requiring PvP to do a pve quest chain is beyond retarded.

[Crianthia]

I have two characters, a pve rogue and a pvp hunter.


Oh boy such good game design! At the very least they should've informed us of this before MoP

They did actually, MMO has done a great job in letting us know ahead of time of what may or may not happen. I chose to ignore most of it so I could surprise myself but I remember seeing that one in there.

[IxilaFA]

It's 10 BG's. Not 100, not 500, but 10. 10! If you actually try it will take 3 hours maybe.

I guess you just gotta ask yourself if winning 10 BG's is worth a legendary. I'd guess that to the vast majority it is.

It's not like they're asking you to get Glad or 2200 or something. It's 10 freakin BG's.


And it's about time it went the other way around, PVPers have been stuck farming trinkets and weapons IN RAIDS since the beginning of time.

For the fourth time, I do not have a problem with this quest in particular. My concern is more about what direction Blizzard is heading with this. If they start with 10 Battlegrounds in Patch 5.1, who says that in Patch 5.2 you won't have to kill 50 enemies in the other faction's home city, or do 50 Battlegrounds, or whatever?

Sounds like getting the legendary is going to be a common issue in the guild, you're not going to be alone, and your leadership will have to either develop more realistic expectations or come up with an organized way to deal with it.

It will not be an issue in our guild because winning 10 BGs in the span of several months is pretty simple. Also my guild is pretty dedicated when it comes to upgrading gear. If there's anything my guild is good at, it's getting gear.

Whether it takes my guild 1 week or 10 weeks for everyone to get the next step of the Legendary, it won't stop our raid leader from getting onto us every raid night until we do. Sure in a perfect world our raid leader might practice more patience, but we don't live in a perfect world do we? And I like our raid leader for the most part, so I'm not going to really expect him to change his perspective on anything.

[stumpy]

For the fourth time, I do not have a problem with this quest in particular. My concern is more about what direction Blizzard is heading with this. If they start with 10 Battlegrounds in Patch 5.1, who says that in Patch 5.2 you won't have to kill 50 enemies in the other faction's home city, or do 50 Battlegrounds, or whatever?


It will not be an issue in our guild because winning 10 BGs in the span of several months is pretty simple. Also my guild is pretty dedicated when it comes to upgrading gear. If there's anything my guild is good at, it's getting gear.

Whether it takes my guild 1 week or 10 weeks for everyone to get the next step of the Legendary, it won't stop our raid leader from getting onto us every raid night until we do. Sure in a perfect world our raid leader might practice more patience, but we don't live in a perfect world do we? And I like our raid leader for the most part, so I'm not going to really expect him to change his perspective on anything.

If he's not even making a real issue of it, then you really need a thicker skin about being reminded to keep working at improving your game.

[Immitis]

For the fourth time, I do not have a problem with this quest in particular. My concern is more about what direction Blizzard is heading with this. If they start with 10 Battlegrounds in Patch 5.1, who says that in Patch 5.2 you won't have to kill 50 enemies in the other faction's home city, or do 50 Battlegrounds, or whatever?

so? its an expansion based around war between the factions if you have to go anywhere in the world they allow you to kill guards instead of players. if its a bg you can literally suck and be carried or just go afk in the corner

[IxilaFA]

If he's not even making a real issue of it, then you really need a thicker skin about being reminded to keep working at improving your game.

You and I seem to be on completely opposite sides of the pool here, so much that it seems you're not even understanding the point I'm trying to make. So I'm just not going to bother anymore.

so? its an expansion based around war between the factions if you have to go anywhere in the world they allow you to kill guards instead of players. if its a bg you can literally suck and be carried or just go afk in the corner

You don't see anything wrong with forcing PvE people to PvP, even if it escalates to a point where Battlegrounds will be completely inundated with the kinds of morons you see in LFR on a constant basis?

Also I like that the argument of "big deal, just go AFK and you'll win" keeps cropping up. If 10 people are trying to win BGs for their Legendary and all get put in a BG together, they can't all go AFK and expect to win, now can they?

[Deleted]

You and I seem to be on completely opposite sides of the pool here, so much that it seems you're not even understanding the point I'm trying to make. So I'm just not going to bother anymore.


You don't see anything wrong with forcing PvE people to PvP, even if it escalates to a point where Battlegrounds will be completely inundated with the kinds of morons you see in LFR on a constant basis?

How is that any different from the bot infestation that plagues the pvp community?

[Crianthia]

Well I keep seeing "PvErs are being forced to PvP is rustling your feathers but I hope you know that for basically every season in arena until this one (Barely) PvPrs were forced to do PvE for said item set or trinket or wep. Being a hardcore player into pvp I say good, its now the PvErs time to know what it feels like.

But I am not too much of an ass and I have to admit, yeah it is a little different approach and out of the blue. But this whole expansion is becoming based around the war, so it seems fit to me for this to happen. Whatever its 10 bgs, if anything it will keep you playing. If you have this gear that you say then basically you don't need reputations anymore and just valor (which can be gotten from 75389252 ways now) to upgrade your items. BUT blizzard is not that retarded, they wont be like go kill X^2 people in Y or Z city.

[glowzone]

You don't see anything wrong with forcing PvE people to PvP, even if it escalates to a point where Battlegrounds will be completely inundated with the kinds of morons you see in LFR on a constant basis?

Heh, ok.

To be "competitive", to get that extra edge, pvpers had to get into pve guilds, and somehow convince those guys they where worthy of heroic trinkets, weapons, and if you're very unlucky even legendaries.

It's hard to feel sorry for your 10 random bg's,If you needed to find a rated bg guild to get to grand marshal, or get arena master, thene perhaps you'd have a point. And while two wrongs don't make a right, it's 10 bg's, you'll get over it.

[IxilaFA]

How is that any different from the bot infestation that plagues the pvp community?

So your solution is to instead expose more people to the problem that plagues the PvP community rather than fix the problem at hand?

Well I keep seeing "PvErs are being forced to PvP is rustling your feathers but I hope you know that for basically every season in arena until this one (Barely) PvPrs were forced to do PvE for said item set or trinket or wep. Being a hardcore player into pvp I say good, its now the PvErs time to know what it feels like.

But I am not too much of an ass and I have to admit, yeah it is a little different approach and out of the blue. But this whole expansion is becoming based around the war, so it seems fit to me for this to happen. Whatever its 10 bgs, if anything it will keep you playing. If you have this gear that you say then basically you don't need reputations anymore and just valor (which can be gotten from 75389252 ways now) to upgrade your items. BUT blizzard is not that retarded, they wont be like go kill X^2 people in Y or Z city.

I don't understand this argument either. Why should PvE players have to experience what PvP players have suffered? It would be like if you got a divorce and then were happy your friends were getting a divorce because now they could "see what you went through." You should be demanding fixes to the problems at hand, not wishing the same problems on other people.

And never underestimate what Blizzard will do. They've made a lot of stupid mistakes in the past, and I bet you anything back in WOTLK / CATA, nobody expected Blizzard to make people PvP in order to get a legendary.

It's hard to feel sorry for your 10 random bg's,If you needed to find a rated bg guild to get to grand marshal, or get arena master, thene perhaps you'd have a point. And while two wrongs don't make a right, it's 10 bg's, you'll get over it.

And for the fifth time, I'm not complaining about having to do it myself. I would rather not do it, but you're right, I will get over it. I'm more worried for what Blizzard might try to pull in the future, and I'm trying to make a case that you can't blame the people who would rather not do PvP in order to get a PvE item.

This whole thread just reeks with people who are bitter about having to do PvE in order to get items that are good in PvP. It's sad that you think people should have to suffer the same way you are suffering.

Anyways, servers are up and I'm tired of repeating myself. Have a good day everyone!

[stumpy]

You and I seem to be on completely opposite sides of the pool here, so much that it seems you're not even understanding the point I'm trying to make. So I'm just not going to bother anymore.

You keep contradicting yourself. You say you never said you were going to get kicked, and then two lines later say you'll be removed if you don't get the legendary. You say that the everybody in the guild is going to be facing this same issue, you say that it'll get done eventually, then you say that your raidleader will be oblivious to the pace at which his entire raid group is progressing and will just keep harping about needing to get it done faster, and that this is going to be especially onerous for you despite the fact that he couldn't possibly be singling you out personally. You say that it's not this quest, it's the scary slippery slope lurking just behind it, but you keep referring to how this quest specifically is going to create an issue for you.

Whatever your point is, you're not articulating it.

[IxilaFA]

You keep contradicting yourself. You say you never said you were going to get kicked, and then two lines later say you'll be removed if you don't get the legendary. You say that the everybody in the guild is going to be facing this same issue, you say that it'll get done eventually, then you say that your raidleader will be oblivious to the pace at which his entire raid group is progressing and will just keep harping about needing to get it done faster, and that this is going to be especially onerous for you despite the fact that he couldn't possibly be singling you out personally. You say that it's not this quest, it's the scary slippery slope lurking just behind it, but you keep referring to how this quest specifically is going to create an issue for you.

Whatever your point is, you're not articulating it.

I was trying to make the point that this quest is not causing an issue for me. I've said time and again in this thread I'm more worried about what could happen in the future. I've also defended the point that yes, people in PvE guilds are being forced to do this quest. It is not an option. It doesn't necessarily mean we have to get it done right away, but yes we have to get it, and if it becomes apparent that we won't get it, then we will not have a raid spot in the future.

How is that difficult to understand?

[stumpy]

I was trying to make the point that this quest is not causing an issue for me. I've said time and again in this thread I'm more worried about what could happen in the future. I've also defended the point that yes, people in PvE guilds are being forced to do this quest. It is not an option. It doesn't necessarily mean we have to get it done right away, but yes we have to get it, and if it becomes apparent that we won't get it, then we will not have a raid spot in the future.

How is that difficult to understand?

Ah.

The correct answer is "Tough."

If your guild is worth a damn, it will organize an event to get this done if everybody needs it so much. If not, then it's not.

[Drilnos]

Because it's 10 random BG's and just not worth complaining over.

They changed it to two BGs, one Temple of Kotmogu win and one Silvershard Mines win. I hate pvp and even I find that reasonable.

http://www.wowhead.com/quest=32389

[celinamuna]

What does that have to do with anything? Go read my post again and realize the point I was trying to make. PvErs don't want PvP content in their quests. This sort of questline only promises that we'll see more of it to come.

I would be lucky to find 5-10 people in my guild even online when there's not a raid going on. Plus about 90% of my guild sucks at PvP almost as much as I do. If we form a group together we'd be pretty damn awful.

I actually welcome this change, plus this is winning a bg, i'm sure if PvPers were told that if they finish 5 lfr runs they can get legendary pvp weps only voice against it would be saying that it's too easy.

[Aceveda]

LOL. Wow, you have to do a few bgs, buhuu.

PvP'ers had to raid to stay competitive in PvP all the way up until PvP power..

[Needonboots]

How about you quote the rest of my post? Where I say that if you are a dedicated raider in your guild and are part of the main raid team? You ARE being forced into PvP, It is as simple as that. In a raiding guild would they rather have you with no Legendary weapon? Or someone that has a legendary weapon? Well, The choice is obvious.

In a raiding situation it is pure stupidity to ignore the legendary questline. It is flat-out dumb to ignore it. There is no "Personal feelings" because that would imply I have a CHOICE to PvP or not to complete the quest, and in this case I don't. They are forcing people into PvP because of the MASSIVE force of bots in BGs now.

They think shoving people into doing something they don't want to do will fix the botting problem, It won't. As soon as Raiders are done being forced to win 10 BG's...Which may be harder on some battlegroups than others. They will forget PvP ever existed after a heavy night of drinking.

When I spend times in a hardcore guild, I have to do LOTS of thins I don't want to do and I hate doing in order to be able to perform. I have to do dailies, I have to farm mats for consumables, enchants etc. I don't enjoy WoW outside of raiding, and yet to raid I have to do nothing BUT things I hate doing.

Do I sit around complaining about it? A little bit of course (rawr rawr dailies rawr), but if you want to be the best you can be, you HAVE to make sacrifices. The OP says he's in some guild that will pressure him into doing the chain. Does he enjoy EVERY other little aspect he has to do to raid at peak efficiency? If no, then why would he pressured into this? If yes, then guaranteed there are aspects of it he doesn't like.

Here's a summary of complaints this expansion:

"OMG I CAN'T USE AN ALT FOR CRAFTING WITHOUT PUTTING IN EFFORT"
"OMG I HAVE TO DO DAILIES TO GET THE DAILIES REWARDS"
"OMG THEY'RE MAKING ME DO SOMETHING I DON'T WANT TO DO FOR THE LEGENDARY QUEST LINE"
"OMG THERE ARE OTHER PEOPLE IN MY QUEST ZONES"

[thunderdragon2]

"OMG THEY'RE MAKING ME DO SOMETHING I DON'T WANT TO DO FOR THE LEGENDARY QUEST LINE
"

this 1 wouldn't be such an issue if there wasn't a major batting problem atm and since blizz makes a lot of money from them they wont ban botters....

ill be honest i don't really like pvp i can handle a few bg's, but when you add in the possibility of half you team being botters the idea of trying to do this for the legendary quest is daunting to say the least

[Drilnos]

this 1 wouldn't be such an issue if there wasn't a major batting problem atm and since blizz makes a lot of money from them they wont ban botters....

ill be honest i don't really like pvp i can handle a few bg's, but when you add in the possibility of half you team being botters the idea of trying to do this for the legendary quest is daunting to say the least

Nothing is stopping anyone from making a trade chat pug or calling guildies in. Both Temple of Kotmogu and Silvershard Mines are 10v10, so it shouldn't be hard to put a group together. Then the botters are all on the enemy side, unless you run into another premade.

[Haviland]

I will do my dailys to get better gear to progress to have success with my guild, there is no difference here, I will win 10 bg's to get better gear to progress to have success with my guild. I may not like either but its what I am willing to do for the better of the group. A little sacrifice in a questline I am anxious to see through to the end.

[thunderdragon2]

Nothing is stopping anyone from making a trade chat pug or calling guildies in. Both Temple of Kotmogu and Silvershard Mines are 10v10, so it shouldn't be hard to put a group together. Then the botters are all on the enemy side, unless you run into another premade.

are those 2 any good? i haven't done any bgs this xpac, tho i tend tend to avoid the 10v 10 ones as i hate wsg as i don't find 1 team camping the other team at their GY to be pvp, but that's just me