Mega-Thread: Gun Control Thread

[Laize]

And you know what I REALLY take comfort in?

The parts to make a FAR more deadly gun are available from everyday materials and simple enough to make that anyone with a working understanding of electrical circuitry can do it.

Don't believe me? Either a railgun or coilgun can be made with nothing but wire (or metal rods, in the case of a railgun), a conductive/magnetic projectile and an electrical source.

[Zhangfei]

Remington 870 Youth
http://www.basspro.com/Remington-870...duct/10217886/

I laughed!

And you know what I REALLY take comfort in?

That you were just caught lying and won't apologise?

[Laize]

Are they? Most countries are Satanic hellholes of vicious slaughter, so I agree.

But shotguns are also for kids? Right?

If you knew we didn't outright ban guys, why lie and say we did outright ban guns? Anyone who wants to hunt or practice shooting can do so.

I first fired a .22 caliber rifle when I was in summer camp. I'm not sure I was even 10 at the time.

It's a gun in the same sense that an airsoft is a gun.

They're bolt action and aren't going to kill anything. I mean I don't even think you can use them to hunt deer in the US... the projectile isn't damaging enough to kill instantly.

If you want to consider a .22 a gun, be my guest.. but I won't "apologize" just because I view a .22 as more of a BB-gun 2.0 than an actual firearm and you view it as a legitimate weapon.

[Zhangfei]

I first fired a .22 caliber rifle when I was in summer camp. I'm not sure I was even 10 at the time.

It's a gun in the same sense that an airsoft is a gun.

They're bolt action and aren't going to kill anything. I mean I don't even think you can use them to hunt deer in the US... the projectile isn't damaging enough to kill instantly.

It's still a gun and legal - along with shotguns.

Could you simply apologise outright and say not all guns are banned in the UK? They're not. You've acknowledged they're not. It'd make you a man to do so.

[Laize]

It's still a gun and legal - along with shotguns.

Could you simply apologise outright and say not all guns are banned in the UK? They're not. You've acknowledged they're not. It'd make you a man to do so.

I think it's cute that you still consider a .22 a gun. I don't understand why. What makes a gun a gun in your eyes? Are BB guns guns? Airsoft? Sorry, .22s are toys. That's the closest you'll get to an apology. My condolences your country considers toys to be lethal weapons.

Shotguns I'll give you (provided you're allowed 12 and larger gauges... because I mean... come on...) but not .22s.

[Zhangfei]

I think it's cute that you still consider a .22 a gun. I don't understand why. What makes a gun a gun in your eyes? Are BB guns guns? Airsoft? Sorry, .22s are toys. That's the closest you'll get to an apology. My condolences your country considers toys to be lethal weapons.

Shotguns I'll give you (provided you're allowed 12 and larger gauges... because I mean... come on...) but not .22s.

So... guns are legal.

That's all I need. You lied. It's proven. We have the evidence.

[Laize]

So... guns are legal.

That's all I need. You lied. It's proven. We have the evidence.

Lol... I didn't lie. You just consider toys to be guns. I think that's, frankly, adorable.

It's like if I said women in Saudi Arabia couldn't drive cars and then you posted a link that showed a Saudi woman driving a Power Wheels and called me a liar because you "proved me wrong". Yes it moves of its own accord and you can steer it and is, in the broadest sense, a vehicle... that doesn't make it a fucking car though.

[Dillon]

A .22 can kill you dead at 400 meters.

[Laize]

A .22 can kill you dead at 400 meters.

If you get shot in the fucking head.

So can an airsoft or slingshot.

[HammerofJack]

A gun ban? Yeah...since a lot of murderers, gangsters, thugs, etc will follow this law to the letter!

[Zhangfei]

Lol... I didn't lie. You just consider toys to be guns. I think that's, frankly, adorable.

It's like if I said women in Saudi Arabia couldn't drive cars and then you posted a link that showed a Saudi woman driving a Power Wheels and called me a liar because you "proved me wrong". Yes it moves of its own accord and you can steer it and is, in the broadest sense, a vehicle... that doesn't make it a fucking car though.

It doesn't defy the shotguns and the fact that, despite your terribly fictitious analogies about toys, you lied. You are proclaiming shotguns and single-shot rifles are "not" guns.

I'm sure they are.

[breadisfunny]

It doesn't defy the shotguns and the fact that, despite your terribly fictitious analogies about toys, you lied. You are proclaiming shotguns and single-shot rifles are "not" guns.

I'm sure they are.

you arent really helping your cause by implying in your sig that gun supporters are too stupid to know what guns are based on the one post from a gaming forum by one person.because laize totally represents the pro gun movement AM I RIGHT PEOPLE?

[Woakerio]

You've been using that incredibly faulty logic for awhile now. Nobody ever suggested altering gun laws to fix poverty or gangs. Gun bans are to prevent gun homicides, which it has been proven to be effective at.

When has it proven to be effective? In states with gun bans or tighter gun control, crime is huge compared to states with looser laws.

"During the years in which the D.C. handgun ban and trigger lock law was in effect, the Washington, D.C. murder rate averaged 73% higher than it was at the outset of the law." - Federal Bureau of Investigation, Criminal Justice Information Services Division

"Since the outset of the Texas right-to-carry law, the Texas murder rate has averaged 30% lower than it was before the law took effect." - Federal Bureau of Investigation, Criminal Justice Information Services Division


"The 31 states that have “shall issue” laws allowing private citizens to carry concealed weapons have, on average, a 24 percent lower violent crime rate, a 19 percent lower murder rate and a 39 percent lower robbery rate than states that forbid concealed weapons." - CATO Institute of Research



You can google much more evidence than that proving stricter gun control = more crime.

[Zhangfei]

you arent really helping your cause by implying in your sig that gun supporters are too stupid to know what guns are based on the one post from a gaming forum by one person.because laize totally represents the pro gun movement AM I RIGHT PEOPLE?

I don't really mind. I like a lot of people in this thread, even if I vehemently disagree (and come across as hostile.) Dillon is fine - as is Sfiljayr or whatever his name is for example. Seem like lovely, intelligent people. I've said I don't believe gun owners are evil. I just think they're heavily misled - not uncommon in history and not a moral defect either.

But the point is that the people defending them clearly have no more intrinsic knowledge than those wanting to ban them. It screams hypocrisy about needing to fire a weapon to understand it, for example, or debate policy where certain types of gun are banned, when you literally don't know what the hell's going on and won't apologise when caught in a brazen lie.

When has it proven to be effective? In states with gun bans or tighter gun control, crime is huge compared to states with looser laws.

He means national bans. Localised bans aren't comparable.

[Woakerio]

He means national bans. Localised bans aren't comparable.

I wouldn't go so far as to say national bans are comparable either, for a vast number of reasons. The facts do stand, though, about gun control correlating to more crime in the US.

[Zhangfei]

I wouldn't go so far as to say national bans are comparable either, for a vast number of reasons.

Legitimate complaint! I just don't think localised ones are relevant. The South is a hotbed of illegal gun trade up to Northern cities. Hell, the city I live in has just over half the gun deaths a year than the entirety of the UK.

[Laize]

It doesn't defy the shotguns and the fact that, despite your terribly fictitious analogies about toys, you lied. You are proclaiming shotguns and single-shot rifles are "not" guns.

I'm sure they are.

I won't be addressing this, frankly, stupid point that has no bearing on the subject at hand.

What worries me is your assumption that I don't know what a gun is. To the contrary, I very much know what a gun is, but I bet you don't.

In the United States, this is a gun in the strict legal sense. I'm sure other countries around the world have similar legal definitions.

That's the lower receiver for an AR-15 rifle (Technically a "complete" gun would consist of both the upper and lower receiver... such an assembly could fire a bullet but with absolutely nothing resembling accuracy). That is a weapon that can most certainly be considered a gun.

But you know what would also be a gun under that definition? This. That's the receiver for a fucking airsoft rifle. That's why we don't just call anything that has a receiver a "gun". Just like all squares are rectangles but not all rectangles are squares, so too to all firearms have receivers, but not all receivers belong to a firearm.

Countries that aren't out of their heads when it comes to guns don't look at an airsoft rifle and think "Yep, that's dangerous... look! It shoots stuff!" and make you manufacture them noticeably smaller than real weapons and forbid you to make them resembling real firearms... and paint them bright colors.

So, my British friend, just because a .22 can fire a projectile with potentially deadly force (again, if you get hit in the head. IIRC a .22 can't even penetrate to the human heart at distance.) does not obligate me to call it a real gun anymore than a CO2 powered BB gun a "gun". Both are capable of killing if you hit someone just right.

A real weapon worthy of tight regulation (in terms of who could own the gun, not the gun itself) would be one that was dangerous when hit anywhere.

Again, I can home-make a coilgun with more dangerous specs (both in caliber and muzzle velocity) than a .22.

The things are fucking toys. Stop pretending they're super serious things even when the bullets they fire aren't considered humane for hunting (because they're not directly lethal unless you've got like... SAS accuracy and can hit everything in the eye) and are bolt-action (One round per reload for anyone who doesn't know).

[Zhangfei]

I won't be addressing this, frankly, stupid point that has no bearing on the subject at hand.

Yes, we all figured out you don't know what guns are. Or you're a liar.

[xylophone]

I won't be addressing this, frankly, stupid point that has no bearing on the subject at hand.

What worries me is your assumption that I don't know what a gun is. To the contrary, I very much know what a gun is, but I bet you don't.

In the United States, this is a gun in the strict legal sense. I'm sure other countries around the world have similar legal definitions.

That's the lower receiver for an AR-15 rifle (Technically a "complete" gun would consist of both the upper and lower receiver... such an assembly could fire a bullet but with absolutely nothing resembling accuracy). That is a weapon that can most certainly be considered a gun.

But you know what would also be a gun under that definition? This. That's the receiver for a fucking airsoft rifle. That's why we don't just call anything that has a receiver a "gun". Just like all squares are rectangles but not all rectangles are squares, so too to all firearms have receivers, but not all receivers belong to a firearm.

Countries that aren't out of their heads when it comes to guns don't look at an airsoft rifle and think "Yep, that's dangerous... look! It shoots stuff!" and make you manufacture them noticeably smaller than real weapons and forbid you to make them resembling real firearms... and paint them bright colors.

So, my British friend, just because a .22 can fire a projectile with potentially deadly force (again, if you get hit in the head. IIRC a .22 can't even penetrate to the human heart at distance.) does not obligate me to call it a real gun anymore than a CO2 powered BB gun a "gun". Both are capable of killing if you hit someone just right.

A real weapon worthy of tight regulation (in terms of who could own the gun, not the gun itself) would be one that was dangerous when hit anywhere.

Again, I can home-make a coilgun with more dangerous specs (both in caliber and muzzle velocity) than a .22.

The things are fucking toys. Stop pretending they're super serious things even when the bullets they fire aren't considered humane for hunting (because they're not directly lethal unless you've got like... SAS accuracy and can hit everything in the eye) and are bolt-action (One round per reload for anyone who doesn't know).

Your attitude towards .22's is extremely irresponsible and you're only working right now to reinforce the anti-guns' arguments.

[Deleted]

In fact as far as I'm aware the UK is the only european nation that outright bans guns for civilians.

/facepalm

Thanks for displaying your complete lack of knowledge! You basically show you have NO IDEA what you are talking about.

Most countries in europe ban guns for civilians.