# Thread: The Serpent’s Accord: A Mistweaver PvE Guide [5.4]

1. Chi brew lines up with every other Thunder Focus Tea

---------- Post added 2013-04-07 at 10:07 PM ----------

Originally Posted by apepi
It would be nice if the legen gem could be used to use jab....hehehehe.
Good point. If MM stacked we'd be able to abuse it for huge regeneration which I guess is why it doesn't stack. You can get 8% free mana as it is if you're good with timing it and Jab->TP->Jab->TP

2. so our 4 t15 bonus is not so great with chi brew?

3. It is, just makes timing tighter

---------- Post added 2013-04-08 at 12:00 AM ----------

Some interesting math with the legendary meta;

420 second fight,

1.4 base RPPM, 1.79 RPPM with haste taken into account,

1.79*7 = 13 procs (to the nearest one, can't have half a proc) during a 7 minute fight.

Now assuming you use Jab->TP->Jab->TP, you would save;

((300000*0.04[Real Jab Cost])*2[Amount of Jabs])*13[Amount of Meta Procs] = 312000 total mana assuming you had pressed the same buttons without the meta.

Discounting that as a faux gain, you would gain the same amount of mana from returns from free muscle memory procs triggered by the free jabs. If you had ascension it would be the same formula with 345000, or;

((345000*0.04[MM Return])*2[Amount of MM Procs])*13[Amount of Meta Procs] = 358800 total mana gained.

So far, just accounting for the real gain and nothing else that's 3.7k MP5, or a 4.2k MP5 gain without and with Ascension respectively. Now if you account for the extra 8 mana tea stacks I get with crit included , that's an extra 108000 mana and 124200 respectively you get results of 5.2k MP5 with ascension, 4.8k MP5 without it.

So assuming you were going to play perfectly within these parameters, and using 0.564 MP5 per point of spirit, you'd be able to drop a total of 9220 spirit without ascension, and 9640 with.

tl:dr; if you're going to play right with the meta gem, you gain an incredible amount of Mp5.

---------- Post added 2013-04-08 at 12:13 AM ----------

Oh and that's without accounting for the 13% increase to RPPM, I think that only applied to trinkets but if it doesn't then uh.. yeah.. lol

4. Originally Posted by Reglitch
~snip~
Is this doable? Like does jab's mana cost get reduced by the meta, or was this just a thought experiment? And if so what...weakaura sting that screams (jab->tp)x2 at you when it procs.

5. Is the 4pc actually worth getting? It forces me to get either the head or shoulder piece, which has mastery (a stat I despise for this class).

Would the 5 second reduction on TFT be better than extra crit or haste I could get from a Thunderforged off piece?

6. Originally Posted by krazyito65
Is the 4pc actually worth getting? It forces me to get either the head or shoulder piece, which has mastery (a stat I despise for this class).

Would the 5 second reduction on TFT be better than extra crit or haste I could get from a Thunderforged off piece?
Gonna quote myself since this question has been answered a few pages back:

Originally Posted by Luqyolo
It's similar to the discussion of using a 1h or 2h. Do you want to be optimal for every encounter? Then you need both in your bags and switch around. :P

Like you said, having TfT's cooldown get reduced by 5 seconds might not seem much when quite a few encounters have a 45 sec + interval on mechanics which require good TfT use but it's not easy to quantify how much of a gain it might become if you got to TfT 5 seconds earlier than you usually would. A few situations that come to mind where you would probably gain from the tier bonus are having Horridon and War-God up simultaneously, Kazra'jin being empowered by Gara'jal so using Discharge after Reckless charge.

Using haste shoulders from Horridon would allow you to get around 400 extra crit from your set (using helm from Megaera which is BiS) and you would lose a negligible amount of intellect, personally sacrificing that crit for a more readily available cooldown is worth it.

7. Originally Posted by Chuupag
Is this doable? Like does jab's mana cost get reduced by the meta, or was this just a thought experiment? And if so what...weakaura sting that screams (jab->tp)x2 at you when it procs.
It's not confirmed in game, but Jab is listed as having it's cost reduced by 100% from the proc. Mind you, you only need to get the two jabs in so you have almost a second to react and you still can manage. I'd go as far to say as maybe this is why MM doesn't stack lol.

---------- Post added 2013-04-08 at 05:38 AM ----------

Originally Posted by Luqyolo
Gonna quote myself since this question has been answered a few pages back:
Horridon? Probably not, he dies extremely quickly if your DPS is alright. The only fight I've seen real use for the 4pc is Lei Shen. I mean even on a constant damage fight where you'd use it on cooldown, you're only going to see an extra use maybe every 6 minutes? Perhaps more considering TFT almost never lines up coming off cooldown with Renewing Mist coming off cooldown.

It's a pretty shit bonus if you get down to it...

8. It could be usefull on all fights with constant Aoe dmg, and luckily there are quite a few more than just horridon endphase, council Kazrajin and lei shen: primordius, Animus, Quon, twins... All have irregular high aoe dmg phases, where you can keep it on CD
Before nerf from -10 sec to -5sec I thought it was fucking great!
But now its just meh...
But defenetly still worth the loss of 60% of your more favorable secondstat (crit/haste) due to having to take 1 mastery piece.
As horridon is 2nd boss i'll try going with his haste-shoulder and t-helmet

9. Originally Posted by Reglitch
Horridon? Probably not, he dies extremely quickly if your DPS is alright. The only fight I've seen real use for the 4pc is Lei Shen. I mean even on a constant damage fight where you'd use it on cooldown, you're only going to see an extra use maybe every 6 minutes? Perhaps more considering TFT almost never lines up coming off cooldown with Renewing Mist coming off cooldown.

It's a pretty shit bonus if you get down to it...
Ok, but that's not the point. :P For starters, a 40 sec cd TfT is more flexible in the sense of lining up with every 6th ReM, since its CD is a common multiple with ReM's CD. Then, as you correctly mentioned, there are tight timers where TfT doesn't fit on encounters such as Lei Shen, but with 4T15 it would. Finally, you only need one slightly bad itemized piece, it's not a huge sacrifice like some players are making it seem.

I'll give it to you that it's not a great bonus and that a mistweaver can and should pass protector tokens to other players once they get their 2 set but if you can get the 4 piece then you shouldn't skip it, at least that's my opinion because you can skip it if you want to without gimping yourself.

10. So to recap:

> Get meta gem
> Make Weak Aura for proc
> Press jab twice during proc
> #winning

11. Nearly. Press TP once in between the jabs.
Just for the sake of completeness :-)

Edit: thats if you want an 8% mana return (+ a little eminence healing)
If it proccs during e.g. A rampage, Surging for free heals+chi would be an alternative
Thinking about it, as chi is expensive and so valuable, I think this bonus will help us more than other healers...

12. I was thinking maybe go Jab > Jab > Uplift but I guess Jab > TP x2 would be just as good. You're right. Surging x2 Uplift during a "high dmg" phase would probably be a useful thing as well.

13. Can Soothing Mist (ticks?) consume the meta proc..? :x

14. Hey all, sorry if this was covered on the previous page; Would Volatile Talisman of the Shado-Pan Assault be worth taking in conjunction with Chi Wave? If we can get a Weak Aura's going and keep it up then i'm guessing its just free haste?

15. Originally Posted by Doctor
Hey all, sorry if this was covered on the previous page; Would Volatile Talisman of the Shado-Pan Assault be worth taking in conjunction with Chi Wave? If we can get a Weak Aura's going and keep it up then i'm guessing its just free haste?
Maybe if you could get a lucky proc just before hitting TFT it would be slightly not terrible, but in general output procs are something you should avoid as a healer unless they're fairly consistent (aka not RPPM, no huge ICD).

---------- Post added 2013-04-10 at 08:34 PM ----------

Just got the horridon trinket, finished heroic council on full mana... it did around 1.3k MP5 or 2.3k spirit equivalent. Welp

16. can anyone tell me which of these 3 trinkets is best to use for mana regen ?
1.Relic of Chi-Ji ilvl484
2.Spirits of the Sun ilvl 504
3.Soothing Talisman of the Shado-Pan Assault ilvl 522 ?

17. Soothing Talisman

18. Originally Posted by Reglitch
Soothing Talisman
so i should go with Soothing Talisman of the Shado-Pan Assault and which of the other two ? i am thinking off going with Relic of Chi-Ji
like Relic of Chi-Ji + Soothing Talisman of the Shado-Pan Assault

19. Spirits 2/2 and Chi Ji 2/2 are even, spirits is slightly better if you don't mind the large duration between procs.

20. Just got my Courageous Primal Diamond (leg. meta), thought I'd drop this information (maybe Reglitch finds it useful for his spreadsheet):

- it can't proc of Eminence (tested by using just Emince-Abilities on the dummy for several minutes (CJL, Jab->TP), the first helpful spell after several minutes procced it)
- if the proc expires during a CJL the ticks still don't cost mana. Same with Soothing Mist.
- it can (and will...) proc out of combat (during pre-hotting ReMs before a pull or even by putting down the Serpent Statue...)

Will add more once I find get some testing done, here's my WA for it if anyone's interested:
Code:
`dmd4baGlu41QImtkuZvuMTi3Ks13Oi2PQYEj7Mk7hL0prP8xf63OAOuqdMI0WvWbPuogv5COewOK0Irr1Yr8uOhtv9CPMikrtvrtgPPlCvvrDzW1L42IQpRKntjTDvHpII4RuGPjP67uiJefLdRYOvLgVKYjPeptsCAL68QQwgksJdLQHrrT80u4PPcHTqpg1zycdwimxivivtHeyT5U5)aimGArHacp)yZDTMc74iHMcZHUVfi0qc33NHqkFS5fhvvfMdDFlym(haHm5zlgZsHnV4OcT4cGy98HmBuk31zga3t2kKRZmKBeqSvixBhO7ld5fhTZI3IJceg81siLpMdDFlqmxyZlo6O)75CqsO9RdGOqHWaQffciCc1Icb6mCasjB(X(XfBUJThajD)DM9dsDq45Jga3a3jmi71ciAkShGuYcvOxftQuXtyPHXEasjluvvO1sk1(NtvviCtfAmSah9i)SAQDiownLzWLeA0MgV6JPESl0vYNK9AbKwFEcFH96n0NxDZct8JQPqcpbAkmVKITMkuOq4pBwT2qOp2nRq4d95v3Szfs`

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