat to death by sparks. I'd say probably what you want to do is when you're heading into p3 and all the pylons are down but the floor isn't back up go ahead and pop hero then to get a leg up on dpsing the sparks and heals (if you go 4/4 on sparks and go into p3 with 10 people alive you're gold you don't need that whole hero time on the boss) for a clean transition.

Gonna have to give that a try.

Lol damn it quoted wrong post.

[ganush]

I can only speak for the class I play, but I think if your Boomkin picked it up you'd probably be a lot closer. Boomkins really rely on their burst phases for their DPS, and yours doesn't seem to be using their burst cds. There is a thread in the druid forums that gives a good description of the opening rotation, I suggest you send them there. After that the CD's should be up after each pillar phase, which is a good time to repeat the opening rotation. You even have time to Celestial Alignment to Lunar while your waiting for the platform to come back up. The other thing this will do is some additional healing with Nature's Vigil (especially good in the final burn).

[cadmia]

Thank you, very much, for the constructive points and suggestions for new tactics. I've pointed my team to this thread and I am looking forward to a kill this week.

I definitely comment the generosity of this community at large. Thanks again!

[Deleted]

Hey buddy, I am pasting you the same I post I wrote to somebody else asking about Elegon.

- your healers need to learn the fight good enough to be able to get to P3 with as much mana as possible. If they get to 3rd phase with like 50-80% of mana they are doing good enough for the fight.
- down 3+2 waves of adds on pillars.
- finish adds and pop hero
- make sure everybody is resseting debuff at 6 stacks
- use every healing CD you can - bears tranq with popped HOTW 1st. 2nd spriests Vampiric Embrace (make sure hero and his off cds are on) 3rd and 4th CDs of healers, spriests Tranq whenever needed small burst. To manage healing CD's of dpsers is a key to this fight.

I hope this will work for you. Gl