Intel killing off enthusiast PCs?

[Deleted]

You couldn't be more wrong. Intel really is nearly twice as fast on single thread performance.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Produ...s=551&i=38.344

This is why AMD processors suck donkey balls on games.

close to even 60% faster even (58,8% if using that cinebench score)
mere point being, the difference is huge and kinda shows why AMD likes to have many cores.i
in order to compensate for the lack of single core power. (this however sucks for gaming in general)

[glo]

You couldn't be more wrong. Intel really is nearly twice as fast on single thread performance.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Produ...s=551&i=38.344

This is why AMD processors suck donkey balls on games.

Really? Not only are you failing to calculate basic math (the benches you're linking are showing 40-50% increases, not 100%), but you're conveniently skipping over the other single threaded bench on anandtech showing Vishera ever so close to the 3770k.

Not to mention that you're linking a $330 processor against a $200 chip. You -should- be comparing the i5-3450/70 at most since it's at the same price point. In which case the 8350 is an obvious choice, especially when overclocked.

[vesseblah]

Not to mention that you're linking a $330 processor against a $200 chip. You -should- be comparing the i5-3450/70 at most since it's at the same price point. In which case the 8350 is an obvious choice, especially when overclocked.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/697?vs=289&i=38

There's your 10-15% difference... Happy?

[glo]

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/697?vs=289&i=38

There's your 10-15% difference... Happy?

Has about as much weight as this one:

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/697?vs=702&i=501

Happy?

No matter your clearly apparent need to argue on these forums for no reason, sitting here and saying that AMD is crap is just naive. Anything that isn't a k series chip ($230 and above) is easily outclassed by Vishera right now. You can go out and plop down $120 on a 4300 and out perform every current locked Intel chip after overclocking.

[Deleted]

Has about as much weight as this one:

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/697?vs=702&i=501

Happy?

No matter your clearly apparent need to argue on these forums for no reason, sitting here and saying that AMD is crap is just naive. Anything that isn't a k series chip ($230 and above) is easily outclassed by Vishera right now. You can go out and plop down $120 on a 4300 and out perform every current locked Intel chip after overclocking.

it is with alternatives like http://www.microcenter.com/product/3...1155_Processor.
going for amd when you can get that for $170 won't make any sense for gaming.

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

it is with alternatives like http://www.microcenter.com/product/3...1155_Processor.
going for amd when you can get that for $170 won't make any sense for gaming.

Only with a microcenter nearby that you can pick up the CPU in store from.

[glo]

it is with alternatives like http://www.microcenter.com/product/3...1155_Processor.
going for amd when you can get that for $170 won't make any sense for gaming.

Except that 99.9% of the world's population would have to spend days driving (or flying) to their nearest microcenter since there are only 22~ in existence. You can't order those, and they're tied to motherboard bundles.

[Deleted]

Except that 99.9% of the world's population would have to spend days driving (or flying) to their nearest microcenter since there are only 22~ in existence. You can't order those, and they're tied to motherboard bundles.

well can't be that hard for people to resell them? (mircocenter price + $15 for sending makes easy money for those near a microcenter and allow a good deal for all pretty much?)
or are there some crazy US laws to prevent that?

[glo]

well can't be that hard for people to resell them? (mircocenter price + $15 for sending makes easy money for those near a microcenter and allow a good deal for all pretty much?)
or are there some crazy US laws to prevent that?

One per customer + forced motherboard combo + finding and convincing someone to go drive to a microcenter, buy them a processor and then drive to a UPS store for a mere $15 = highly unlikely.

[Deleted]

One per customer + forced motherboard combo + finding and convincing someone to go drive to a microcenter, buy them a processor and then drive to a UPS store for a mere $15 = highly unlikely.

one per customer for a certain time period? also how about people who work @microcenter? (employee discount perhaps?)
also what is that forced mobo combo? (can't see it directly on the page i linked)
with a price difference of $80 im sure there are people willing to sell them $40 cheaper and do driving for that. (kinda win win situation, if one lives very close to a microcenter)
perhaps the grand scale of distances is messed up for me regarding US but posting a package is a 2min walk from my house and the biggest tech shop +-5-10min drive.
i doubt it im the first one to get this idea?

[Deleted]

one per customer for a certain time period? also how about people who work @microcenter? (employee discount perhaps?)
also what is that forced mobo combo? (can't see it directly on the page i linked)
with a price difference of $80 im sure there are people willing to sell them $40 cheaper and do driving for that. (kinda win win situation, if one lives very close to a microcenter)
perhaps the grand scale of distances is messed up for me regarding US but posting a package is a 2min walk from my house and the biggest tech shop +-5-10min drive.
i doubt it im the first one to get this idea?

All in all, it is an exception. Which should not be used for general remarks. Otherwise we could use black friday aswell or other types of sales

[Deleted]

All in all, it is an exception. Which should not be used for general remarks. Otherwise we could use black friday aswell or other types of sales

allways got the impression that microcenter deals are really regular in appearance? (i see active ones float around here quite often)
still, yes could count it as an exception due to it being a sale.
on the otherhand it shows that waiting might be worthwhile.

[Deleted]

I think waiting on stuff and sales, should not be included in these kinds of generalisations.

And we can always wait on price drops, and those go of course bothways. (prob sooner for AMD :P) But still, i dont think you should include them

[Faithh]

10-15% differences at best aren't really huge gaps.

---------- Post added 2012-11-29 at 08:32 AM ----------



No, they aren't "twice as fast". Read reviews please. Also, there's no such thing as a "psych core".

[Core0][Core2][Core4][Core6] Psych cores
[Core1][Core3][Core5][Core6] HT'ed cores

You're telling me to read reviews but you really should.

Scores single core performance 4.6GHz on both CPU's 3570k/8350

FX8350 -> 7.9/8= 0,99~
3570k -> 7.6/4= 1.78~

Last time you were blaming me though..

The bulldozer is making use of modules where you have 2 integer cpu cores which are sharing the same FPU (floating point unit) and have each 2MB L2cache. You have 4 modules of this in the vishera fx8350 so this makes 8 cores.

Why do you think a lot of intel fanboys are like this: "FX8350 is a quadcore, not an octacore"

4FPU's for an octacore is just a fail design. Bulldozer is a crap architecture and they still can't hold any intel cpu off for gaming.

The single core performance is really poor because they used for each core a very low amount of transistors compared to Intel which makes sense.

3570k has 1.16billion transistors in a die size of 216mm²
FX8350 has 1.2billion transistors in a die size of 312mm²

If I have to match up the die size from the FX to the intel the Intel clearly has more transistors.

312/1.44 = 216

1.2Billion/1.44= 1200000000/1.44 = 833M transistors in a fx8350 in a 216mm² size which is drastic lower than the IB.

Don't just tell me to read reviews if you still don't know anything about the bulldozer architecture and neither about their single core performance. I really hate this..

Really? Not only are you failing to calculate basic math (the benches you're linking are showing 40-50% increases, not 100%), but you're conveniently skipping over the other single threaded bench on anandtech showing Vishera ever so close to the 3770k.

Not to mention that you're linking a $330 processor against a $200 chip. You -should- be comparing the i5-3450/70 at most since it's at the same price point. In which case the 8350 is an obvious choice, especially when overclocked.

C'mon dude.. You couldn't calculate basic math..

[glo]

[Core0][Core2][Core4][Core6] Psych cores
[Core1][Core3][Core5][Core6] HT'ed cores

You're telling me to read reviews but you really should.

Scores single core performance 4.6GHz on both CPU's 3570k/8350

FX8350 -> 7.9/8= 0,99~
3570k -> 7.6/4= 1.78~

Last time you were blaming me though..

The bulldozer is making use of modules where you have 2 integer cpu cores which are sharing the same FPU (floating point unit) and have each 2MB L2cache. You have 4 modules of this in the vishera fx8350 so this makes 8 cores.

Why do you think a lot of intel fanboys are like this: "FX8350 is a quadcore, not an octacore"

4FPU's for an octacore is just a fail design. Bulldozer is a crap architecture and they still can't hold any intel cpu off for gaming.

The single core performance is really poor because they used for each core a very low amount of transistors compared to Intel which makes sense.

3570k has 1.16billion transistors in a die size of 216mm²
FX8350 has 1.2billion transistors in a die size of 312mm²

If I have to match up the die size from the FX to the intel the Intel clearly has more transistors.

312/1.44 = 216

1.2Billion/1.44= 1200000000/1.44 = 833M transistors in a fx8350 in a 216mm² size which is drastic lower than the IB.

Don't just tell me to read reviews if you still don't know anything about the bulldozer architecture and neither about their single core performance. I really hate this..



C'mon dude.. You couldn't calculate basic math..

This has absolutely nothing to do with what I was talking about. Last time I checked I mentioned nothing about core count, but thanks for the pointless read anyway.

AMD is still superior at the $1-220 price point no matter which way you slice it. For users that only care about threaded performance, it's often at times better than the 3570k.

[Cyanotical]

This has absolutely nothing to do with what I was talking about. Last time I checked I mentioned nothing about core count, but thanks for the pointless read anyway.

AMD is still superior at the $1-220 price point no matter which way you slice it. For users that only care about threaded performance, it's often at times better than the 3570k.

there are a few applications where core count matters more that core speed, and in these cases, quad socket AMD 12 core opterons are the best


also, for most home users, an AMD cpu is cheaper and a better buy than an intel CPU

the problem is that most people buying off the shelf CPUs are gamers and workstation users, in those categories, intel is king

[vesseblah]

AMD is still superior at the $1-220 price point no matter which way you slice it. For users that only care about threaded performance, it's often at times better than the 3570k.

If you're looking at the price of whole computer and are buying it for gaming, Intel will give you bigger performance for your money in all price brackets going up from $500 (computer that has discrete GPU). AMD's multiple cores is good for scientific calculation and running multiple virtual machines, but neither is really useful task for average readers of MMORPG fansite.

There are two exceptions to above:

1) At stock clock speeds Intel processor will give you always higher framerate for your money, but if you're wiling and able to overclock the shit out of AMD processor it will be better purchase in midrange computers as Intel processors are speed locked.

2) Your budget is too small to allow discrete graphics cards. AMD processors have far superior integrated graphics.


And all of that is totally irrelevant and about mile besides the topic of this thread.

[Tehterokkar]

there are a few applications where core count matters more that core speed, and in these cases, quad socket AMD 12 core opterons are the best


also, for most home users, an AMD cpu is cheaper and a better buy than an intel CPU

the problem is that most people buying off the shelf CPUs are gamers and workstation users, in those categories, intel is king

Exactly this, most AMD CPUs sold are in pre-built home computers or some people who want budget PC. For those that need a computer for Work(Graphics etc.) or Gaming, Intel is the absolute winner.

Most people don't care about the overall price of their computer, they care about performance, and where do they find performance? Intel.

[glo]

Exactly this, most AMD CPUs sold are in pre-built home computers or some people who want budget PC. For those that need a computer for Work(Graphics etc.) or Gaming, Intel is the absolute winner.

Most people don't care about the overall price of their computer, they care about performance, and where do they find performance? Intel.

"Most people" must all be using 3960x chips along with dual (quad SLI) GTX 690s then, right?

Price matters to many. This entire thread derailed regardless, but the point still stands. AMD topples Intel at every price point up to $220~, and is perfectly viable later down the line.

Am I personally using AMD? No. Is the misinformed nerd rage and hate against them warranted? No. Vishera is perfectly capable of maxing out any game available.

[Tehterokkar]

"Most people" must all be using 3960x chips along with dual (quad SLI) GTX 690s then, right?

Price matters to many. This entire thread derailed regardless, but the point still stands. AMD topples Intel at every price point up to $220~, and is perfectly viable later down the line.

Am I personally using AMD? No. Is the misinformed nerd rage and hate against them warranted? No. Vishera is perfectly capable of maxing out any game available.

Let's not go to extremes, there is literally no need to go past i5-2500k/3570k and gtx 660 TI-GTX680/7970 for a regular gamer. If I had to choose between 3570k and FX-8350, I would take the intel, and so would many people. AMD has been severely lacking in their CPU generations for so many years now, the only thing that possibly saved them as a company was the 7xxx series GPUs.