[Resto] Overhealing Shrooms

[huth]

Which would be just fine. They're supposed to be useful, not your catch-all tool.

[Thelxi]

I wish they would just give up on the brainfart that is druid mushrooms. The clunkiest and least fun idea ever.

[Deleted]

I think the idea is ok, but what would make it better is something like, increasing the range of the heal by how much charged it is

eg, its 50% charged, its range is 50% bigger
100% charged, 100% bigger range.... so fully charged your looking at like a 20-30 yard range spell?

also, if its a total of 500k heal per mushroom, that'll be 150k heal per person (assumin 10 ppl are stacked)... or is it 500k heal total mushrooms? as thats only gonna be a 50k burst per person, which i guess is still better than atm .. (its about 25-30k atm?) but still

knowin bliz, it'll be the 50k per person

[Deleted]

2) (Burst healing) Let the mushrooms 'grow' on the druid. You run around with three mushrooms on yourself. They grow with time, up to a max of whatever over 1.5 mins or whatever. (I know this will be unpopular, but I like the idea of a ramp up time for the spell). When burst healing is required, you detonate the shrooms healing targets within 20 yards of yourself. Still somewhat positional, but much more controllable (you can run into melee etc). Still has ramp up time, but you won't be penalized if your raid has moved to the other side of the room while your shrooms were growing.

What about making them sticky to whatever target we want like sPriests Mind Sear (yes, even on boss). They would still have AoE heal but then we shouldnt be worried about wasting them.

[huth]

I think the idea is ok, but what would make it better is something like, increasing the range of the heal by how much charged it is

eg, its 50% charged, its range is 50% bigger
100% charged, 100% bigger range.... so fully charged your looking at like a 20-30 yard range spell?

also, if its a total of 500k heal per mushroom, that'll be 150k heal per person (assumin 10 ppl are stacked)... or is it 500k heal total mushrooms? as thats only gonna be a 50k burst per person, which i guess is still better than atm .. (its about 25-30k atm?) but still

knowin bliz, it'll be the 50k per person

Each mushroom can go to 1/3 of your health, so 500k total. Having the range grow would actually be a bit impractical with that in mind.

[Thorim]

I found them useful (ish) when raid testing the other night on the PTR, but that is only because they are currently overpowered, place them before grouping up for the fire phase aoe, bloom, win......but i still find them just too clunky to use throughout a raid boss.

If you could plant them ON people that would be better in my eyes, and having them do pure healing is a bit of a waste of a new I think, maybe give them a much longer CD, but upon blooming they cover everyone in an Xyard radius in spores, reducing all magic/physical/or just plain ALL damage by X% for however many seconds, that is the kind of spell Druids currently lack.

Either make them plantable on people, so they can be used with raid frames rather than annoying little reticules on the floor which take 3 globals to plant, or change how the spell actually functions.

They are just going to end up making them super powerful meaning we HAVE to use them even if we hate the mechanic.

[NightZero88]

They are just going to end up making them super powerful meaning we HAVE to use them even if we hate the mechanic.

They've already stated they don't want them to be part of our rotation which basically means they'll continue to suck. If it's not part of our usual rotation they can't make them that great otherwise we're forced to use them. As they are on PTR from what people said they're about 1 tick of a rejuv on a full 25 man so basically still useless.

[Dendrek]

They've already stated they don't want them to be part of our rotation which basically means they'll continue to suck. If it's not part of our usual rotation they can't make them that great otherwise we're forced to use them. As they are on PTR from what people said they're about 1 tick of a rejuv on a full 25 man so basically still useless.

"so basically still useless." No. Not even close. 400-500k (with the ability to crit) total for the cost of 4 GCDs once every few minutes is not even close to basically useless.

[NightZero88]

"so basically still useless." No. Not even close. 400-500k (with the ability to crit) total for the cost of 4 GCDs once every few minutes is not even close to basically useless.

500k/25 = 20,000 per person assuming you get the entire raid to group up.
Rejuv initial tick in balance spec = 26k, non-crit.

So you just wasted 3 global CDs plus ramp up time which we don't know how long will take in a real raid situation to heal for less then 1 tick of rejuv and required your entire raid to stack up for an underwhelming heal. Seems fairly worthless to me.

[Dendrek]

That's a really bad way to look at it. And if you're doing 25 mans, then there's really no reason to tell everyone to clump for shrooms. If they're already clumped, that's fine. But if not, then it's perfectly fine to have the shrooms placed where ranged or melee are clumped. What you're doing is pointing out one very specific circumstance, which is also a very unlikely circumstance on most fights, where the burst heal from shrooms per player isn't super powerful and saying "welp, if it's not raid CD effective then it's basically useless." So absolutely the wrong way to look at it. P.S. If you think RJ is a better spell than Shrooms (after the buff) in a situation when the raid is clumped and just took a big burst of damage, then I don't know what to tell you — but I certainly wouldn't think to say "you're doing it right."

[Tricksterjim]

Or you place all three where the tank is during a low heal phase. Costing no mana to plant. The during a spike phase you have an oh shit you have a large heal to save the tank.

[earthwormjim]

"so basically still useless." No. Not even close. 400-500k (with the ability to crit) total for the cost of 4 GCDs once every few minutes is not even close to basically useless.

It's about double the healing that you have there. Don't forget the flat 10% healing buff we're getting, larger health pools in newer gear, and they already do about 160k healing now.

500k/25 = 20,000 per person assuming you get the entire raid to group up.
Rejuv initial tick in balance spec = 26k, non-crit.

So you just wasted 3 global CDs plus ramp up time which we don't know how long will take in a real raid situation to heal for less then 1 tick of rejuv and required your entire raid to stack up for an underwhelming heal. Seems fairly worthless to me.

Again, it's closer to 1 million in healing. A GCD'less (when it counts) 1 million heal, that just requires preparation during downtime is worthless? I question whether you even raid...

[Dendrek]

It's about double the healing that you have there. Don't forget the flat 10% healing buff we're getting, larger health pools in newer gear, and they already do about 160k healing now.

Can you confirm it benefits from bonus healing? (Mastery and/or the +10%?) I'm not sure our health pools will be much larger than 550k with heroic gear from next tier. Assuming it benefits from the +10%, that pushes the total healing, sans-crit, to about 600k. If Mastery also affects it (and honestly, if it does that would be OP), then it might come close to 750-800k. But I'm not getting my hopes up on either of those being true without some evidence.

[earthwormjim]

Can you confirm it benefits from bonus healing? (Mastery and/or the +10%?) I'm not sure our health pools will be much larger than 550k with heroic gear from next tier. Assuming it benefits from the +10%, that pushes the total healing, sans-crit, to about 600k. If Mastery also affects it (and honestly, if it does that would be OP), then it might come close to 750-800k. But I'm not getting my hopes up on either of those being true without some evidence.

Why wouldn't it benefit from bonus healing? It already does 160k+ in my gear, so it'll definitely be more than the 600k you mention. They still retain their current healing output as a baseline.

[clevin]

Why wouldn't it benefit from bonus healing? It already does 160k+ in my gear, so it'll definitely be more than the 600k you mention. They still retain their current healing output as a baseline.

No they don't. It's not "what they do now plus the druids hp" it's "the druid's HP." I'm a shade under 400k, but let's call it 450k in 5.2. It's not that plus the current 160k.

EDIT: Actually the tooltip sounds odd (odd part bolded):

The mushrooms grow larger as they each accumulate healing power from 25% of overhealing done by your Rejuvenation, up to a maximum of 33% of your health in bonus healing per mushroom.

thats unclear - it could mean what you're thinking. It could not mean that. Hopefully they'll clear this up.

[insanedruid]

Yesterday I was doing 10man heroic spirit kings on live using shrooms to heal massive attacks
I noticed that shrooms overhealed a lot on pets as they have low HP.

Do the shrooms still prioritize pets in ptr?

[Malcor]

Honestly at times I wish they had never invented the stupid mushroom spell for resto.

We would be getting a 15-20% buff in our healing, But no now I have to fiddle with these mushrooms, Great

[halfawake]

Can anyone confirm that right now (as of January 21st) shrooms are overpowered on ptr and not yet nerfed? Because currently fully buffed shrooms in my gear (~24k sp, 20% mastery) they do about 183k each. They were doing about 370k each when crit. This was just on myself. This is 549k minimum heal and a 1098 max heal when crit. And this is without the naturalist buff (10%) that I'm not seeing in our list of passive on the ptr yet.

If these numbers are the ones they intend to go live they are much more useful than they are now. Currently the shrooms only do 9k per mushroom on myself. Even if the new shrooms quickly scale down when you add more people you can use them either on a group selectively or one person for a very decent heal. I expect that they may get nerfed because of pvp tho if it stays this way. Having what is basically a positional lay on hands every 30 seconds to 1 minute is going to get complained about right away.

[NightZero88]

P.S. If you think RJ is a better spell than Shrooms (after the buff) in a situation when the raid is clumped and just took a big burst of damage

What you're doing is pointing out one very specific circumstance

I raid 10 and not 25 so the shrooms are better for me but in the fights I've done I can't see a use for them. Yes, they can be used oddly for example putting them under a tank for an instant LoH basically but if you can't charge them up pre-fight then I don't see them that great.

Let's take a look for example at amber shapper. The point I would want them is P3. Now my group isn't great by any stretch (we're still on normal) but by the time P3 rolls around, there is so much damage going out that your rejuvs would basically never go into overhealing. Now, on this particular fight, even if you preplace I believe P3 takes more than 5 minutes to hit so the shrooms would poof if you could preplace. So now we are left with trying to place in the middle of the fight which here is doable. You know where people will stack and P1/P2 have light damage. However, at this point you are WASTING mana to force OH to charge a mechanic for later. Do you honestly not agree this is just downright dumb for a healer to do? It goes against everything you know as a healer. Save mana. Don't OH. But now Blizz is promoting it to save this mechanic. It's silly.

[earthwormjim]

No they don't. It's not "what they do now plus the druids hp" it's "the druid's HP." I'm a shade under 400k, but let's call it 450k in 5.2. It's not that plus the current 160k.

EDIT: Actually the tooltip sounds odd (odd part bolded):



thats unclear - it could mean what you're thinking. It could not mean that. Hopefully they'll clear this up.

Bonus healing as in, they retain what they do now, and they get extra.

The mushrooms receive a buff, this buff is what increases their healing. They still do what they do now, but they also get this buff from rejuvenation overhealing. You can go test the ptr right now, just bloom a mushroom without doing anything else, it'll heal you for 8-12k.

Mastery does not increase the healing done by them, however they do scale with spell power (I think that's just the baseline heal they currently do scaling). They also will crit (including the bonus portion), gaining the same crit bonus as every other healing spell.

I raid 10 and not 25 so the shrooms are better for me but in the fights I've done I can't see a use for them. Yes, they can be used oddly for example putting them under a tank for an instant LoH basically but if you can't charge them up pre-fight then I don't see them that great.

Let's take a look for example at amber shapper. The point I would want them is P3. Now my group isn't great by any stretch (we're still on normal) but by the time P3 rolls around, there is so much damage going out that your rejuvs would basically never go into overhealing. Now, on this particular fight, even if you preplace I believe P3 takes more than 5 minutes to hit so the shrooms would poof if you could preplace. So now we are left with trying to place in the middle of the fight which here is doable. You know where people will stack and P1/P2 have light damage. However, at this point you are WASTING mana to force OH to charge a mechanic for later. Do you honestly not agree this is just downright dumb for a healer to do? It goes against everything you know as a healer. Save mana. Don't OH. But now Blizz is promoting it to save this mechanic. It's silly.

Oh please, you'll charge your mushrooms up by being a good druid and keeping rejuve on your tanks at all times within a minute or so.