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  1. #461
    Dreadlord Voolawl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ar/Vu/advanced

    Completed the last tier on which toon?
    Oh I just saw this. Lol I was smart enough to cancel my AP/sub early before I got thrown into Kung Fu Panda casual land. Unfortunately I didn't stick around for the H Madness kill, but it was at no loss really.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kissme View Post
    The problem comes when bad players expect to clear hardmode content as quickly as average or upper echelon players.
    Accept your limitations.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    Admittedly, I enjoy beer more as a beverage that I can appreciate rather then getting drunk.

  2. #462
    Deleted
    Lol at all these people thinking legendary means a rare item XD holy crap.

    Legendary just means it is from a legend something that is well known, famous or renowned.

  3. #463
    Banned Jaylock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voolawl View Post
    Oh I just saw this. Lol I was smart enough to cancel my AP/sub early before I got thrown into Kung Fu Panda casual land. Unfortunately I didn't stick around for the H Madness kill, but it was at no loss really.
    Thats a good description of the state of the game as it is right now actualy.. sad but true

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-18 at 08:33 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    No, we can't.
    Legendary has nothing to do with being scarce.
    The part where a Legendary should be difficult to obtain is something you came up with.
    And even if, I call it difficult to obtain when it takes 2-3 months of working for it.

    "Only a few should ever obtain a legendary" < Why?
    You haven't given a single reason to why it should be like that.
    Before I answer you, why should legendary items be easy to obtain, and something that everyone should have? Whats your arguement in favor of having them this way? Other than the age old "I pay $15 / 13 Euro a month, i deserve everything else that the players that spend hours achieving as well with much less effort and dedication!"

  4. #464
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    Before I answer you, why should legendary items be easy to obtain, and something that everyone should have? Whats your arguement in favor of having them this way? Other than the age old "I pay $15 / 13 Euro a month, i deserve everything else that the players that spend hours achieving as well with much less effort and dedication!"
    Before I answer you why should legendary items being hard to obtain? There story wise items and casual people that are more into lore should get them. So called hardcore raiders get heroic gear months or even expensions before normal players.

  5. #465
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    Thats a good description of the state of the game as it is right now actualy.. sad but true

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-18 at 08:33 PM ----------



    Before I answer you, why should legendary items be easy to obtain, and something that everyone should have? Whats your arguement in favor of having them this way? Other than the age old "I pay $15 / 13 Euro a month, i deserve everything else that the players that spend hours achieving as well with much less effort and dedication!"
    Following your logic, there should only be one person per server allowed to get a legendary. Or better yet only one per region. No wait one in the hole WORLD since it's unique and all that jazz.

    This isn't about what you want. It's a design philosophy. You can twist and turn it any way you want, but fact of the matter is, in a game like this, making quality content for a very very small group of people is wasted design time and a failed philosophy.
    It's one of the few remaining subscription based games with a reputation for quality, mind you one of the best if not the best MMO on the market, subscription based or not.
    The presence of legendary weapons always was a balancing issue.The only difference now compared to Vanilla/TBC is that less players were present at that time, meaning less guilds and less players being able to get them. If you cut down the number of subscribers/raiders/guilds down to a similar number like back in vanilla/tbc you probably won't notice that big of a % increase in legendary item per player either.
    What you're doing in your arguments so far have nothing to do with improvements to the game and contain little insight to game design. I understand your frustration regarding "prestige" but that is a rather old concept at this point and holds less strength as we move on.
    Perspective is like a coin. It has two faces, but most people fail to see both.

  6. #466
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    Your whole argument is complete crap because repeatedly the lore characters in the game refer to player characters as "Heros" Not Hero, not singular, PLURAL. Meaning, more than one hero can get their hands on the same legendary weapon.

    Can we agree that the "Legendary" in this expansion is just not very legendary? Its just really common because even a cave man can get one. A legendary item should be difficult to obtain. "its legend preceeds itself" It should be very cool lore wise, i agree. But it should be difficult to obtain, and only a few should ever obtain a legendary while it is relevant content.

    As for your comment about being a "special snowflake," why shouldn't people who do extraordinary things be rewarded accordingly? Legendary weapons are supposed to be the best items in the game, so why should they be given to people who don't do extraordinary things to obtain them?[COLOR="red"]

    .
    Your entire argument you have presented in this thread lies on a poor foundation. You are using your own biased definition of legendary. What the term legendary provokes in a person's head will be different case by case. At best, your argument is based on your own personal biased opinions of what BC legendary weapons were like.

    You have no clue how the final quest might play out. It might take normal/heroic raiding to completely finish the wrathion quest line. This new system might dilute the player to relevant legendary ratio, but the new system is received in a positive light by many. Even guilds that would have completed a legendary in normal/heroic like these quests because it levels the playing field and there is little to no drama around who gets what.
    Last edited by MathAddict; 2013-01-18 at 08:55 PM.

  7. #467
    Dreadlord Voolawl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    Thats a good description of the state of the game as it is right now actualy.. sad but true
    Yup. I called it back at the last Blizzcon, when they announced everything, that they were streamlining content so that bad players could pretend to be at or around top tier players. This is just an example of that: making something that should actually mean Legendary available to anyone.

    Plus a cheap version of Pokemon just didn't catch my fancy. I can't say cancelling was a loss, except for maybe a couple encounters this last tier, nothing really stands out about the expansion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kissme View Post
    The problem comes when bad players expect to clear hardmode content as quickly as average or upper echelon players.
    Accept your limitations.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    Admittedly, I enjoy beer more as a beverage that I can appreciate rather then getting drunk.

  8. #468
    Deleted
    This thread should be close the title is misleading because OP has a wrong definition on the word legendary and there is no discussion in here what so ever.

  9. #469
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Why should they be easy?
    I cannot answer that question without comparing it to another legendary.

    Random.org gave 4, so I will go with the Glaives from Illidan as they were the fourth legendary weapon(set) in WoW.
    So what was hard in obtaining the Glaives?
    The answer to that is easy: Nothing.
    Getting the Glaives required no effort whatsoever besides having a high attendancy.
    As a guild you do what you were doing anyway and the player that would get them, would just have to be there.
    So was the Black Temple hard?
    Reliquary required a lot of dps, Mother needed people to farm S-res gear and the Council and Illidan had some pretty tough tactics.
    But that point is irrelevant as guilds would do that anyway.
    What we learn from this is that there is nothing special about having the Warglaives, you just had to be lucky: Any idiot can be lucky.

    So let's compare it:
    Mists of Pandaria-legendary:
    1. Listen to some babbling.
    2. 20 Sigils.
    3. Get honored.
    4. Kill the Sha.
    5. Collect 6000 Valor.
    6. Become revered.
    7. Win two Battlegrounds.
    8. Kill a boss with 130 million HP.
    And at this step you have only received a gem and a gemslot!!!

    Warglaives:
    1. Kill Illidan.

    If we cut out the stuff you'd be doing anyway as a raider, LFR or normal/heroic, we'd get to:
    MoP: Farm Reputation for Wrathion, do two Battlegrounds and kill some random outdoor boss.
    TBC: Nothing.

    So please, you keep calling this thing "easy" but what are you comparing it with?
    I've put more effort and dedication so far in this questline than in my Shadowmourne.
    I was basically about to say all of this, and you said it for me. I love you. You deserve some sort of Medal of Forum Excellence Award.

  10. #470
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    Your whole argument is complete crap because repeatedly the lore characters in the game refer to player characters as "Heros" Not Hero, not singular, PLURAL. Meaning, more than one hero can get their hands on the same legendary weapon.

    Can we agree that the "Legendary" in this expansion is just not very legendary? Its just really common because even a cave man can get one. A legendary item should be difficult to obtain. "its legend preceeds itself" It should be very cool lore wise, i agree. But it should be difficult to obtain, and only a few should ever obtain a legendary while it is relevant content.

    As for your comment about being a "special snowflake," why shouldn't people who do extraordinary things be rewarded accordingly? Legendary weapons are supposed to be the best items in the game, so why should they be given to people who don't do extraordinary things to obtain them?

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-18 at 08:21 PM ----------



    You failed to read the thread. I am not talking about TBC warglaives, im talking about current expansion "legendary" items.
    You fail to read period. Legendary weapons, in lore, are unique. Only one of each exists. Or in the case of Warglaives, TWO.

    /yourinsaneranting

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-18 at 02:34 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    Thats a good description of the state of the game as it is right now actualy.. sad but true

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-18 at 08:33 PM ----------



    Before I answer you, why should legendary items be easy to obtain, and something that everyone should have? Whats your arguement in favor of having them this way? Other than the age old "I pay $15 / 13 Euro a month, i deserve everything else that the players that spend hours achieving as well with much less effort and dedication!"
    The MoP legendaries require the same amount of time and dedication from every single player who earns them. We have to farm reputation by killing hundreds of mobs, run raids until we earn 20 sigils, then run another raid to loot the essence of the sha of fear, THEN we have to earn 6,000 valor which can only be done over 6 weeks of valor farming, as well as killing hundreds more mobs for the next step of reputation. Then we have to gather a small group of people together to kill an opposing faction mob, complete and win two battlegrounds, and we finally get our current maximum legendary reward. Next tier, we will have to farm even more.

    Whether you like to admit it, more time and dedication has to be made for these legendaries than any previous legendary. RNG isn't hard. Just as someone could farm Molten Core their whole life and never receive the eye of sulfuras, I could farm it once and get it straight away.

    Legendaries take more actual effort now than they ever have, and those willing to complete normal and heroic modes earn them FASTER than those who don't.

  11. #471
    Welfare Legendaries... ever since WOTLK legendaries lost their 'meaning'. Legendaries were rare, now they are abundant. I remember 2-3 guys on the realm having Glaives, or Thunderfury (at the content appropriate level). Never saw an Atiesh. Now? Everyone had Shadowmournes, Tarecgosa's, Fangs.... and because people seems unhappy their class didn't get a legendary at the time... here we go, legendary gems\sockets\meta gems for everyone! You don't even need to be on a raiding guild, just LFR it!

    I dislike this new legendary philosophy, but who cares.

  12. #472
    Legendary, by definition of this game, is the next level in rarity above Epic.

    Of course at this point, Epic doesn't mean anything anyway. But back when it did, purple items were less common than blues, and blues less than greens, etc. Orange items then were above Epics. Bosses dropped purple items, and a very small chance to give you an Orange. Seems to be more rare to me.


    As of now, there is nothing rare about any of this quest. No filters or choke points.

  13. #473
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythicalfury View Post
    So you have a crystal ball that shows you what the final patches legendary will be?
    N less you do ,you have no idea what the end result will be.
    For all you know the lfr end one could just be an epic weapon, whilst normal and heroic get a legendary.
    5.2 is a gem not a weapon
    No need for a crystal ball to realize that every player will be able to acquire a legendary, most likely through LFR as well. It's impossible for Blizz to go "so uhhh you farmed all this rep, gathered all these sigils, worked your way to 6k VP, great work on that. Unfortunately only hardcore raiders will be able to complete the final step and obtain the legendary."

  14. #474
    Quote Originally Posted by Voolawl View Post
    Yup. I called it back at the last Blizzcon, when they announced everything, that they were streamlining content so that bad players could pretend to be at or around top tier players. This is just an example of that: making something that should actually mean Legendary available to anyone.

    Plus a cheap version of Pokemon just didn't catch my fancy. I can't say cancelling was a loss, except for maybe a couple encounters this last tier, nothing really stands out about the expansion.
    It's quite easy to have an opinion on something you haven't played. It doesn't help you win your argument, however. If you were a hardcore raider who has cleared 16/16H or Loremaster of Pandaria, or someone who has put in even a small amount of actual playtime in the expansion, I might be interested in why you feel this expansion pales in comparison to others. But if you haven't invested time into questing, learning about the lore, raiding end game content, or ultimately experiencing the actual quality of the expansion first hand, then your opinion doesn't really hold much water.

  15. #475
    Stood in the Fire yunito's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    In fact it should be green because thats what it is if everyone can get it. Legendary items used to mean something, and it took high end raiding to obtain them. Its funny how Blizzard has totally shifted their position of it being an item of prestige and honor to where its at now...

    "Oh hey look, you dont even need to be in a raid guild to get a legendary!"

    (thought bubble) "Jaylock thinks this is terrible game design."

    Your thoughts on the "legendary" item this expansion?

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    you know they probably come out with a new color and rareity.. ANcient color red/black/green who knows

  16. #476
    Quote Originally Posted by Otiswhitaker View Post
    I was basically about to say all of this, and you said it for me. I love you. You deserve some sort of Medal of Forum Excellence Award.
    Now i do see your point yes but keep in mind the dropchanse was extremley low and clearing bt wasnt the easiest walk in the park

  17. #477
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    You'll notice in the achievement pane that most of the legendary isnt unlocked yet. Instead of having an inventory of unusable items, now we can use our quest progress.

  18. #478
    High Overlord Jakerel's Avatar
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    It's Blizzards own previous models of Legendaries that has brought this kind of thought about (in my opinion at least).

    In that past Legendaries have been something that took time and effort from the people wanting to acquire them, and they were usually only available for set a set class, spec or role. For the most part, certainly the earlier legendaries, were rare. But this was more to do with RNG restriction than, the process to acquire them (think Warglaives, or waiting for that right binding, etc). This has led to people viewing them in such a way, that now Blizzard is making a legendary for all, that will be common as muck, it's no longer legendary, but just another green you looted from that trash mob.

    It's legendary because of what you do to get it, not because only you have, or just a select few have it. And I think a quest chain that lasts the entirety of the expac is pretty legendary in itself, let alone any reward that may come from it.
    Nothing ventured, nothing gained

  19. #479
    Quote Originally Posted by Jakerel View Post
    It's Blizzards own previous models of Legendaries that has brought this kind of thought about (in my opinion at least).

    In that past Legendaries have been something that took time and effort from the people wanting to acquire them, and they were usually only available for set a set class, spec or role. For the most part, certainly the earlier legendaries, were rare. But this was more to do with RNG restriction than, the process to acquire them (think Warglaives, or waiting for that right binding, etc). This has led to people viewing them in such a way, that now Blizzard is making a legendary for all, that will be common as muck, it's no longer legendary, but just another green you looted from that trash mob.

    It's legendary because of what you do to get it, not because only you have, or just a select few have it. And I think a quest chain that lasts the entirety of the expac is pretty legendary in itself, let alone any reward that may come from it.
    You lost me when you said time and effort to acquire them.

  20. #480
    Deleted
    I don't consider this gem a 'legendary' in the say way i consider the Firelands staff as one. But i think that the amount of effort involved makes it worthy of the legendary colour. Its not like i logged in and got it 10 minutes later by doing a daily quest. More people have it simply because its available ot everyone not just a single class

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