Greatest Addition to Reputation Farming EVAH.

[Venziir]

Um, no, totally disagree. This is a bandaid to try and cover up the gaping wound that is dailies. Best addition to rep grinding, tabards. They let me gain rep doing what I actually ENJOY doing in the game instead of having to do tedious, repetitive, boring dailies.

Grinding the same instances vs grinding the same dailies.... Seems to be about exactly as tedious, repetitive and boring

[Ryzzen]

Grinding the same instances vs grinding the same dailies.... Seems to be about exactly as tedious, repetitive and boring

I completely understand these points of view, and I have read every one of them since my original post. To me dungeons are still enjoyable. I can run them with guildies or PUGs, doesn't matter. It's the part of the game that I enjoy. If someone enjoys the dailies, FANTASTIC! Please keep doing them. I just don't think it's a good design to make dailies the ONLY way to get rep. Don't want tabards? OK, make each dungeon give rep for different factions like TBC did.

It doesn't have to be tabards, but there should be alternative ways to gain rep.

As far as Blizzard's standard response, let's look at it.

Dungeons give you VP/JPs and a shot at ilvl 463 gear (essentially enchanting mats).
Dailies give you VPs, coins (extra chances at raid level quality gear), access to raid level quality gear, profession patterns, and mounts.

Tell me again how dungeons are too rewarding?

[Leonard McCoy]

Grinding the same instances vs grinding the same dailies.... Seems to be about exactly as tedious, repetitive and boring

Except in the case of instancing where the grind was just in the background and wasn't in your face. Rep was just the bonus you got. It was great. Double dipping is what made this game a success in many regards. It's been here really since vanilla to some extent or another. Running dungeons has always netted me rep. If the game was based on rep farming outside the instance it wouldn't have lasted. Imagine if you had to grind furlbog rep for every expansion.

[Wilian]

i hate grinding reps in dungeons, so yea i love this

I hate eating shit so I settle with drinking piss.

[Granyala]

Which fool would skip 3 extra rolls? maybe someone that doesn't like doing dailies and understands what "optional" means?

Charms are a bonus from doing dailies, if I don't do the dailies I don't get the bonus.....see how that works, like many other things in the game, if you don't do it, you don't get stuff...

Charms are probably THE overrated thing in MoP anyway. In 2 months of weekly spamming 3 charms I got ONE ... useful item. To me that hardly qualifies as mandatory, it's even tough to see a Bonus worth the effort in there if it gives me 28G almost all the time.

Except in the case of instancing where the grind was just in the background and wasn't in your face. Rep was just the bonus you got.

Errm.. no. It was not. You had to farm SPECIFIC dungeons for the faction you wanted and usually that Instance had what 1 .. maybe 2 usable items for you? All that time where you gear screamed "Go there, lots of stuffz!" yet you had to go SLabs for the 4727638734. time to finally hit exalted and get your ugly looking caster-mace...

Did you peeps actually play back in TBC?

[Marema]

The panda way to earn rep is by far the better way to earn it. People complained about running the same dungeons over and over to gain rep and now they are complainng about having to do dailies.

[clevin]

Honored. (which you could get while questing, generally)

In TBC they were originally gated behind revered rep. They dropped that to honored about a year in.

What Blizzz should have done is this... keep the dailies. Drop the linearity - right now you can unlock all of the GL dailies but they still have to be done in a certain order. Let me do each of the groups in any order I want. Either don't make AC and Shado-Pan gated or make them sgated behind Honored with GL, not Revered.

AND... where it makes in-game sense, let dungeons give me rep. The tabard system was sily because you got rep with a faction for doing things that did not benefit that faction at all. But what we do in some dungeons IS related to a faction... SP Monastery should give SP rep for example and Gate of the Setting Sun should give GL or perhaps Klaxxi rep. This might not work for all dungeons, but it would let people mix and match rep gains.

Their mistake was to worry about dungeons double dipping - you get VP andf possibly drops and rep. What they should have worried about what "Is the player doing something to benefit a faction?" If not then no rep. If so, then rep with the faction that benefits. But don't allow rep for just any faction in any dungeon - that makes no sense in game.

[Granyala]

AND... where it makes in-game sense, let dungeons give me rep. The tabard system was sily because you got rep with a faction for doing things that did not benefit that faction at all. But what we do in some dungeons IS related to a faction... SP Monastery should give SP rep for example and Gate of the Setting Sun should give GL or perhaps Klaxxi rep. This might not work for all dungeons, but it would let people mix and match rep gains.

Agreed. That would make sense.
Additionally they need to implement a weekly reputation cap. Then you can choose how to get to said cap. Dailies, dungeons or mix of both.

But I bet they thought about that too, and the reason why they didn't do it this way is that they want peeps out there in the world, not sitting in town popping queues.
Which is something I can understand.

[Cernunnos]

All dailies should give 250 rep before bonuses, like they always have. not this 143 rep and 110 rep shit in MOP.

[Drilnos]

All dailies should give 250 rep before bonuses, like they always have. not this 143 rep and 110 rep shit in MOP.

That's 130 and 100, respectively. You're getting a 10% bonus from your guild perk. With the Commendations you get 260 (286) and 200 (220) rep per daily instead, and that is active from revered through exalted on your main and permanently on your alts, so... Wish granted.

[oplawlz]

The panda way to earn rep is by far the better way to earn it. People complained about running the same dungeons over and over to gain rep and now they are complainng about having to do dailies.

**In your opinion**
The point for most people is that several ways already exist in game for gaining reputation, yet the content is gated behind this one particular method. Allowing players to choose from several ways to gain rep would make those of you who love dailies just as happy as the people who don't --- everyone wins. Heck, folks might even choose to do dungeons a few days a week that their friends are around, and dailies for when they solo, or vice versa. Variety in gameplay is a wonderful thing.

[Roguezor]

Um, no, totally disagree. This is a bandaid to try and cover up the gaping wound that is dailies. Best addition to rep grinding, tabards. They let me gain rep doing what I actually ENJOY doing in the game instead of having to do tedious, repetitive, boring dailies.

Yeh, totaly... cause running the same instances over and over for hours after hours to get rep is sooo much more fun than doing actually variating groups of daily quests at 3-5 different places, right? /end sarcasm

Seriously, just because YOU don't like dailys and rather farm the same boring instances with random badies from LFD doesn't mean everyone prefers it. Current rep system is great imo, only took a few weeks to get ALL panda reps to exalted, and now i can do it in half the time on my pretty "freshly" dinged 90 alt. I approve!

[Ryzzen]

Yeh, totaly... cause running the same instances over and over for hours after hours to get rep is sooo much more fun than doing actually variating groups of daily quests at 3-5 different places, right? /end sarcasm

Seriously, just because YOU don't like dailys and rather farm the same boring instances with random badies from LFD doesn't mean everyone prefers it. Current rep system is great imo, only took a few weeks to get ALL panda reps to exalted, and now i can do it in half the time on my pretty "freshly" dinged 90 alt. I approve!

And just because YOU would rather run the same boring dailies doesn't mean everyone prefers it. See what I did there? /end sarcasm

I don't want them to remove dailies. I want a way other than dailies to gain rep. Why does it have to be dailies only? What difference does it make if you gain your rep your way and I gain it mine? We both gain it and both enjoy gaining it. Forcing someone to do it only 1 certain way is just bad design.

[Drilnos]

**In your opinion**
The point for most people is that several ways already exist in game for gaining reputation, yet the content is gated behind this one particular method. Allowing players to choose from several ways to gain rep would make those of you who love dailies just as happy as the people who don't --- everyone wins. Heck, folks might even choose to do dungeons a few days a week that their friends are around, and dailies for when they solo, or vice versa. Variety in gameplay is a wonderful thing.

I'd like to see a formal definition of the word "content" as it pertains to WoW put down in writing somewhere. You've got people insisting anything that isn't a raid isn't content, you've got a wider sect that declare daily quests are definitely not content, and then we've got you, who apparently thinks gear is content. The game already has more variety of gameplay than it's ever had before. What you're talking about is equality of outcome. There are people who don't do anything but pet battles. Should they get rep for that? Fishing? Archaeology? Brawler's Guild? Talking politics in trade chat? More variety is always better, right?

Only it isn't. Having different activities give different rewards gives you incentive to do different activities - it creates variety. When you can do only one thing and get everything, that's not variety. It's the exact opposite.

[melodramocracy]

So why should this be the problem of a casual player who likes dailies and doesn't mind a little effort for the bonus? Not really our fault that "hardcore" raiders have a polearm in an uncomfortable spot and have to make their gaming experience tough on themselves. Making your GAME all about one aspect and "forcing" yourself to do stuff, doesn't sound like much fun. I do dailies every other day. On my off days, I level my Tankadin. Maybe everyone just needs to take a chillaxative and stop assuming that world first raiding will either a) get your face on a cereal box or b) vastly improve your sex life with all the chicks that are impressed by iLvL and raiding

Enjoy the game you started playing, and not the one your guild forces you to play.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining about them (frankly, I kind of like them, even though I don't raid, nor even play on a daily basis). Just wanted to throw my .02 on the subject of whether or not they're optional

[Roguezor]

And just because YOU would rather run the same boring dailies doesn't mean everyone prefers it. See what I did there? /end sarcasm

I don't want them to remove dailies. I want a way other than dailies to gain rep. Why does it have to be dailies only? What difference does it make if you gain your rep your way and I gain it mine? We both gain it and both enjoy gaining it. Forcing someone to do it only 1 certain way is just bad design.

Difference in your post and my post: I said the current one is great IMO, while you are bashing it like NO one likes it....

And unless they put a cap on the instance farm one (if they brought it back) it wouldn't be "ballanced"... so wouldn't work.
Putt a total capp of rep each day and sure, add what ever they want

[Orange Joe]

**In your opinion**
The point for most people is that several ways already exist in game for gaining reputation, yet the content is gated behind this one particular method. Allowing players to choose from several ways to gain rep would make those of you who love dailies just as happy as the people who don't --- everyone wins. Heck, folks might even choose to do dungeons a few days a week that their friends are around, and dailies for when they solo, or vice versa. Variety in gameplay is a wonderful thing.

There is no content gated behind rep. You do not NEED rep gear to enter raids. They only make it easier.

[mercutiouk]

Blizzard has said many, many times that they weren't happy with people get rep as a side-effect of doing things they were going to do anyway, so I don't think we'll see a return to tabards as the primary means of gaining rep.

However, dailies do feel very alt-hostile. I'd still lobby for BoA rep-tabards purchasable at exalted so we can fast-forward alts without being set back to (almost) square one on the dailies grind.

I'd go with this. It seems painful and pointless to level alts only to face the dailies grind AGAIN. Even make them a mini gold sink if they must but only having dailies as a source of rep? It seems kinda silly. Yes, optional etc etc, having only 1 source of getting all the stuff needed like top patterns for trade skills etc and having that source as repeating daily quests is NOT the way forward.

[Ryzzen]

Difference in your post and my post: I said the current one is great IMO, while you are bashing it like NO one likes it....

And unless they put a cap on the instance farm one (if they brought it back) it wouldn't be "ballanced"... so wouldn't work.
Putt a total capp of rep each day and sure, add what ever they want

I never said nobody liked it. I fully acknowledge some people like it. I don't, but that is just me. My response was to the added rep for alts being the greatest thing ever and while it is nice, it isn't a fix. It's a bandaid, like I said. I don't want to force anyone to play the game the way I do, but on that same note I expect nobody else to try and force me to play it their way.

[eboneye]

There is no content gated behind rep. You do not NEED rep gear to enter raids. They only make it easier.

The iLvl to enter a raid, is not the iLvl needed to succeed. Unless you are some master player (or a set of master) players. Yes, I have seen where like semi-pro raiding groups can succeed in a dungeon with blue gear. That's the 1%, that's not the rest of us. It's twisted to cater or bend to the 1%.

I will be honest, MoP is BEAUTIFUL. Artistically speaking, content wise there is so MANY clever tips of the hat, I actually ENJOYED leveling from 85 to 90 just to see the different interplays take place. Unfortunately, when you finally get access to the Vale, the story kinda starts to go down hill and eventually you get to the grind that is the bug stuff. Okay, I'll bite, you can't be 100% brilliant 100% of the time. Sooo... there's a flat spot.

Shoo me for fool, I had my eyes covered and my ears plugged as I leveled to 90. I had spent the first month or so leveling a 2 new toons from 1 - 85. Of course, 1 was Pandarian and 1 was a monk (I wanted to be different, a Pandarian mage and a human monk). Again, I liked the newbie area. I liked a lot of stuff that changed.

So, when I finally get a toon to 90, and I've got a crap-ton of justice I go to the vendor... WTF? Really. I need honored to get a few iLvls up from the quest rewards?

I have 8 85s and 1 90. I am looking at WEEKS to get one character up. What if I don't want to play just ONE character? Oh I have to spend more weeks to buy that character gear. Even WITH this new token thing, it still several weeks of CONSTANT grind simply to get iLvl gear so that I'm not struggling to keep up with the players with the "perfect" play. I have a life... really, a wife, a house, a job... I don't mind a little repetition, a little hoop jumping to get to the stuff I need. I mean that's what makes it a game. Still there's a limit... a reasonable limit. A 110 rep per daily / 9 per day and a target of 22500 (1500+3000+6000+12000)? Three weeks... for one faction (205 dailies)... Say an even 200. That's just 1 faction! Now with the token only a 100 on MY OTHER 8 characters? What? 800 dailies? No. Not reasonable.

If they want to gate us. Don't be hypocrits about it. Make raid gear cost cash. Done. You jump through hoops (a set of dailies say) and you get 1 token. That token lets you buy 1 piece of gear. There, gated without a bunch of monotonous (after 200 times surely). You're slowed to 1 piece of gear per week (which they've done ANYWAY) with the max 1000 valor per week, and items costing 2250... WTH? Really?

If they want it to take a year to complete a full set of Tier X, fine... just flippin SAY that. One piece of gear per month from vendors. Don't just arbitrarily impose these weird hoops to obfuscate the truth. A -- You don't have content to fill the gap. B -- You're just trying to slow down progression. Don't require us to do the same exact thing 100 times to FILL TIME waiting for more content. I would be far more happy with some sort of infinite random dungeon (a hack style) thing with various awards (a la) the brawlers guild for defeating successively harder challenges.

It's a good thing that I could get into heroics just from quest rewards and a few normal dungeon drops. However, the heroic drops don't give you raid level gear. Why break that progression?

Some people hate the truth. Me, I would much rather it be laid out without BS. There's a 3 month waiting period to get enough gear to do LFR if you're not in a raid guild with tolerant people willing to carry your fail butt. I am not a fail player... I'm a very average player. I like healing toons, those slots (like tanking slots) generally go to the best geared toons. So, if those slots are filled and I don't have an alt geared... I don't go. I do NOT have a tolerant guild, they are very much about gearing up their golden children and to heck with the average folks, so you're on you're own (many guilds are like this). That's where this 500 dailies + the addition of weekly limits just feels over the top.

It seems more like some gratuitous hazing ritual, than what true end game should be. Worse, even once I'm through the first hazing, I have to go through it again for every toon I have. Nah. That really cheapens all the good things they managed to do. It really came as a surprise after all the things I liked right up until that point. It's like an epic crash at the end of a totally fun joy ride.