It Took Our Jobs!

[mvaliz]

I speak this as a software engineer; maintenance is the largest part of any project. There's no such thing as "no more intervention".

They still will require people to maintain and manage the systems. That's part of the Venus Project.

In fact, there's a lot that people can do... and you'd be surprised how many might just volunteer to help maintain something that gives you everything you need. ^_^

[obdigore]

I speak this as a software engineer; maintenance is the largest part of any project. There's no such thing as "no more intervention".

Maintenance when us humans keep changing requirements or wanting new things.

[Roose]

This whole concept of innovation for cash is a relatively new construct. Historically, necessity fueled innovation to ease hardships, not to sell shit.

[yurano]

Utterly the other way around. A person who is programming because it is their job will do just enough to get by. A person who does it because they want to will go above and beyond that level every single time.

When someone 'works' for enjoyment, he does it how he wants. What an individual wants is not necessarily what is the most productive, innovate or valuable.

[Simca]

Ummmm... complete bullshit.

The best programmers I know do it because it's what they love. The ones you AVOID are the ones who do it for money... they'll sell you out faster and skimp on work because they don't love it.

You're both right, but it is when the two are combined (employment + enjoyment) that has the highest productivity. As for each individual concept in a vacuum? Meh.

When someone 'works' for enjoyment, he does it how he wants. What an individual wants is not necessarily what is the most productive, innovate or valuable.

Often what the individual wants is far more innovative and far less valuable (for varied reasons - sometimes a superior invention may not be able to charge customers as much).

[Rukentuts]

Maintenance when us humans keep changing requirements or wanting new things.

Because bugs never happen? Bugs are the largest expenditure in maintenance.

[mvaliz]

How many electricians and airline employees are?

...I'm not sure. Probably most of them do it for passion and enjoyment and make money while they're doing it. Nobody put a gun to their head and say "be an electrician or DIE".

[kNite]

there is a big difference in making mistakes and being lazy so as not to get or want to get a proper education or job training. If you think its a mistake you didn't get a proper education go back and get it. But if you continue to stay uneducatued and then whine you cant get jobs you dont have my sympathy.

[mvaliz]

You're both right, but it is when the two are combined (employment + enjoyment) that has the highest productivity. As for each individual concept in a vacuum? Meh.

I guess things like BitTorrent and Wikkipedia haven't produced "high productivity" then...

[Roose]

You're both right, but it is when the two are combined (employment + enjoyment) that has the highest productivity. As for each individual concept in a vacuum? Meh.

Very true. A combination of intrinsic and extrinsic motivation is ideal.

[yurano]

This whole concept of innovation for cash is a relatively new construct. Historically, necessity fueled innovation to ease hardships, not to sell shit.

Thats because modern technology has made civilization highly specialized.

No longer can a single family produce all the goods necessary to live a 'good life'. Modern civilization is highly dependent on trade.

[This name sucks]

Yes. Thomas Edison was just monkeying around with electricity passing through wires and saw an interesting effect with Hydrogen. The idea came from "hey, I wonder if..." not "hey... how much can I make if I invent..."

Same with the Wright Brothers. They simply liked building things in their garrage.

Hell man, some of the simplest and largest things came from individuals doing things out of the ordinary to try things different. Even Garlic becoming a staple of culinary cuisine was due to a group of ladies inside of an out of the way gettaway cottage where they vacationed every few months, and their rule was simple: Break every rule they can think of since they were by themselves... cooking with garlic was never heard of, and that's how it happened.

But edison didn't invent shit.

At most he got lucky and decided to try a tungsten filament before anyone else.

He stole most of his work (work, pretty much everything he ever did, not just the light bulb)

[obdigore]

Because bugs never happen? Bugs are the largest expenditure in maintenance.

Depends on how well you wrote, I guess :P

But seriously, there are going to be issues that need to be worked out, I'm not disagreeing with that. I'm saying software written to ensure everyone gets what they need and then hands out luxuries as they become available is going to take out that 'greed' component as well as replace a large group of paper-pushing jobs that our government currently assumes.

[Simca]

I guess things like BitTorrent and Wikkipedia haven't produced "high productivity" then...

I never said they haven't. But you will find higher productivity among passionate -employed- individuals in the industry than those unemployed on average.

[Roose]

there is a big difference in making mistakes and being lazy so as not to get or want to get a proper education or job training. If you think its a mistake you didn't get a proper education go back and get it. But if you continue to stay uneducatued and then whine you cant get jobs you dont have my sympathy.

Masters degree enough? All I can get are jobs selling insurance or Directv in Sam's Club. Not in computer programming though or I would have a job.

Hindsight eh

[Maxilian]

Oh, and BTW:

www.thevenusproject.com

Edited Highlights
Completely new-designed city society
Resource-based Economy - no money
Robots do menial work (from manufacturing to even building houses) - freeing people to pursue their own interests they enjoy
Resources regulated via computers - no presiding ruling government needed.
Efficient designs for all aspects of society - making all needs localized and easy to acquire for all.
Not designed to solve every problem - designed to simply be a better solution and foundation for society.

I doubt I'll see this realized in my lifetime, but I do believe this is where we're headed.

Yes, these is what i was thinking, in the end that will help a lot the society, because money will not exist anymore, food will become free (no processed food like pizza) and I WILL BE THE KING OF THE WORLD AND ALL OF YOU WILL KNEEL BEFORE ME AND BEG FOR MERCY! WUHAHAHAHHAA.... ermm, as i was saying people will do what they want to do in their life, there will be more people trying to create new things, trying to make the society even better

[yurano]

Often what the individual wants is far more innovative and far less valuable (for varied reasons - sometimes a superior invention may not be able to charge customers as much).

Innovation is the development of new customers value through solutions that meet new needs, inarticulate needs, or old customer and market needs in value adding new ways.

[mvaliz]

I never said they haven't. But you will find higher productivity among passionate -employed- individuals in the industry than those unemployed on average.

...Anonymous would like to have a word with you. :P

Yeah, I'm not believing money makes them a better programmer. All money does is give them what they want. In a society that already gives you what you want, you're then free to do your passion and will be the same net effect with the bonus of that you won't feel pressured/stressed to do your job and make shortcuts/mistakes.

[Maxilian]

Masters degree enough? All I can get are jobs selling insurance or Directv in Sam's Club. Not in computer programming though or I would have a job.

Hindsight eh

Go somewhere else you can get a job? for example: if you come to Dominican Republic with a Master degree... you will become rich (Well... at least you will get a good job and have a good life)

[Rukentuts]

Masters degree enough? All I can get are jobs selling insurance or Directv in Sam's Club. Not in computer programming though or I would have a job.

Hindsight eh

Depends on what you got it in. Many fields have reputably low demand yet a plethora of students still pursue them anyway.