5 reasons why Demon Hunters won't be a class in WoW

[Zoldor]

I think the DH is the most over hyped class ever. I don't care if it ever shows up. As for looking like Illidan its called transmog and most of his gear is available in some fashion sans not wearing a shirt. Wings aren't something every demon hunter has outside of Meta. So your points aren't valid beyond I think the ship sailed in BC for this class. If we do a Sargeras infernal etc expansion then maybe I could see this being the new class, but only if that expansion launches.

[loppy88]

I don't get this argument with Meta. Only Illidan had Meta and he got it after using the Skull of Gul'dan. And if I recall correctly, he became half demon in the process. Demon Hunters don't have Meta.

[Gothicshark]

I don't get this argument with Meta. Only Illidan had Meta and he got it after using the Skull of Gul'dan. And if I recall correctly, he became half demon in the process. Demon Hunters don't have Meta.

Actually All the official TBC Demon Hunters have that Ability. Example Varedis <Illidari Demon Hunter>


That was me looking at the Demon Hunters in game to see what they did in fights. and to see how they fight. I should point out he can not be killed unless you have a quest item.

[loppy88]

Actually All the official TBC Demon Hunters have that Ability. Example Varedis <Illidari Demon Hunter>


That was me looking at the Demon Hunters in game to see what they did in fights. and to see how they fight. I should point out he can not be killed unless you have a quest item.

Crappy. This is why I like blizz lore less and less. Demon Hunters hunt demons. They don't become demons themselves. Retconning is crap.

Edit: Those are Illidan's DHs. Makes sense that they have it... Player Demon Hunters shouldn't.

[Zoldor]

Crappy. This is why I like blizz lore less and less. Demon Hunters hunt demons. They don't become demons themselves. Retconning is crap.

When you hunt vile evil sometimes you have to take on the taint to be the most effective hunter. Like and Inquisitor in warhammer 40k, or a half-vampire vampire hunter. Same concept different scenario.

[ChaosWolf]

None of those are valid points.

4 is. the only reason folks give a good god-damn about demon hunters is they want to be Illidan.

[Jtree]

Crappy. This is why I like blizz lore less and less. Demon Hunters hunt demons. They don't become demons themselves. Retconning is crap.

While not game cannon (yet?), this is lifted from the wow RPG:

Later, a group of night elves, inspired by Illidan's example, made a pact to turn the Burning Legion's powers against it, fighting destruction with destruction. Obviously they could not gain their powers in the same way Illidan did, but they discovered other means. In the millennia since, other night elves, and a few creatures of other races, have made the same pact, binding demonic essence in their bodies and using it to destroy the Legion's minions.


To become a demon hunter, a hero must find a demon hunter who is willing to lead them through a series of complex rituals. These rituals involve capturing a demon and sacrificing it in order to bind a portion of its spirit inside the hero. As part of the ceremony to become a demon hunter, the initiate burns out his or her eyes with a magic blade to entrap a demonic essence within their body. Most demon hunters then bind their mutilated eyes with strips of cloth. In return for this sacrifice, the demon hunter gains the ability to see the world without vision — creatures are visible as dimly glowing forms against a gray and murky background. Demonic energy blazes like burning pitch in the night; the demon hunter sees and recognizes it easily.

[Teriz]

By having different ablities, different mechanics, different resources etc. Just like a mage distinguishes itself from a warlock. Metamorphosis doesn't mean anything. It's at its core really mostly cosmetic.

Explain these different abilities. How would they be any different than what we currently have in the game? Also stretch this concept into three distinct specs while maintaining the flavor of the DH.

See, it was easy to do this with Monks, since there was no Martial Arts class in WoW that used punches and kicks as opposed to weapons. There was also the Brewmaster WC3 hero from which you could easily develop a spec from, since BrM heroes were tanking heroes. Also no class had the Brewmaster abilities. so there would be no class conflicts. We also had an opening for a leather-wearer, which Monks could fit into. Finally it was fairly easy to devise a hybrid scheme with this class since Monks could use healing abilities, Tank via the Brewmaster template, and obviously DPS.

So doing the same for the DH should be easy right???

Also Metamorphosis is a big deal. Without Metamorphosis you don't have a Demon Hunter. Or, you don't have the Warcraft Demon Hunter that's so popular with the fans. Death Knights have every ability that the WC3 hero had, and so should Demon Hunters. Please explain how Blizzard will recreate Metamorphosis for Demon Hunters that will be different than the Warlock version...... Which is the WC3 version of Metamorphosis btw.

---------- Post added 2013-01-24 at 09:50 PM ----------

4 is. the only reason folks give a good god-damn about demon hunters is they want to be Illidan.

Exactly.

10/char

[Gothicshark]

Explain these different abilities. How would they be any different than what we currently have in the game? See, it was easy to do this with Monks, since there was no Martial Arts class in WoW that used punches and kicks as opposed to weapons. There was also the Brewmaster WC3 hero from which you could easily develop a spec from, since BrM heroes were tanking heroes. Also no class had the Brewmaster abilities. so there would be no class conflicts. We also had an opening for a leather-wearer, which Monks could fit into. Finally it was fairly easy to devise a hybrid scheme with this class since Monks could use healing abilities, Tank via the Brewmaster template, and obviously DPS.

So doing the same for the DH should be easy right???

Also Metamorphosis is a big deal. Without Metamorphosis you don't have a Demon Hunter. Or, you don't have the Warcraft Demon Hunter that's so popular with the fans. Death Knights have every ability that the WC3 hero had, and so should Demon Hunters. Please explain how Blizzard will recreate Metamorphosis for Demon Hunters that will be different than the Warlock version...... Which is the WC3 version of Metamorphosis btw.

---------- Post added 2013-01-24 at 09:50 PM ----------



Exactly.

10/char

I love how you ignore my posts which answer these questions.

Once again

Warlock Caster with pet
Demon Hunter Melee no pet

That is the tl;dr version for you.

[Jtree]

Also Metamorphosis is a big deal. Without Metamorphosis you don't have a Demon Hunter. Or, you don't have the Warcraft Demon Hunter that's so popular with the fans. Death Knights have every ability that the WC3 hero had, and so should Demon Hunters. Please explain how Blizzard will recreate Metamorphosis for Demon Hunters that will be different than the Warlock version...... Which is the WC3 version of Metamorphosis btw.

They could, for starters, make it a straight forward, damage boosting cooldown, like Avenging Wrath or Pillar of Frost, as opposed to what lock meta is now, a resource burning stance-dance. Coupled with a little graphical variation, and it will be sufficiently different to satisfy most of the player base.

[Teriz]

I love how you ignore my posts which answer these questions.

Once again

Warlock Caster with pet
Demon Hunter Melee no pet

That is the tl;dr version for you.

I was getting to your post. Be patient.

[B]Warlocks are a Pure DPS pet Caster class, with a focus on Pets and Dots. Demonology using the Tanking Build (click For Demonology Tank) is still a range casting spec, which can tank and take a hit without getting damage. DemoTanks which is something I play are tanking from the caster mind set, I have 0 white damage, and 0 need for moving unless I'm near AOE, I jump into battle and never once use stealth.

Demon Hunters are Melee Casters with Stealth, They sneak into battle from shadows they dot and curse as the auto attack with a sword in each hand. They can tank but they use Evasion and avoidance as the damage mitigation Unlike Demonology which become an unmovable rock. Demon Hunter would have to stay moving as they play, they would have to wear mail armor and would only be able to use Bladed weapons. Now I see how you might be afraid of this class since right now you tank in the same method as a Demon Hunter, however you would not be competing for gear except weapons. Since a Demon Hunter Class would come in wearing Mail, the Healing Spec would use Shaman Healing gear, the Tanking and DPS would compete with hunters for Agility Mail. This in no way would hurt anyone's game play, and if you think Monks are the best class I am sorry for you because every class is the best class. I play Warlocks, Monks, DeathKnights, Hunters, Mages, Warriors, Rogues, and Druids. -Never liked Shaman, Paladins, and Priests.

DW melee with DoTs? Sounds like a Frost Death Knight. DW with stealth and evasion? Sounds like a Rogue.

Why would they have to stay moving while they tank? The only reason Monks do that is because they're picking up healing spheres. Also a Demon Hunter tank would need a better mechanic than simply "evasion". Brewmasters use varied methods of mitigation in order to tank. So do Druids. You can't make a tanking spec based simply on "evasion", they would need other mechanics in order to make their tanking work. And before you say that's impossible, look at Brewmasters to see why Monks worked out so well. Drunken Haze and Drunken Brawler gave the perfect template for Monk tanking BEFORE Blizzard even considered the class for WoW.

Sorry but a healing Demon Hunter is a laughable concept.

Also mail armor flies in the face of Demon Hunter lore and concept. Mail is sem-heavy armor, not light armor. Demon Hunters wear light to no armor. Jf we're going to dilute the flavor of the class, why should we bother in the first place?

---------- Post added 2013-01-24 at 10:11 PM ----------

They could, for starters, make it a straight forward, damage boosting cooldown, like Avenging Wrath or Pillar of Frost, as opposed to what lock meta is now, a resource burning stance-dance. Coupled with a little graphical variation, and it will be sufficiently different to satisfy most of the player base.

Hmm, that's pretty good. However that leaves the larger problem of making Demon Hunters significantly different than the other DW classes, AND spreading their playstyle into 3 distinct specs. With Meta being a stance, that isn't as big a problem, but if Meta is just a CD, then it becomes an even bigger problem because you're going to be spending more time as the Demon Hunter.

[Deleted]

DW melee with DoTs? Sounds like a Frost Death Knight. DW with stealth and evasion? Sounds like a Rogue.

And destruction sounds like an arcane and fire mage.
Monks sound like rogues. etc

If you really don't think blizzard can make a class feel unique, surprisingly, they're game devs - it's their job. I'm fairly sure they can do it, even if you can't imagine it.

[Yig]

Nice to see the OP going in circles still. It still comes down to one thing, your opinion of demon hunters being strong enough as a theme and look to warrant fleshing them out with brand new abilities and talents tying into that theme. Everything else is just a distraction from the issue at heart.

Crappy. This is why I like blizz lore less and less. Demon Hunters hunt demons. They don't become demons themselves. Retconning is crap.

Edit: Those are Illidan's DHs. Makes sense that they have it... Player Demon Hunters shouldn't.

It's not that simple and in many ways you are absolutely wrong. Demon hunters originally can only metamorph because all hero classes are just cookie cutter reflections of their Warcraft 3 hero. Hero classes were given a vague description in the WC3 manual that made clones of those heroes make sense just enough int he lore that you could pretend you were your own unique hero similar to the named hero in lore you were patterned after.


In the Warcraft RPG manual, advanced demon hunters would over time mutate from the fel and chaos energy they use, it's like radioactive energy. They would grow longer claws and horny growths on thier skin, elbows, shoulders, etc. They would have eternally smoking cinders pouring from their ruined eye sockets.

"Some" of the demon hunters could harness this demonic energy and do something similar to Metamorphosis, but it's all a weird retcon considering why Illidan did it and what the fuck a demon hunter really even is. But it's not a retcon in the sense it was changed, it never made sense in the first place going back to Warcraft 3 considering the chicken or the egg issue.

You are totally wrong about Demon Hunters not becoming demons themselves, that's part of the price they pay to hunt them. Eventually they will mutate and lose their soul to the Twisting NEther as a demon or a slave. This is part of why they are shunned. I think full on metamorph should be retconned altogether and tossed out of their class kit as something only Illidan could do, with demon hunters just getting cosmetic choices like spikes on their skin or sinister decay. But I think too many people disagree who still love demon hunters.

In that context I think the ability to turn into a winged and horned demon is something that should be left as a talent tree option for one spec for Demon Hunters, and I think it should be cosmetically altered to be different from Warlock's metamorph. Warlocks never should have gotten the ability in the first place, it was just something that seemed cool to developers and I understand why that is but it's really messed up things. Lore wise, warlocks stole this ability from Illidan after they studied his spells in TBC. A warlock will never be a demon hunter, they simply superficially are similar. (not without a brand new melee spec)

It's up to Blizzard to flesh out demon hunters more, just as they fleshed out Monks.

To make a demon hunter seem new, they would need a number of new combat strikes and new combat animations with a brand new resource mechanic game.

Playing Darksiders 2, I think a demon hunter would look exactly like Death in action with a pair of sickles. The way he weaves in and out of range while dodging around with side flips and acrobatics, while dark shadowy fire and energy crackles around them. That's what I'd like to see. Similar to a subtlety rogue and a fury warrior.

[Teriz]

And destruction sounds like an arcane and fire mage.
Monks sound like rogues. etc

Indeed, but Destruction and Fire are just specs, not entire classes.

Also Monks sound nothing like Rogues. Monks use martial arts, brews, and chi. Rogues use Daggers, stealth, combos, and poisons. It also helps that both classes come from huge archetypes with decades of lore behind them from a variety of sources.

Demon Hunters don't have that advantage.

If you really don't think blizzard can make a class feel unique, surprisingly, they're game devs - it's their job. I'm fairly sure they can do it, even if you can't imagine it.

I never said it was impossible. Just highly unlikely due to the numerous issues I've explained.

[Yig]

I never said it was impossible. Just highly unlikely due to the numerous issues I've explained.

The thread title says "won't". Not "may not be".

[Teriz]

The thread title says "won't". Not "may not be".

Looks like someone didn't read the first paragraph in the OP;

They look cool. They have awesome looking weapons and attitudes. They're among the most popular classes in WoW. However, you're probably never going to see them appear in the game as a playable class. That's not to say that it's impossible, just HIGHLY unlikely. If Blizzard announces the Demon Hunter class at the next Blizzcon, I'll happily eat crow, and prepare to roll one late next year when the next expansion releases. However, until that unlikely event occurs, here's the 5 reasons you'll more than likely never see a Demon Hunter as a playable class in WoW.

[Gothicshark]

I was getting to your post. Be patient.



DW melee with DoTs? Sounds like a Frost Death Knight. DW with stealth and evasion? Sounds like a Rogue.

Why would they have to stay moving while they tank? The only reason Monks do that is because they're picking up healing spheres. Also a Demon Hunter tank would need a better mechanic than simply "evasion". Brewmasters use varied methods of mitigation in order to tank. So do Druids. You can't make a tanking spec based simply on "evasion", they would need other mechanics in order to make their tanking work. And before you say that's impossible, look at Brewmasters to see why Monks worked out so well. Drunken Haze and Drunken Brawler gave the perfect template for Monk tanking BEFORE Blizzard even considered the class for WoW.

Sorry but a healing Demon Hunter is a laughable concept.

Also mail armor flies in the face of Demon Hunter lore and concept. Mail is sem-heavy armor, not light armor. Demon Hunters wear light to no armor. Jf we're going to dilute the flavor of the class, why should we bother in the first place?

---------- Post added 2013-01-24 at 10:11 PM ----------



Hmm, that's pretty good. However that leaves the larger problem of making Demon Hunters significantly different than the other DW classes, AND spreading their playstyle into 3 distinct specs. With Meta being a stance, that isn't as big a problem, but if Meta is just a CD, then it becomes an even bigger problem because you're going to be spending more time as the Demon Hunter.

It is clear that you are not here for discussion, you have zero interest in sharing ideas. This whole thread is people showing proof and evidence and you saying Nope don't see that.

The basic facts are:

Next and Last class will Wear Mail Armor
Next and Last class will be a Hybrid Class Tank/Heal/DPS
Next and Last class will be a popular Player wanted Class.

You can stick your head in the sand, but the writing is on the wall which class that will be.

[Drilnos]

And destruction sounds like an arcane and fire mage.
Monks sound like rogues. etc

If you really don't think blizzard can make a class feel unique, surprisingly, they're game devs - it's their job. I'm fairly sure they can do it, even if you can't imagine it.

Making it feel unique is one thing. Making it feel unique while also making it feel like a Demon Hunter is something else entirely. This is a class with a very limited kit, and the lore aspects it does have don't mesh very well with the in-game systems. Once you've got a fellow wearing chain mail and swinging two weapons that are not glaives, you've already strayed pretty far away from what a demon hunter is supposed to be.

Of course there are ways around everything. They could make every tier set show off the chest area and make special moves transform their weapons, but both of these feel like cop-outs even just writing them down. And the problems only grow from there. At some point it has to be wondered if all the compromises between gameplay and story are actually worth the trouble. This, I'm sure, is something that's been discussed many a time down at the Blizzard offices. And the fact that this is probably the most requested class out there, and has been since Vanilla, and they know it better than anyone, and they still haven't put it in yet, says something to me about how feasible they think it is.

[Deleted]

I love how you ignore my posts which answer these questions.

Once again

Warlock Caster with pet
Demon Hunter Melee no pet

That is the tl;dr version for you.

Dark Apotheosis + Grimoire of Sacrifice = Warlock, Melee, No pet. It's not a supported playstyle now, but for a little while they were pretty much as good as any other tank in the beta. It could be viable with very little work, really.

[Gothicshark]

Dark Apotheosis + Grimoire of Sacrifice = Warlock, Melee, No pet. It's not a supported playstyle now, but for a little while they were pretty much as good as any other tank in the beta. It could be viable with very little work, really.

Since I play that style, I can assure you I do not have any auto attacks, and I do not use white damage. I can do all the tanking at range if needed. Warlock tanks are not melee, we are still casters.