unholy dk? are they still here and worth someting?

[Schizoide]

Yep, if they're being actively kited around don't use DnD at all.

[JGWentworth]

If your weapon is roughly equivalent to the rest of your gear, ScS hits (very) slightly harder than DnD on a single target. You should not be using DnD on single targets.

Of course with even one additional target DnD wins by a large margin.

When did this change? The first part that is

[Schizoide]

Since 5.0.

[dgiras]

Since 5.0.

correct point, but there are times when u need to use it. Like second boss MsV before he earthquakes, or for whatever reason you need to move away from the boss

[Schizoide]

Sure, if you need to deal damage at range and the target won't be moving during that period.

[dgiras]

any comments on the ptr UH changes?
i still see orphan frost runes on aoe
Plaque strike also infecting with frost fever, wont help us much, since we most of the time dont need a renewal to our deseaces.
Gary seems buffed up
I dont know what the mastery hotfix will be.
But so far i dont see any love to UH.

[Deleted]

any comments on the ptr UH changes?
i still see orphan frost runes on aoe
Plaque strike also infecting with frost fever, wont help us much, since we most of the time dont need a renewal to our deseaces.
Gary seems buffed up
I dont know what the mastery hotfix will be.
But so far i dont see any love to UH.

Garg buff seems ok, but I agree on the plague strike change being weak. I assume it's meant to help with target switching.

[Lovestar]

There is. Plague spells from mobs deal "Nature + Shadow" damage, it's the zombie version of Shadowfrost or Frostfire.

So I think it means Gary benefits from Mastery.

[Schizoide]

Yep, plague strike applying FF will help with target switching and avoid rune desyncing when you first start attacking a target. It's a really nice change.

The gargoyle will indeed scale with mastery. Note that it's free.

These are nice changes, but they don't fix the extremely long ghoul rampup. Shadow Infusion is still 5 stacks. Of course there may be other changes that nobody datamined; maybe the Sudden Doom procrate is higher or something.

[Shiira]

The unholy changes are nice so far, but they don't address any of the actual problems that unholy currently has.

[Schizoide]

They do, they absolutely do. They just don't address all of them.

[Shiira]

Not in any meaningful way.

As far as I'm concerned if the changes are not significant enough for me to consider being unholy for encounters where frost is considered better now then the issues have not been addressed.

[Schizoide]

Plague strike applying both diseases is huge for target-switching. Free Gargoyle is huge for rampup. These are great fixes for actual problems unholy currently has.

Is it enough? No. I agree with you there.

[Beefkow]

I agree that PS needed a quick fixing, its gonna be awesome being able to switch targets with having to take up runes and GCD, come to think of it, its a nice dps increase in pve and pvp.

Gargoyle change is awesome, 60 runic power to begin with was way WAY too expensive, if gary scales with mastery then i think this is a pretty big buff, especially for a 3 min cd.

Changes on the useless talents, i am convinced but....

There needs to be more.