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  1. #281
    Old God Grizzly Willy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deadvolcanoes View Post
    rip stanton bison
    Should perform the ritual. Maybe we can summon him back.

  2. #282
    Over 9000! ringpriest's Avatar
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    I really, really hope you're trolling. Because if you're not, I weep at the level of ignorance required.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadvolcanoes View Post
    A. America is not on the brink of collapse. Not even close.
    America's economy is a disaster, one small step above recession. Inequality, poverty and hunger are at all time highs. The military is stretched to the breaking point, with deployments lasting years, reduced requirements for promotions, and an unequaled suicide rate. Corruption and fraud are rampant at the highest levels of the U.S. financial system. Politically, the country is bitterly divided, while the government is hated and ineffective, unwilling to take action of any sort on basic functions such as addressing the debt by one means or another.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadvolcanoes View Post
    B. No one here is advocating a 10 year war with thousands of American lives lost. We are advocating the removal of a brutal dictator by force if he uses chemical weapons on the civilian population. That requires airstrikes at most.
    You can advocate as you please, but the likely outcome is long-term U.S. military presence and disaster for the locals. Here's a list of some historic U.S. military interventions, how long they took, and their direct outcomes:

    Uganda: 2011-present, violence ongoing
    Pakistan: 2004-present, violence ongoing
    Yemen: 2002-present, civil war
    Kosovo: 1999-present, intermittent violence
    Afghanistan: 1998-present, civil war
    Somalia: 1992-present, civil war
    Columbia: 1989-present, ongoing violence
    Iraq: 1987-present, violence ongoing
    Grenada:1983, peaceful democracy
    Libya: 1981-present, ongoing violence
    Vietnam: 1961-1975, collapse of South Vietnam, communist victory
    Korea: 1950-present, ceasefire, ongoing threats, nuclear weapons
    Japan: 1941-1952, democracy, peace
    Germany: 1941-1949, democracy, peace
    Russia: 1918-1922, revolution, communist victory
    Hati: 1914-2010, failed state, foreign occupation
    Dominican Republic: 1798-1966, dictatorship, tyranny
    Cuba: 1822-1960, ongoing tension and hostility
    Honduras - 1902-1988, peace, U.S.-supported coup in 2009
    Panama: 1901-1990, peace, endemic corruption
    Phillippines: 1898-present, intermittent violence
    Hawaii: 1874-1893, government overthrown, country annexed
    Libya (Barbary States): 1801-1823, conquest by the Ottoman Empire
    China: 1866-1955, peace, trade relations, military tension over Taiwan
    Nicaragua: 1857-1927, puppet government (1927-1979), revolution, ongoing hostility
    Mexico: 1844-1920, peace, territory annexed


    Quote Originally Posted by Deadvolcanoes View Post
    C. The tree of liberty does not need to be watered with the blood of patriots. It just needs carbon dioxide, sunlight, water, and soil. No blood required.
    The United States now claims it has the right to kill anyone on Earth at any time for any reason, detain anyone indefinitely without trial, torture suspects, seize people in foreign countries without regard for treaties or international law, attack any country at any time for any reason, etc. I think your recipe for liberty needs some work.

  3. #283
    Quote Originally Posted by Psyopz View Post
    Are you serious right now? The Rebels are practically begging us to lend a helping hand.
    source? if they are begging us now then they have done a 180 recently. and i still dont want us in there, some of the rebels having a change of heart regarding aid doesnt change a thing, if they even have had this change of heart

  4. #284
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raybourne View Post
    Why shouldn't the US help out?
    It's not our problem. Let the UN decide what is the best way to go about resolving the conflict. I'm tired of having to help out every other insignificant country (sorry to sound harsh, but it's true). The US has our own problems that need to be addressed.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-07 at 09:32 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by ringpriest View Post
    I really, really hope you're trolling. Because if you're not, I weep at the level of ignorance required.



    America's economy is a disaster, one small step above recession. Inequality, poverty and hunger are at all time highs. The military is stretched to the breaking point, with deployments lasting years, reduced requirements for promotions, and an unequaled suicide rate. Corruption and fraud are rampant at the highest levels of the U.S. financial system. Politically, the country is bitterly divided, while the government is hated and ineffective, unwilling to take action of any sort on basic functions such as addressing the debt by one means or another.



    You can advocate as you please, but the likely outcome is long-term U.S. military presence and disaster for the locals. Here's a list of some historic U.S. military interventions, how long they took, and their direct outcomes:

    Uganda: 2011-present, violence ongoing
    Pakistan: 2004-present, violence ongoing
    Yemen: 2002-present, civil war
    Kosovo: 1999-present, intermittent violence
    Afghanistan: 1998-present, civil war
    Somalia: 1992-present, civil war
    Columbia: 1989-present, ongoing violence
    Iraq: 1987-present, violence ongoing
    Grenada:1983, peaceful democracy
    Libya: 1981-present, ongoing violence
    Vietnam: 1961-1975, collapse of South Vietnam, communist victory
    Korea: 1950-present, ceasefire, ongoing threats, nuclear weapons
    Japan: 1941-1952, democracy, peace
    Germany: 1941-1949, democracy, peace
    Russia: 1918-1922, revolution, communist victory
    Hati: 1914-2010, failed state, foreign occupation
    Dominican Republic: 1798-1966, dictatorship, tyranny
    Cuba: 1822-1960, ongoing tension and hostility
    Honduras - 1902-1988, peace, U.S.-supported coup in 2009
    Panama: 1901-1990, peace, endemic corruption
    Phillippines: 1898-present, intermittent violence
    Hawaii: 1874-1893, government overthrown, country annexed
    Libya (Barbary States): 1801-1823, conquest by the Ottoman Empire
    China: 1866-1955, peace, trade relations, military tension over Taiwan
    Nicaragua: 1857-1927, puppet government (1927-1979), revolution, ongoing hostility
    Mexico: 1844-1920, peace, territory annexed




    The United States now claims it has the right to kill anyone on Earth at any time for any reason, detain anyone indefinitely without trial, torture suspects, seize people in foreign countries without regard for treaties or international law, attack any country at any time for any reason, etc. I think your recipe for liberty needs some work.

    People like this are the exact reason why I want the US to keep out of Europe's problems and let them figure out how to solve their own damn problems. Pathetic individuals. There is so much wrongful information in the post it's not worth time trying to help this poor fool out. Just another American hater spreading vitriol and asinine propaganda. According to this moron, all the worlds problems are caused by America.

    Infracted: Please post respectfully and avoid personal attacks
    Last edited by Pendulous; 2012-12-08 at 02:40 AM.

  5. #285
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scinder View Post
    People like this are the exact reason why I want the US to keep out of Europe's problems and let them figure out how to solve their own damn problems. Pathetic individuals. There is so much wrongful information in the post it's not worth time trying to help this poor fool out. Just another American hater spreading vitriol and asinine propaganda. According to this moron, all the worlds problems are caused by America.
    People like this are the exact reason why we Europeans think that the US should stay out of our problems and by the way since when was Syria part of Europe?

  6. #286
    Brewmaster soulcrusher's Avatar
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    tbh im seeing a lot of the same language and word structure with some of these posters. the repeated and often incorrect use of the word asinine for example. makes me wonder if theyre the same "enlightened" individual.

  7. #287
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    Quote Originally Posted by N-7 View Post
    People like this are the exact reason why we Europeans think that the US should stay out of our problems and by the way since when was Syria part of Europe?
    I never said Syria was part of Europe. It's the ME which borders Europe. As it should be, it's more your problem than ours in the US. It's a waste of our time and resources. I'm tired of wasting time trying to establish peace in the ME. It will never happen. They will fight with each other till the end of time.

    Quote Originally Posted by soulcrusher View Post
    tbh im seeing a lot of the same language and word structure with some of these posters. the repeated and often incorrect use of the word asinine for example. makes me wonder if theyre the same "enlightened" individual.
    Not sure who you are referring to, but my use would be the correct use in this context. I haven't read the entire thread so I could be wrong as to whom you're referring. I am sure the vast majority of the pages consists of mostly US bashing so if I am quoting you incorrectly, then my apologies.

  8. #288
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    I'm not one to be talking politics but I wish the US would stop getting involved with everything. Seriously look how bad were doing right now. Why are we focusing on war all the time and not our own country? Let someone else play hero for once, it's not like we did a whole lot in the war besides kill some key targets of the Taliban and have thousands of our own troops die for it. And if no one goes to Syria's rescue then obviously it's not worth it to try and save them as bad as that sounds. No one would come help us if we were in that situation except for maybe UK. We're trillions of dollars in debt yet we keep going to other people's wars and keep spending money that could be spent towards better things to help our own country. At this rate we'll hit the quadrillions.
    - "If you have a problem figuring out whether you're for me or Trump, then you ain't black" - Jo Bodin, BLM supporter
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  9. #289
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scinder View Post
    I never said Syria was part of Europe. It's the ME which borders Europe. As it should be, it's more your problem than ours in the US. It's a waste of our time and resources. I'm tired of wasting time trying to establish peace in the ME. It will never happen. They will fight with each other till the end of time.
    I am sorry but peace cannot be won with bunch of rockets and bases, real life is not an RTS game. And again, so what if the Middle East borders Europe?

  10. #290
    The american government is the reason this is all happening thanks to the CIA.

  11. #291
    Quote Originally Posted by Scinder View Post
    it's more your problem than ours in the US. It's a waste of our time and resources.
    No biggie we'll just wink the refugees through and send them over the pond. Problems for us solved.

  12. #292
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    Quote Originally Posted by whoranzone View Post
    No biggie we'll just wink the refugees through and send them over the pond. Problems for us solved.
    Not sure if you're being serious or not. but getting into this country legally is not as easy as you think.

    Quote Originally Posted by steveyboy View Post
    The american government is the reason this is all happening thanks to the CIA.
    Yeah.. No.



    Quote Originally Posted by N-7 View Post
    I am sorry but peace cannot be won with bunch of rockets and bases, real life is not an RTS game. And again, so what if the Middle East borders Europe?
    What point of mine are you exactly trying to argue? Nothing you are writing makes any sense other than America doesn't belong there and I agree. I am a former US Army soldier and I agree that we don't belong there. I still have plenty of friends serving overseas and I can't wait for the day that we pull completely out of that shithole.

    The point, and I am not sure why I have to explain this, is that the ME is more of a threat to you than it would be to us which is why I believe it should be handled by the UN or neighboring countries as opposed to the US.

  13. #293
    Quote Originally Posted by Scinder View Post
    Not sure if you're being serious or not.
    Well incoming refugees are about the only thing I'd remotely consider a problem at all.

  14. #294
    Over 9000! ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geminiwolf View Post
    I'm not one to be talking politics but I wish the US would stop getting involved with everything. Seriously look how bad were doing right now. Why are we focusing on war all the time and not our own country? Let someone else play hero for once, it's not like we did a whole lot in the war besides kill some key targets of the Taliban and have thousands of our own troops die for it. And if no one goes to Syria's rescue then obviously it's not worth it to try and save them as bad as that sounds. No one would come help us if we were in that situation except for maybe UK. We're trillions of dollars in debt yet we keep going to other people's wars and keep spending money that could be spent towards better things to help our own country. At this rate we'll hit the quadrillions.
    The U.S. keeps focusing on foreign intervention because it is necessary to do so in order to maintain the American economy and standard of living. The United States makes up less than 5% of the world population, but consumes over 20% of the world's yearly production. In effect, the U.S. runs on the old Monty Python joke, "a tax on foreigners living abroad". Without constant intervention the U.S. economic empire (and the industries that depend on it) would collapse.

  15. #295
    "British Foreign Secretary William Hague says the UK and the US have seen evidence that Syria is preparing to use chemical weapons."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-20650582

    Looks like shit is about to get a whole lot worse for Syria, whether it's true or not.

  16. #296
    Without going into any detail, we're not especially keen to butt our noses into this one, simply for cost / benefit. That said you bet your ass the Alawite regime is preparing chemical weapons - at the rate that the insurgency groups are going, if the Alawites don't use gas soon, they're going to run out of delivery systems period.

  17. #297
    The Unstoppable Force Bakis's Avatar
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    Both US and EU is very hesitant to help the rebels directly and for a good reason.
    We all know what happened after the US support of the talibans vs CCCP.
    As shitty this situation is it is far from obvious what can happen in the power vacuum after Assad is gone.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-08 at 02:51 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Palmatum View Post
    "British Foreign Secretary William Hague says the UK and the US have seen evidence that Syria is preparing to use chemical weapons."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-20650582

    Looks like shit is about to get a whole lot worse for Syria, whether it's true or not.
    Sadly not many people have any confidence left in US/UK intelligence or at least what they decide to offer allies, since Iraq.
    But soon after Mr Xi secured a third term, Apple released a new version of the feature in China, limiting its scope. Now Chinese users of iPhones and other Apple devices are restricted to a 10-minute window when receiving files from people who are not listed as a contact. After 10 minutes, users can only receive files from contacts.
    Apple did not explain why the update was first introduced in China, but over the years, the tech giant has been criticised for appeasing Beijing.

  18. #298
    Quote Originally Posted by Bakis View Post
    Both US and EU is very hesitant to help the rebels directly and for a good reason.
    We all know what happened after the US support of the talibans vs CCCP.
    As shitty this situation is it is far from obvious what can happen in the power vacuum after Assad is gone.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-08 at 02:51 PM ----------



    Sadly not many people have any confidence left in US/UK intelligence or at least what they decide to offer allies, since Iraq.
    Yeah it's a shame. I have no doubt that they are the best agencies in the world at what they do, it's just a case of the information they end up giving, or are alleged to give.

  19. #299
    READ THIS CAREFULY.



    Ok let me give it to you straight as I cba to go over 13 pages of people that have 0 clue what the fuck is going on in my country (Syria).

    I used to be a collage student there for the past 3 years , in wich 2 of them were in the middle of the on-going conflict and 2 months ago I was finaly able to get back to my family here in EU.
    So let me get to the point , I have seen , lived through things that as much Call of Duty you can play you guys can't even imagine lost family members to Air bombings , friends , collage studens being kidnaped then found 3 weeks later dead.

    The goverment of Syria has one of the biggest military forces around in the Arabic World , yet to be figured and found out this 2 past years as all of the information was hidden and unknown , Syria has a registered of 500 000 soldiers out of the 23 million population has an arsenal of over 4000~ Chemical rockets and as we speak all-mighty Isreal is spying on them so they don't get in the hands of Hamas / Hisb - Alah in Lebanon.
    The Syrian goverment is supported by Iran / Russia / China both military and economically , Syria has a 50 billion $ weapon deal with Russia and couple of months back Russia send them a pack of their best military air-crafts . There has been already couple of votes and Russia and China have voted with Vito so...
    As for you Americans that are for / against going in Syria or asking for the UN to go in well let me tell you this , IT WOULD NEVER HAPPEN : let me tell you why =>
    Iran would not let any foreign soldiers to actualy step on Syrian soil as they will consider it a military action on their ally and will react with War (The Irany goverment has already issued it, directly from their highest general) so Isreal would not let that happen as its the closest target for Iran and something else would happen . Palestinian rebels will react / Hamas / Hisb-Alah in Lebanon will be given a direct order from Iran to attack is they are their main resours for everything .

    As for the Chemical weapons used or not , it doesn't matter after 2 years of bombings , artillery attacks have been on-going non stop and noone has done anything even Kofi Annan steped off after failing to figure out to do.

    Peace out.
    Last edited by Nychris; 2012-12-08 at 02:23 PM.

  20. #300
    Quote Originally Posted by Deadvolcanoes View Post
    What's the cutoff point? Do we allow a modern day holocaust to happen and not intervene because its another country? I think chemical weapon use is a decent cutoff point for me.
    Let it happen and within 10 years you might have to give the syrian people their very own joker piece of land so they can live happily ever after.

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